First black powder rifle, headed to the range.

[Mooney 78865]

I'd love to try some of the rifles I have that are specifically for Match Shooting like my Pedersoli Tryon, I'm like, I have rifles used by European Match Champions made by Pedersoli for competition shooting and I haven't ever used them in any competition

Get out there! There seems to be a much larger BP community back east than there is out here on the Left Coast. I've spent more than a couple hours looking for BP events, reenacting and so on , and have only come up with a couple events, and they are 200 miles away. Maybe they are just a bit more obscure and I'll get some more information tomorrow.

 

[Stantheman86]

Get out there! There seems to be a much larger BP community back east than there is out here on the Left Coast. I've spent more than a couple hours looking for BP events, reenacting and so on , and have only come up with a couple events, and they are 200 miles away. Maybe they are just a bit more obscure and I'll get some more information tomorrow.

I think PA has at least one dedicated Muzzleloading club that hosts events. I'm not even sure it exists anymore, I'll have to look

 

[Mooney 78865]

I think PA has at least one dedicated Muzzleloading club that hosts events. I'm not even sure it exists anymore, I'll have to look

I think that between Covid and the cancel culture that seems to predominate out here, there are a number of events that have been swept under the rug so to speak. At least as far as reenacting. Thankfully, the Fresno/Clovis area has a vibrant range to shoot at. And apparently an active Muzzle Loader community, as well as Cowboy Action Shooting.
A couple months ago I knew nothing about this stuff. Who knows what I'll know in a couple more months....

 

[Mooney 78865]

Made it out to the range for the first time today. Set up at 100 yards and started off with 45 grains of FFFg Goex, .577 Rapine 468 grain rounds. As you can see, 45 grains was a bit high. I reduced it to 43, then to 40 grains and started hitting in the black. Not as much pull to the right either. I must be starting to do something right (or left as it were) because I'm not pulling to the right nearly as much as I was in the beginning.
Spent the better part of 6 hours playing with different loads and sight pictures. I'd shoot 3 rounds, walk out and see where I was hitting and so on. That wasn't bad in the beginning because I was the only shooter on that range. As people started to show up I was waiting a bit for a "cold" range before I could check the target. Finally one of the other shooters said they rented spotting scopes if I wanted. And I wanted, after the 5th or 6th trip out and back I was about done with that!
All in all a good day. Going out again Friday, this time with paper cartridges and a box of baby wipes. Can't believe how messy I am stuffing lubed rounds down a barrel....

 

[dave951]

Made it out to the range for the first time today. Set up at 100 yards and started off with 45 grains of FFFg Goex, .577 Rapine 468 grain rounds. As you can see, 45 grains was a bit high. I reduced it to 43, then to 40 grains and started hitting in the black. Not as much pull to the right either. I must be starting to do something right (or left as it were) because I'm not pulling to the right nearly as much as I was in the beginning.
Spent the better part of 6 hours playing with different loads and sight pictures. I'd shoot 3 rounds, walk out and see where I was hitting and so on. That wasn't bad in the beginning because I was the only shooter on that range. As people started to show up I was waiting a bit for a "cold" range before I could check the target. Finally one of the other shooters said they rented spotting scopes if I wanted. And I wanted, after the 5th or 6th trip out and back I was about done with that!
All in all a good day. Going out again Friday, this time with paper cartridges and a box of baby wipes. Can't believe how messy I am stuffing lubed rounds down a barrel....

View attachment 88086

A word of advice dialing in a musket. Shoot at 50yds first. Get the thing shooting tight, then work on distance. There ain't any law saying 100yd is the best distance to start with.

 

[Mooney 78865]

Copy

 

[hawkeye2]

You are trying to adjust the elevation by lowering the powder charge. What you need to do is find the charge that gives the smallest group and then modify the front sight to move the group to the X ring. It involves a taller front sight. As Dave says dial it in at 50 and I recommend sighting it at that range too. You can modify one of the rear sight leaves to get a 100 yard zero later.

 

[Mooney 78865]

You are trying to adjust the elevation by lowering the powder charge. What you need to do is find the charge that gives the smallest group and then modify the front sight to move the group to the X ring. It involves a taller front sight. As Dave says dial it in at 50 and I recommend sighting it at that range too. You can modify one of the rear sight leaves to get a 100 yard zero later.

Ok, So basically aim at the same point on the target irrespective of the POI, adjust the powder to get the smallest group, THEN once that is consistent I will need to modify the sights? Yes?
Out of curiosity, how would I make the front sight taller? Replace it?

 

[hawkeye2]

Yes, that's the way. Depending on the configuration of the front sight it could be easy to modify or you can search for a taller replacement from one of the sutlers. A lot of them soft solder on after removing the front sight and you can adjust the windage while doing it.

 

[Mooney 78865]

Yes, that's the way. Depending on the configuration of the front sight it could be easy to modify or you can search for a taller replacement from one of the sutlers. A lot of them soft solder on after removing the front sight and you can adjust the windage while doing it.

Sounds like the learning curve continues...

 

[Stantheman86]

If it hits high even with "half sighting " or "quarter sighting " I'd just follow the old advice "Hold Low Dammit!" Unless you really need a taller sight.

Those groups are excellent, whatever you're doing is working. I use 100 yards as a baseline and if it hits high it will be on at 200

I'm building a little target set for my P53 with little glass bottles for powder charges and boxes for prelubed Minies.

