flint and frizzen

[Commodore Swab]

Miquelets typically have a frizzen like yours. They destroy more modern knapped flints. Whats goin on on the inside of the barrel where the ramrod keeper is?

 

[Commodore Swab]

Looking closer, the lock looks new and never sparked. The sear and bridle remind me of a number of the Japanese pistols ive torn apart over the years. It wouldn't surprise me if the frizzen is a lower quality steel and would require a compound to spark. I would also be suspect of the strength of the mainspring.

 

[waksupi]

I would have that barrel tested to find out the alloy before firing. I suspect this was made as a wall hanger, and the barrel may of pot metal.

 

[M. De Land]

Frizzen is 3/4 wide . Inside barrel diameter looks like .481 ... frizzen looks bad . I know ill need leather and flint to shoot it . Where would i locate the right frizzen ? Springs look good . It cocks and locks . Inside barrel has some gouges near the muzzle but otherwise clean inside . I put alot of elbow grease in this one .

Looks like it will clean up fine. I know this is heresy but I've never owned or used a spring vise in the 40 plus years since graduating gunsmith school, built many springs from spring stock and to date never broken one from handling in assembly or disassembly . My tool of choice has been hawk billed , leather lined, adjustable vice grip pliers !
Spring vices are marvelous tools but one needs a set of about 3 to 4 of various sizes to fit all occasions where one pair of the leather padded vice grips will handle all of them.

 

[Tin sandwich]

I dont think the barrel is pot metal .... its heavy steel . I polished up the bore . The roughness only extended about an inch down . The rest of bore looks nice . I have no idea who had it before me . Ill report back when parts get here .

 

[Tin sandwich]

Flints came in .... cant get a spark . Flint hits halfway up and fails to open frizzen all the way . Flint is wrapped and set against screw . I think i should have went with a 1 inch flint instead of 3/4 . If i do go with a 1 inch then the flint edge will shoot past the pan quench . The flint also breaks off small pieces when it hits . Probably a poor quality lock . Im no expert for sure . Thought it was cool and hoped it would fire . Any tips to try ? Im not spending any more money on it . Ill try the larger flint and if that fails ill display it . Seems like it should fire though .

 

[Commodore Swab]

Flints came in .... cant get a spark . Flint hits halfway up and fails to open frizzen all the way . Flint is wrapped and set against screw . I think i should have went with a 1 inch flint instead of 3/4 . If i do go with a 1 inch then the flint edge will shoot past the pan quench . The flint also breaks off small pieces when it hits . Probably a poor quality lock . Im no expert for sure . Thought it was cool and hoped it would fire . Any tips to try ? Im not spending any more money on it . Ill try the larger flint and if that fails ill display it . Seems like it should fire though .

Geometry issues most likely dealing with the toe of the frizzen. If its leaving gouges on the frizzen face the frizzen needs hardening. Also your frizzen spring is probably too strong in relation to the main spring.

 

[wiscoaster]

...Any tips to try ?....

I'm presuming you already tried mounting the flint both ways?

 

[Tin sandwich]

Yeah ive tried several ways .... I personally dont think this gun was made to be fired .

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Frizzen is 3/4 wide . Inside barrel diameter looks like .481 ... frizzen looks bad . I know ill need leather and flint to shoot it . Where would i locate the right frizzen ? Springs look good . It cocks and locks . Inside barrel has some gouges near the muzzle but otherwise clean inside . I put alot of elbow grease in this one .

Loving that grooved frizzen!

 

[Commodore Swab]

Yeah ive tried several ways .... I personally dont think this gun was made to be fired .

This was a non functional toy my son got for his birthday. A couple hours in the shop and it now goes bang for him. Not as reliable as I would like but not bad, maybe 8 out of 10 shots. It took much more than a simple flint but is good to go now.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Looks like it will clean up fine. I know this is heresy but I've never owned or used a spring vise in the 40 plus years since graduating gunsmith school, built many springs from spring stock and to date never broken one from handling in assembly or disassembly . My tool of choice has been hawk billed , leather lined, adjustable vice grip pliers !
Spring vices are marvelous tools but one needs a set of about 3 to 4 of various sizes to fit all occasions where one pair of the leather padded vice grips will handle all of them.

seem,s reasonable....

