False Muzzle

[xbr]

I'm looking a building a bench rifle. I look a track of the wolf site and the goodien barrels. I don't understand what a lock collar is on a false muzzle. Can anyone help me on this? Is a false muzzle worth the extra money?

Thanks xbr, new guy.

 

[BrownBear]

From what I've seen of ML benchrest shooting over the years, you can just about forget competition if you don't have the false muzzle. It ligns the bullet up precisely with the bore for seating. As I understand it, the lock collar holds the false muzzle in place while you're loading.

 

[bob308]

the lock collor holds the false muzzle on the barrel. then some are made with a toggle type rammer that hooks to the f-m.

if you can get a copy of
the muzzle-loading cap lock rifle
by ned h. roberts

there is a lot about the false muzzle and target shooting in that book.

 

[crossstick1948]

You can compete quite well in the light bench and cross-stick matches without a false muzzle. I do and shoot as well as anyone. I use a goodien offhand barrel, drum and nipple and a manton lock assembled by myself. The advantage of a false muzzle for round ball shooting is you can use a tighter ball patch combination. For example I use a .490 ball and .18 telfon patching in a 50 cal barrel. Jim Goodien makes a light bench barrel which uses a .490 ball, 18 or 20 thousands patching in a 48 cal barrel. To get the highest velocity you then should use a sealed ignition otherwise you will be burning out nipples. My low tech gun uses 80 grains of 3f swiss. A false muzzle barrel light bench or cross-stick gun will shoot 120 grains of 3f swiss. The main advantage is the increased velocity which reduces (I think) the effect of wind. The locking collar holds the false muzzle on the rifle while you are loading. It is not necessary. One of the more interesting aspects of shooting a rifle with a false muzzle is the sport of locating the muzzle down range after forgetting to remove it.

Slug guns use a false muzzle to center the slug (bullet) while loading, the same for shutzen shooters. Long range rifles, Whitworth, rigby, Gibbs use a bullet smaller than the lands and don't require a false muzzle. Harry Pope and his contempories used a false muzzle on their cartridge rifles. They didn't trust the breach loaders to align the bullet properly so they loaded their cartridge rifles from the muzzle.

False muzzles are another aspect of the game but they won't make a mediocre shooter a good shooter. They might add 1-2 points to a 200 point aggregate.
Pete

 

[xbr]

I appreciate your input. I've been shooting a couple 40 cal gm barrels in Lyman GPR's the last 5 years or so. I really like them. However, when the wind picks up they clean my clock with the 50's & 54's, thus my thought of building a heavy gun for wind at 50yds and everyday 100 yd target. I've talk to guy at various shoots about it and get the same response. Those that use them like them and those that don't use them don't feel you really need them if you load carefully.

Agian, thank for your help.

 

[TANSTAAFL]

One of the more interesting aspects of shooting a rifle with a false muzzle is the sport of locating the muzzle down range after forgetting to remove it.

Most false muzzles I have seen, had a sight block sticking up to prevent such.

 

[wulf]

My fist experience with BP came at the Burbank
muzzle loaders range in Saugus C.A. where i expected everyone to be in buckskin clothes.Wrong.
They wore all their dress stuff no longer good for
dress..They also knew what they were doing..Many
heavy target guns and with the false muzzles.All were underhammer. These gentlemen could put five
pickets or suger loaf slugs in almost the same hole at 100 yds [because that was only how long the range was at that time. They even used a funnel with a long tube so it would drop powder at the breech..When they would call over this young guy[at the time] and show me their group,I
would point out that they missed the bull..That
got a grunt and they tried to explain that they
weren't trying to hit the damn bull but to shoot
a "group". That is what was most important thing
but in my Kentucky type of shooting..I just could
not see their interest...These guys were GOOD.
Scopes and everything invented was employed..They
even used modern primers in a special nipple arrangement.....They did the work,,,and got the results.

 

[jarrowood]

i have been competing in bench comp. for many years and all my guns had a false muzzle untill this spring. over the winter i built a 54cal full stock flint bench gun with a 1 1/2 octagon green mountain barrel. i used the gun until october when i started having problems with the barrel twisting in the stock every time i pulled the trigger on a 180grs of 2f. but anyway my flint bench does not have a false muzzle and a the Pa territorial shoot i scored a 192 out of 200 and a few X's with it. the reason for using a false muzzle is to help load a over size ball and patch. the other reason is so when the false muzzle is removed the front of the barrel is perfectly flat allowing the gasses to leave the barrel evenly around the back of the ball. but if you take the time to do a good job crowning the barrel the gun should shoot just as well the only thing is that you will not be able to start a over sized ball and a heavy patch with out tearing patches.
good luck
john

 

[wulf]

John..I found that if I didn't hold my 54 cal
Kentucky tight I could feel a twist..The ball want
ing to go straight out caused the rifling to
straighten out half as much.....I think....also
some of the old guys used paper cross patches.
The top of the false muzzle was milled with an X
to cross them in...That is an art I never got into
Mustly Kentuckys but I did make several wheel locks and Miquelets annnnnnd a snaphaunce lock..

 

[jarrowood]

here is some pic's of my bench gun.

[/img]

 

[wulf]

That sure looks like it could do the job well.
A flint lock false muszzle loader????That would
even impress the old boys I shot with..Good for you...