The only time I normally shoot long guns at 50 yards is if it's something without rifling but sometimes I'll shoot my Musketoons at shorter ranges.

.69 Flintlock at about 30 yards today just for fun. Totally capable of hitting to 100 yards

 

[Britsmoothy]

Get any lower than 40gns and one day one of those minies will come back at yer!
Seems something is wrong elsewhere if you gotta come that low.

 

[Stantheman86]

I'd just start by holding with the tip of the front blade just visible in the notch

Hitting high is by design . I removed the slider on my P-H P53 to bring it down just a hair . I figured I won't have to worry about using the "steps" or the ladder if it's pretty much at a 0-300 zero depending on my sight picture. My range ends at 300 yards anyway and except for pot shots at swingers I usually shoot to 200 max

 

[Mooney 78865]

Get any lower than 40gns and one day one of those minies will come back at yer!
Seems something is wrong elsewhere if you gotta come that low.

With 50 grains of Pyrodex at 50 yards I was getting this grouping, with my POA 8" below center. This was early on, maybe the 2nd or 3rd time firing the rifle.

I may have jumped too soon to 100 yards and should have worked harder on the grouping and the sight picture before fiddling with the powder. That said, I have switched to FFFg Goex.
So for Friday I'll shoot 50 yards and start the powder load process over. Starting from where I'm at at 40 grains and move up from there.
I should pick up a bench rest as well. Shooting with my elbows on the table probably isn't the steadiest platform.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I don't want to come across negative or rain on your parade but would;
a; check the breach is sat down on the stock channel with no void underneath and or just sitting on the tang and;
b; make sure the nipple bolster is not sitting down on the lock plate. If it is get filing the lock plate for some clearance.
With such work I've made smoothbores shoot tighter friend.

 

[dave951]

One other thing to look at is the bedding of the tang and the torque on the tang screw. Too deep inletting will cause the tang to warp the barrel a bit. Too shallow and the barrel bands can cause the same effect.

Good call Brit

 

[Mooney 78865]

I don't want to come across negative or rain on your parade but would;
a; check the breach is sat down on the stock channel with no void underneath and or just sitting on the tang and;
b; make sure the nipple bolster is not sitting down on the lock plate. If it is get filing the lock plate for some clearance.
With such work I've made smoothbores shoot tighter friend.

Thanks for the tips! And you aren't raining on my parade! I am positive there is no void beneath the breach and that the breach/barrel is down on the channel and not resting on the tang. I just looked at the lock plate and nipple bolster to confirm there is clearance, and there is.
I don't ruffle easy, especially when asking for help. I'll get there. May take a bit, but the more I shoot, the more I learn, the more I learn, the better I'll shoot.
EDIT: Just now reading dave951's post, I'm headed out to the garage and recheck the tang....

 

[Stantheman86]

Your accuracy is 100% well within spec and then some, I'd be more than happy with that. If I shot that group that's in the black at 100 with my P53, I'd be done, wouldn't touch anything. There's nothing wrong with that rifle in my opinion.


This is just me but I feel that shooting rifles at 50 yards is fine for getting a feel for where it hits , 100 is kinda the "bread and butter" distance where you find out what the rifle can do but you really have to let these rifles stretch their legs out to 200-300 at some point to test yourself and the rifle. Consistently shooting a Rifle-Musket at 50 is like buying a GTO and going 45mph in it all the time.

I have a Volunteer rifle and I feel like shooting it at 100 is almost point blank range for that thing , it's made to go long.

Some guys shoot rifles at 25 yards and I'm like, you might as well just fix bayonets and stab the target

 

[Mooney 78865]

Thanks for the tips! And you aren't raining on my parade! I am positive there is no void beneath the breach and that the breach/barrel is down on the channel and not resting on the tang. I just looked at the lock plate and nipple bolster to confirm there is clearance, and there is.
I don't ruffle easy, especially when asking for help. I'll get there. May take a bit, but the more I shoot, the more I learn, the more I learn, the better I'll shoot.
EDIT: Just now reading dave951's post, I'm headed out to the garage and recheck the tang....

SOOO!
I'm not sure how to explain this but here goes. I removed the tang screw and barrel bands, removed the barrel, then reinstalled. This time instead of putting the bands on then tightening the tang screw, I snugged the tang screw (snugged, not tightened) and went to install the bands. Sure enough, the barrel wasn't laying in the stock. Tight at the rear, but as you came forward I could squeeze the the barrel and stock together the further I came to the muzzle. Loosing the tang screw a couple turns allowed the barrel to lay completely flat again.
My thought is when I glass bed the barrel I had only used the tang screw for positioning the barrel, never tightening it up. When I clean the rifle, I install the bands then tighten the screw last. Looking at the bedding I'm not seeing any "hot" spots where the barrel has been working, nor around the breach. That said, it appears that when tightening the tang screw it is putting tension on the breach/barrel. So, a small project tonight..
Really good tip you guys, appreciated! Now I'm REALLY looking forward to Friday...

 

[dave951]

SOOO!
Sure enough, the barrel wasn't laying in the stock. Tight at the rear, but as you came forward I could squeeze the the barrel and stock together the further I came to the muzzle. Loosing the tang screw a couple turns allowed the barrel to lay completely flat again.

Bingo, tang was inlet too far. Torquing it down will induce a "bow" in the barrel and the more torque the worse the accuracy and repeatability problems. When properly bedded, it should lay flat as the tang screw is torqued. BTW, ALL of my competition muskets are glass bedded, even the smoothbore.