first flintlock

[JimKok]

Hello All
I was wondering if you all could help me am looking for my first flintlock just to shoot for fun and maybe some local competition I was looking at the tradition mountain men or the woodsmen I was wondering what you all thought about those two I would like to find one with the old style sights on them like the CVA Bobcat I have has any suggestion would be greatfull Thanks

 

[Zonie]

Before getting totally hooked on flintlocks, be sure you can get real black powder.

The synthetic modern black powder substitutes work poorly by themselves as a main powder charge and almost not at all in the pan as the priming.

Although many will say real black powder can be ordered on the web or by phone (and their right), when you add the Hazardous Material fee to the cost of the powder + shipping it can be very expensive in small quantities.

Your local gun dealer(s) can't have real black powder out on a shelf. They must keep it locked up so be sure to talk to the store owner or manager when you ask about it.
(The clerks often don't know they even have it.)

 

[JimKok]

Thank-You for that information on the powder I thought you would be able to use either one with no problems

 

[azmntman]

Either of those would be decent starter flintlocks. I would look for used in good condition. As for the powder Zonnie is correct. HOWEVER if you can score a single pound of 3f powder you can use it to "prime" the breech. Simply pour 10 grains of real 3f down the barrel followed by your main charge (less 10 gr) of Pyrodex or other synthetic. Then you prime the pan with real black and it will fire reliably. So that single pound of powder can last you MANY shots (at 13 gr a pop). It is a bit of a hassle but I did this for years hording my real black until I learned we can order via Fed-Ex.

 

[Don Steele]

Hello Jim,
If you are starting out in blackpowder/muzzleloader shooting, I'm going to recommend that you take advantage of some local knowledge to learn, before you start buying rifles.
You have a couple of options near you.
I found these in the latest issue of "Muzzle Blasts", the monthly magazine of the National Muzzleloading Rifle Association (NMLRA).
Treaty Oak Longrifles, Jacksonville, FL. shoot 2nd Saturday monthly.
Brushy Creek Muzzleloaders Valdosta, GA shoot 4th Sunday monthly.
My point is, a day spent at one of those shoots will provide more information, and even hands-on experience than a year chatting on a forum.
I've shot the matches at Brushy Creek, good bunch of folks who will help an interested beginner along.

 

[cotcrab]

accessories will run you more than the rifle. A perfect example is a regular pistol or rifle. You end up buying eye/ear protection, targets, range bag, patches, solvents etc...Then you find other items that you prefer. Do your homework before you buy anything.
As far as powder 5 lbs will run you about $160 to $170 out the door. Approximately $34 per pound. You get about 70 to 100 shots per pound. it depends on your load.
So if you compare powder to a box of bullets 50 45's is about $28-$34. But you can have the gunpowder delivered fedex to a fedex store or your door.

 

[Col. Batguano]

You may wish to find out if there is a Muzzle loading shooting club in your area. Often times those members go in on a 25 or 50 pound shipment and distribute it among themselves, making the haz mat and shipping fees much more affordable on a per pound basis.

 

[vulture]

Just a quick note on black powder. Used to walk into most sporting goods stores locally and buy it off the shelf, back in the 70's, early 80's but those days are gone. No one in my area sells the stuff, too much trouble to store, so I order mine from Powder Inc., you have to buy a minimum of 5 lbs. but you can mix grades and brands, what ever you want and the per pound price includes shipping and hazmat so you know exactly where you stand when you place your order. If you are going to shoot primarily 2f and want 3f or 4f for priming then I would order 4 lbs. of 2 and one lb. of 3 or 4, a pound will go a long way if all you are using it for is priming. The initial cost is a bit stiff but I haven't found a source that was really any cheaper. Good luck.

