Flint lock plans

[po68f]

The project in which I´m working is a flintlock pistol, smooth bore .457" caliber. The barrel is finished, but not blued. I also want to make the lock, but I´m not sure about certain dimensions. So: has anyone the plans of a lock?.
Thank you.

 

[54ball]

Welcome to the forum.

I'm going to be honest and I mean this is without any intended sarcasm.

If you have to have a plan to build a lock, you don't need to build a lock.

Building a lock takes study in not just lock design but metallurgy. Not only does the lock parts have to be designed and fitted properly, the geometry has to be perfect; certain metal parts have to be made out of special steel like for the springs and tumblers, these must be heat treated as some parts need to be of different hardness. In short there's a lot to it.

This gets you going in the right direction but you'll at least have to have a drill press.
Link Track's Siler Lock kit
For about 40 bucks more you can order the lock finished.

If you want to go from scratch all I can say is study up.

 

[po68f]

I know that building a lock is challenging task. I have all the machines needed (a complete machinist shop). In fact the barrel, breechplug and sights are 100% made by me. So I guess that I will have no much problem in making all the parts. The olnly doubt I have is about the springs (mainspring and frizzen spring).

 

[MSW]

I don't know of anywhere that you can get a set of machinist drawings for a lock, but Track of the Wolf does have full sized photographs of the locks they carry ...

just a thought ... :hmm:

curious to see how the project comes out ...

 

[Many Klatch]

I have never seen plans for a lock. I guess you could buy a lock, copy the parts and use the springs. Once you built the first one you could build as many as you wanted. This would allow you to build a non-standard lock if you wanted.

Many Klatch

 

[Rifleman1776]

I agree. You are taking on a monumental task. Especially with this being your first. However, with your background I'm encouraging you to proceed building a lock from scratch. It sounds like an exciting challenge. And, once finished you will have number one bragging rights at any ml event you attend.
I spend just a couple minutes Googling flintlocks. I'm sure you can find plans and diagrams to get you started on your project.
Keep us informed.

 

[wmaser]

Don't be discouraged. I asked the same question years ago when I decided to build my first lock. Wound up copying the parts from a small Siler lock. The first one was tough but was a good education. Learn from your mistakes. don't just copy the parts... understand why they are built that way and especially how the parts function. The second one is easier. The twelfth, thirteenth and forteenth are just a routine part of building the gun. You can do it.

 

[Metalshaper]

If you can find it?? George Lauber did three books on build your own. Flinter, Percussion and Wheel locks. All three showed how to build em completely from scratch.( well more or less :wink: )

A lot of 'discussion' goes on about the dims being off here and there but the intent is there.
may not be the end all, for a how to, but it'd at least get you a look at how it can be done ( presumably ) done?? if you can get the pics from the Track catalog, as a comparison.. then you can gauge the geometry involved..

Oh just thought of it.. Pryor Mountain Bill Newton had a book on locks and such and offered some build ideas??
Title is as follows;
Hand Forging, History, Patterns of the Muzzle loading Gun Lock.

Hope it Helps??

Respect Always
Metalshaper/Jonathan

 

[po68f]

Thanks everyone for the answers.

Something tha I have not stated in the previous topics is that I live in Argentina.
Since a few years ago USA has applied restrictions to the shipping of gun parts outside USA. Due to this, most sellers of parts are not shipping orders to Argentina.
These are the two reasons that decided me to build a lock.
The plan B is making a matchlock pistol (historically incorrect), but for learning purpose is a valid option.

 

[frogwalking]

When I was 18, (1967) I built a lock. I made the tumbler out of a grade 8 bolt, using the head to make the actual tumbler, and the smooth portion of the shaft to go through the plate. I used a coil spring (this was before TC came out with their lock) because I did not know how to make a flat spring. It worked, and is still working, although the fit and finish are nothing to write home about.

 

[kaintuck]

I you have a set of files, some sheet metal, and a few screws.....you can do it.

after all, this IS a hobby!

 

[frogwalking]

Note: The lock I made was a percussion lock. Much easier to make.

 

[jdkerstetter]

That, my friend, is a very big understatement. Enjoy, J.D.

