Family Wall Hanger

[NipplPic]

This old fowler/musket came out of my wife's grandfather's attic about 50 years ago in Long Island, NY. I alway wrote it off as a reproduction art piece because I couldn't find any identifying marks without tearing it apart which I was reluctant to do. I recently used a little fine steel wool and found "Daniel Cross & Co" on the lock side plate.
I haven't found much info on the maker other than they made militia arms and pistols. I wish to know more as the gun is a family heirloom. I'm hoping some of the experts can further enlighten me.
It is a smooth bore. Perhaps Flint converted to percussion. Thank you in advance.

 

[Phil Coffins]

I would venture a guess that it has always been a percussion because of the single lock screw and no extra holes in the lock for a frizzen. How is the under rib attached, rivets, screws or soldered? Over all a very nice gun and a wonderful piece of the family.

 

[mushka]

That is indeed a really great looking old fowler, keep on displaying it.

 

[Loja man]

I’m stuck by how short the stock is compared to the barrel on this one!

 

[SDSmlf]

Nice family heirloom. Looks like you are on the way to understanding who manufactured it.

One suggestion I have is to please put down the steel wool. While it helps you see what’s under that crust of patina, steel wool removes stuff you can’t put back. One way to bring out any engraving or stamping is to use a piece of old chalkboard chalk like they used when many of us were in school. When rubbed over the metal surface, the chalk helps make any markings much more visible, and it’s easily cleaned up leaving no evidence anything was done. As an example, both the following photographs were taken at about the same distance with the same camera and lighting (handheld, so slight difference). Difference is that before the second photograph chalk was rubbed into the engraving. Believe you can see that one is significantly easier to read than the other. No other adjustments or funny business between the two photographs.

 

[NipplPic]

Nice family heirloom. Looks like you are on the way to understanding who manufactured it.

One suggestion I have is to please put down the steel wool. While it helps you see what’s under that crust of patina, steel wool removes stuff you can’t put back. One way to bring out any engraving or stamping is to use a piece of old chalkboard chalk like they used when many of us were in school. When rubbed over the metal surface, the chalk helps make any markings much more visible, and it’s easily cleaned up leaving no evidence anything was done. As an example, both the following photographs were taken at about the same distance with the same camera and lighting (handheld, so slight difference). Difference is that before the second photograph chalk was rubbed into the engraving. Believe you can see that one is significantly easier to read than the other. No other adjustments or funny business between the two photographs.
View attachment 130341View attachment 130342

Thank you for the advice. I resisted using the 4-0000 wool for 30 years. Finally just couldn't take it anymore especially when I saw the feint marking on the lock. I'll use your method for any other marking I discover.

 

[NipplPic]

That is indeed a really great looking old fowler, keep on displaying it.

Thank you!

 

[NipplPic]

I would venture a guess that it has always been a percussion because of the single lock screw and no extra holes in the lock for a frizzen. How is the under rib attached, rivets, screws or soldered? Over all a very nice gun and a wonderful piece of the family.

Thank you. The under rib appears to be soldered/welded.

 

[toot]

Nice family heirloom. Looks like you are on the way to understanding who manufactured it.

One suggestion I have is to please put down the steel wool. While it helps you see what’s under that crust of patina, steel wool removes stuff you can’t put back. One way to bring out any engraving or stamping is to use a piece of old chalkboard chalk like they used when many of us were in school. When rubbed over the metal surface, the chalk helps make any markings much more visible, and it’s easily cleaned up leaving no evidence anything was done. As an example, both the following photographs were taken at about the same distance with the same camera and lighting (handheld, so slight difference). Difference is that before the second photograph chalk was rubbed into the engraving. Believe you can see that one is significantly easier to read than the other. No other adjustments or funny business between the two photographs.
View attachment 130341View attachment 130342

notice it was a play of words on a famous name- WESLEY RICHARDS- they used W. RICHARDS. that was done a lot back in the day. not the same gun maker.

 

[SamTex1949]

I alway wrote it off as a reproduction art piece

OH no you got the real deal there ! If you feel confident in skills to disassemble to find more go for it , just be careful and as stated dont do to much to remove the patina . As stated also the lock doesnt appear to be a reworked flintlock, but the hammer does look as it was a crude replacement . either way it is a great looking firearm !

 

[hawkeye2]

It's possible the hammer is a replacement. There is a washer between it and the lock plate and it seems too thin to match the nut holding it on. The bottom butt plate screw is a replacement. An unusual nipple with the rings machined in it. Overall an attractive piece.

 

[NipplPic]

OH no you got the real deal there ! If you feel confident in skills to disassemble to find more go for it , just be careful and as stated dont do to much to remove the patina . As stated also the lock doesnt appear to be a reworked flintlock, but the hammer does look as it was a crude replacement . either way it is a great looking firearm !

Thanks

 

[NipplPic]

It's possible the hammer is a replacement. There is a washer between it and the lock plate and it seems too thin to match the nut holding it on. The bottom butt plate screw is a replacement. An unusual nipple with the rings machined in it. Overall an attractive piece.

Thank you

 

[SDSmlf]

notice it was a play of words on a famous name- WESLEY RICHARDS- they used W. RICHARDS. that was done a lot back in the day. not the same gun maker.

Well that’s a big disappointment….. Good thing I only paid the wall hanger price for it. Some folks do get excited about it when they see that name. One guy I know still thinks I have a valuable gun made by Wesley R.

It just seemed like a good example of showing how chalk can bring out hard to see markings.

 

[smoothshooter]

notice it was a play of words on a famous name- WESLEY RICHARDS- they used W. RICHARDS. that was done a lot back in the day. not the same gun maker.

Wasn’t the more famous and desirable name WESTLEY ( with a T ) RICHARDS ?

 

[smoothshooter]

This old fowler/musket came out of my wife's grandfather's attic about 50 years ago in Long Island, NY. I alway wrote it off as a reproduction art piece because I couldn't find any identifying marks without tearing it apart which I was reluctant to do. I recently used a little fine steel wool and found "Daniel Cross & Co" on the lock side plate.
I haven't found much info on the maker other than they made militia arms and pistols. I wish to know more as the gun is a family heirloom. I'm hoping some of the experts can further enlighten me.
It is a smooth bore. Perhaps Flint converted to percussion. Thank you in advance.
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I think the hammer is an old replacement. Lock too.
Hammer and lock plate came from two other guns.
The rest of the gun was probably originally a flintlock. Not many half-stock long guns were originally flinters.
Maybe your gun was originally a full-stock that was shortened and the rib added.
Very nice old gun, though.

 

[NipplPic]

I think the hammer is an old replacement. Lock too.
Hammer and lock plate came from two other guns.
The rest of the gun was probably originally a flintlock. Not many half-stock long guns were originally flinters.
Maybe your gun was originally a full-stock that was shortened and the rib added.
Very nice old gun, though.

Thank you

 

[Flintlock1640]

The lock was certainly flint originally. The barrel strikes me as possibly older too. The rest is certainly last half 19th century. Probably last quarter.

 

[NipplPic]

The lock was certainly flint originally. The barrel strikes me as possibly older too. The rest is certainly last half 19th century. Probably last quarter.

Thank you Sir!

 

[NorthFork]

Fantastic fowler sir! And no, it is not a reproduction replica. I believe it is an original. Possibly with some repairs/alterations, but an original non the less.