 

[Tin sandwich]

Hey swab man, what all did you have to do ? The reason i think this was a replica is the muzzle has score marks a perfect 3/4 inch deep round . " a plugged muzzle " maybe ? The mainspring is is non removable . Its either epoxied or spot welded in . Ive used a mainspring vise and vise clamps and its not budgeing . Plus yhe geometrix of hammer and frizzen seem crude at best . Im new at flintlocks and this gun peeked my interest . I own and shoot seversl percushions and want to invest in a "shooting " flinter . Im pretty mechanically inclined but not willing to put more money into this display .

 

[Commodore Swab]

Hey swab man, what all did you have to do ? The reason i think this was a replica is the muzzle has score marks a perfect 3/4 inch deep round . " a plugged muzzle " maybe ? The mainspring is is non removable . Its either epoxied or spot welded in . Ive used a mainspring vise and vise clamps and its not budgeing . Plus yhe geometrix of hammer and frizzen seem crude at best . Im new at flintlocks and this gun peeked my interest . I own and shoot seversl percushions and want to invest in a "shooting " flinter . Im pretty mechanically inclined but not willing to put more money into this display .

Reshape the cock toe to regain a half/full cock, weld the spring/sear (yes, you can weld springs) for full cock, harden frizzen, tweak frizzen toe, remove breach and build a new one welding it all up. After welding was heat treating and reassembly.

 

[Tin sandwich]

Ill look at it again but probably wont do much with it than display it . Thanks again for responding .

 

[wiscoaster]

Ill look at it again but probably wont do much with it than display it . ...

That's OK. I have a number of wall hangers and I have a number of "parts" guns and even several "junked" guns. All you can do is your best effort and sometimes it comes to the point where it's just not worth putting in more time, effort and money. I'm sure yours will make a great display and conversation piece, and sometimes that's worth as much as being able to actually shoot it.

 

[sturmkatze]

Ill post pics later today as gun is still in parts .a few question first , should i purchase a mainspring vise and is it even necessary to disassemble whole lock ? Also what info should i provide because im sure ill need parts " flints, leather possibly a frizzen " i have no info on this gun .

Gun smith

 

[Rob M.]

Yes im just going to shoot for fun .... internet search indicated a worn out frizzen would have a " washboard " look . Im taking yalls advice and see if it sparks first . Question , so im needing a 3/4 inch british style flint ? Does thickness matter ? Also , how should i go about polishing the bore ?

Polishing out a smooth bore barrel is easy peezy . Just get a wood dowel a few inches or more longer than the barrel , cut a groove a couple inches long in one end and the other end in your drill ... If the bore is pretty rough I'd use some 120-150/grit sand paper on the bore first . Then some 220 or so ( these are all approximate , use what you got ) ....then different grades of steel wool to finest ... You can get it shining like a mirror in there . It really helps with loading and cleaning . Go slow when moving the spinning dowel in and out of the barrel .... Your frizzen looks great . See how she sparks , make sure flint is square with the frizzen face and well secured , not loose .....best of luck !!

 

[ZUG]

Ill post pics later today as gun is still in parts .a few question first , should i purchase a mainspring vise and is it even necessary to disassemble whole lock ? Also what info should i provide because im sure ill need parts " flints, leather possibly a frizzen " i have no info on this gun .

A mainspring vise is a good thing to have - my opinion. You don't need a fancy on just get one of the ubiquitous ones sold by the muzzle loader supply houses and it should work just fine. I make my own and it is styled after those that are sold by Track of the Wolf and others. I have used these on small Siler locks and on large Brown Bess locks with no issues both mainsprings and frizzen springs.

 

[M. De Land]

Geometry issues most likely dealing with the toe of the frizzen. If its leaving gouges on the frizzen face the frizzen needs hardening. Also your frizzen spring is probably too strong in relation to the main spring.

Some times only a cock jaw angle adjustment will correct a bad sparking frizzen. I had to make this change on a very high end match flint pistol and it made a huge change in performance by simply heating and bending the cock jaw down a few degrees so it would shear steel better and not gouge the frizzen face or break flints.