 

[po68f]

As I previously said, I have a complete machinist worshop. It includes: 5 lathes, 1 universal milling machine, 1 bench drill press, 1 drill press (Morse #4 tapper) with cross table, 1 shaping machine (I don´t know the exact name in english), 1 air compressor, 1 tig welder, 1 mig/mag welder, 2 arc welders, 1 mechanic saw, lots of files, cherrys, drill bits, taps, threding dies, grinders, measuring instruments, etc.
Machining is what I do for a living. Equipment is something I don´t lack. I´m not so sure about knowledge.

 

[Zonie]

It sounds like you have everything but the drawing.

Unfortunately, I don't know of any detailed drawings of flintlocks that are available although I must confess I didn't spend much time doing a web search.

A possible idea that might work is for you to order the Track of the Wolf catalog.

In it are photos of the locks they sell but the important thing is the photos are actual size and they show both the inside and the outside of the lock.

Examples of these photos can be seen in these links: http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/722/1/LOCK-SS-FK-RH
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/List/Item.aspx/726/1
The tumbler which carries the half **** notch, the full **** notch and the spur that the mainspring reacts against is usually a bit hard to see because it is partially covered by the bridle (bridge that supports the tumbler axle or pivot pin).
On the plus side, on page 170 of my Catalog 17 there is a good view of the individual Siler lock parts shown full size.
The picture even includes the mainspring in its relaxed state.
I'm sure the newer catalogs will have the same photos in them.

Armed with the full size photos you could measure the various parts, the screw locations etc and develop your own plans.
That would be far better than to just start sketching something up without knowing the relationship between the parts.

Although the locks represented by the pictures may not be small enough for your pistol, after knowing the relative sizes of the parts and their locations it could be scaled down by some factor like 0.9.

About the only thing that cannot be measured from these photos is the thickness of the parts.

To give an idea of what these thicknesses are, on a large Siler the tumbler body (where the full **** notch is) is .240". The bridle that fits over the tumbler to support it clears the tumbler body by about .010".
The mainspring is about .400 wide at the "U" bend and tapers to about .300 where the end contacts the tumbler mainspring spur.

The lockplate is generally about 0.165" thick except at the bolster at the top that the mainspring reacts against. This area of the lockplate is about .300" thick.

A link to the TOTW site where the catalog can be ordered:
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/303/1/CATALOG-18

 

[dlgraley]

I saw this on GunBroker. This might help.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=359790203

 

[dlgraley]

This isn't posting the way I'm typing it. Just go to GunBroker and check out the auction number.

 

[kaintuck]

what zonie said +1

I use track of the wolf in making templates~ I think it will work for a drafting plan.......

let us know your progress!

 

[44-henry]

The Lauber book is still available on Ebay occasionally. It is ok, bot the styling leaves something to be desired, and dimensions are sometimes wrong. A better but would be to get the Siler kit mentioned and build a new lock using this for study, changing parts as desired.

Though much more costly, The Journal of Historical Armsmaking had a volume dealing specifically with lockmaking that is quite good and includes patterns, but no real specific dimensions. The relationship between the parts is explained which is more important. A flintlock is complex, and not readily described by basic dimensions. Even if you did have all the necessary dimensions to produce entirely by machine it would require very sophisticated equipment to pull off, at least if you were to capture all the complex geometry. Perhaps a five axis machining center could pull it off, but I didn't see that listed in your equipment list.

 

[Paul R]

I recently was cleaning out old files & came accross a set of 6 drawings by Bill Newton of old, original locks. Flint & percussion. One is of a flintlock pistol lock 1776, by Ketland and Company. Each drawing shows assembled lock, inside & out. The lockplate by itself and an exploded view, showing each piece in relation to each other. Then each individual part is drawn in 2 or 3 views, all in actual size. There are no dimensions on the drawings.
They appear to be 'whiteprints' & are laminated on both sides. They were given to me in 1968 & I now know I will never be doing any thing with them, so they are up for grabs, as long as I am not violating any copyright laws. Free for the asking, but I would really like them to go to somebody who will actually do more with them then I ever did.
Paul