 

[MSW]

my two cents worth: beware!

shooting flint is highly habit forming - much more so than fixed case cartridge or even cap lock. If you start down this road, you may soon be regaling you co- workers with stories involving sharp little bits of stone ... they will think you quite eccentric, but actually it's them - they just don't get it ... poor buggers ...

as a practical matter, you should take a look around some websites and see what is available in your price range. you could do much worse than a GPR - style from Thompson Center or Lyman (it's how many of us came to the addiction).

other stuff you will need ...

eye and hearing protection
patch material
ball
flints
flint leather
cleaning stuff
patch lube (secret recipe available)
targets
staple gun w/ staples
powder
misc. tools (to tighten cock screw and disassemble gun if necessary, for cleaning)
son on and so on ... don't forget kitchen sink

as regards which powder you should buy, I would council restrain until you work up a load which works best in your gun. This will usually mean a 3F for fifty caliber and below, and a 2F for .54 and above, but that's much more a recommendation than a rule.

the best accessory I've ever purchased is Mr. Schoultz method - here's a link:
http://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

read this through a few times before you take your gun to the range ... it is leaned to percussion, but the method also works well in flint.

in my opinion, you don't need 4F to prime your gun unless you are hunting in very humid weather or unless you are a world class shooter... save your hard earned, over taxed, God entrusted dollars for a pound on you usual grade (3F or 2F) and do more practice.

By the way, there are 7000 grains to a pound. But the 'grains' referred to in muzzle loading is a volumetric measurement, so you don't necessarily get an exact equivalent (but it's pretty close).

Free advice, and doubtless well worth the cost

 

[tenngun]

What are you planing to do with the gun. Should you want to do some sort of living history you will need a correct arm. Should you just want to get a gun just to learn a flint lock you can go with a less correct gun.
The GPR in flintlock is a great starter. It’s not historically correct gun, but has a very good look, functions well and shoots well. It can be gotten very affordability.
Some correct looking guns such as loyalist arms guns are smoothbores and that brings on a new learning curve. The next step up is to the pedi rifles, more correct then the GPR and good guns. The top is the simi custom and custom rifles at 2-8 times the price of the GPR and the choices can be limited if you want your gun tomorrow, or with in shipping time.
Keep in mind that once smoke stars blowing in your face nothing else will satisfies in the woods or range. Your first won’t be your last.

 

[Grenadier1758]

Good point for pointing out the need for the use of a volumetric powder measure. Most volume measures are calibrated for 2fg black powder. They will be pretty close for 3fg, but with 3f being smaller in grain size, there will be more weight grains in a 3fg volume. One of the reasins to recommend about 10% less 3fg volume than a 2fg measure.

Get the 30 to 120 grain volume measure with 5 grain increments and a funnel to pour the charge down the barrel.

 

[MSW]

Disappointed to see that Track of the Wolf no longer lists them... here's one from Cabella's: https://www.cabelas.com/product/CV...83&gclid=CMGRj-XZvNoCFcrGswods2IHvA&gclsrc=ds

I've had mine for several decades ... can't remember where I bought it.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Disappointed to see that Track of the Wolf no longer lists them... here's one from Cabella's: https://www.cabelas.com/product/CV...83&gclid=CMGRj-XZvNoCFcrGswods2IHvA&gclsrc=ds

I've had mine for several decades ... can't remember where I bought it.

That style has been around since Boone was a baby. I'm sure someone still sells them. Try Ted Cash.

 

[Ames]

And try Graf & sons for powder. 5 lbs was $120 delivered on my last order.

 

[In Over My Head]

You might like this measure and funnel setup. The funnel pivots down instead of to the side.
https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/178/1/MA-120
https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/1231/1/MAF

 

[AZbpBurner]

You might like this measure and funnel setup. The funnel pivots down instead of to the side.
https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/178/1/MA-120
https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/1231/1/MAF[/quote]
When my Dad built his .40 cal. rifle in 1970, the swivel funnel was what he got. Works well, but a little awkward. I have the measure & the rifle today.

However, I prefer this type over the swivel funnel: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tradition...765448&hash=item35f1ef0a35:g:UuYAAOSwHjNV-znw

Of course, for .54 and larger, the straight measure without funnel works fine & carries easier.

 

[shdwlkr]

the two measures I have used for decades are https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/85/1/MAS-050 https://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/85/1/MAS-120
never had an issue with either