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Flint positioning question
- Thread starter Nick M
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Black Hand
Cannon
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When the new flint is just short of touching the frizzen when on half-cock with the frizzen closed. The edge should be parallel to the face of the frizzen, centered in the jaws and not extend too far to either side of the jaw.
At least that is how I place my flints.
At least that is how I place my flints.
Larry Akers
40 Cal.
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Also try the flint with the bevel up and down. Go with what sparks best.
One last thing to check after you've positioned your flint with the edge just clear of the frizzen face.
Flip up the frizzen and gently lower the cock to the fired position.
With everything in this condition, make sure the edge of the frizzen is not hitting the bottom of the pan even though it was adjusted to "just clear the frizzen", as it should be.
Although it doesn't happen often, I've seen locks that or one reason or another, would ram the flint into the bottom of the pan.
This usually resulted in shattering the flint.
If the edge of the flint does interfere with the pan, position it a little further into the cock jaws, remembering to use the face of the closed frizzen as a guide to keep things square.
Flip up the frizzen and gently lower the cock to the fired position.
With everything in this condition, make sure the edge of the frizzen is not hitting the bottom of the pan even though it was adjusted to "just clear the frizzen", as it should be.
Although it doesn't happen often, I've seen locks that or one reason or another, would ram the flint into the bottom of the pan.
This usually resulted in shattering the flint.
If the edge of the flint does interfere with the pan, position it a little further into the cock jaws, remembering to use the face of the closed frizzen as a guide to keep things square.
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The way I tell is to actually dry fire the new flint a few times and note two things:
1, Amount and color of sparks.
2. Where the sparks are hitting the pan.
After one gets some experience with the arm you will recognize by a quick glance if the flint is positioned correctly and is long enough.
1, Amount and color of sparks.
2. Where the sparks are hitting the pan.
After one gets some experience with the arm you will recognize by a quick glance if the flint is positioned correctly and is long enough.
All of the above is good advice. The only other thing I could add is that I like to have the flint strike the frizzen around its midsection or just a little above. Does this make a difference?...I believe my flintlock is just as fast at igniting the main charge as any caplock or centerfire cartridge, but then this is purely based on anecdotal observation. Perhaps Pletch can give you more sound information about where the flint should first make contact with the frizzen when firing the rifle.
I like to have my flints as folks have written, to sit just a fraction of an inch from the face when the cock is set at half-cock position. Bevel up or bevel down I determine by the sparking AND the chipping of the flint. If both ways spark well but in one position that particular flint chips a lot more, I will use the other position.
I have found for the very large musket locks, that a lead wrap works best in my muskets, but otherwise a leather wrap works very well in other guns and especially in rifles. For locks that for whatever reason don't seem to like a particular flint..i.e. the sparks are not so numerous and/or the flint chips heavily with the bevel in either position, I experiment with changing the flint angle just a tad. I have found that sometimes placing a small piece of wood from a small, used, wooden matchstick, under the back of the flint where the flint contacts the jaw-screw, will change the flint edge angle downward, and often give you good sparks but reduce the bashing of the flint edge.
In addition to Zonie's advice on checking the flint impact into the pan, you should check the forward corner of the flint where it closest to the barrel. Flints are sold sorted in different sizes, but those are approximations, and you might have a flint that looks pretty good as far as size but it's too wide or by mistake it's just a tad too far toward the barrel and hits the barrel when you fire.
LD
I have found for the very large musket locks, that a lead wrap works best in my muskets, but otherwise a leather wrap works very well in other guns and especially in rifles. For locks that for whatever reason don't seem to like a particular flint..i.e. the sparks are not so numerous and/or the flint chips heavily with the bevel in either position, I experiment with changing the flint angle just a tad. I have found that sometimes placing a small piece of wood from a small, used, wooden matchstick, under the back of the flint where the flint contacts the jaw-screw, will change the flint edge angle downward, and often give you good sparks but reduce the bashing of the flint edge.
In addition to Zonie's advice on checking the flint impact into the pan, you should check the forward corner of the flint where it closest to the barrel. Flints are sold sorted in different sizes, but those are approximations, and you might have a flint that looks pretty good as far as size but it's too wide or by mistake it's just a tad too far toward the barrel and hits the barrel when you fire.
LD
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Another thing I think is important is learn how to knap your own flints so that you can adjust the edge and bevel to a different strike spot where it hits the frizzen.
I have found that you can make more than one impact spot on the frizzen face that produces reliable ignition by changing the flint edge,bevel and length so that you don't wear a horizontal groove in the frizzen face.
I have found that you can make more than one impact spot on the frizzen face that produces reliable ignition by changing the flint edge,bevel and length so that you don't wear a horizontal groove in the frizzen face.
Yeah, a flint can leave a nasty gouge on the barrel if one isn't careful. When I'm replacing it I put it in with the cock all the way down to ensure it's not scraping barrel, then place it on half cock and line it up parallel to the face of the frizzen.
If you hold it tight, you can ease the flint/cock forward with the frizzen closed and see exactly where it's hitting. Exercise caution, though.
1/3 of the way down the frizzen yields the best results for me, but ensuring the entire edge of the flint is scraping, as opposed to just a corner of it, I've found to be more important. Common sense, I suppose, but as a beginner that tidbit wasn't readily apparent to me.
If you hold it tight, you can ease the flint/cock forward with the frizzen closed and see exactly where it's hitting. Exercise caution, though.
1/3 of the way down the frizzen yields the best results for me, but ensuring the entire edge of the flint is scraping, as opposed to just a corner of it, I've found to be more important. Common sense, I suppose, but as a beginner that tidbit wasn't readily apparent to me.
The trick to positioning your flint correctly is to get it to strike your frizzen anywhere between a 55° and 60° angle. When you do that, it will slice the flint along the frizzen showering sparks into the pan.
If you set it to strike at more of an angle than that it will slap the flint against the frizzen instead of slicing along it and you will break chunks off the underside of the flint.
If you set it at less of an angle it will crush the tip of the flint against the frizzen instead of slicing along it and you will constantly be knapping the flint to try to get it to work again.
When you get it to strike at a 55° to 60° angle, it will not only give you great sparks and very long life, it will also be self sharpening and you will almost never have to knap the edge.
So flip the flint bevel up or bevel down, move it forward or move it backward. Do whatever you need to do to position the flint so it strikes at that 55° to 60° angle.
That is just possibly the best tip I ever got from this site and I was originally told that about 13-years ago. Made a WORLD of difference for me.
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:
Dan
If you set it to strike at more of an angle than that it will slap the flint against the frizzen instead of slicing along it and you will break chunks off the underside of the flint.
If you set it at less of an angle it will crush the tip of the flint against the frizzen instead of slicing along it and you will constantly be knapping the flint to try to get it to work again.
When you get it to strike at a 55° to 60° angle, it will not only give you great sparks and very long life, it will also be self sharpening and you will almost never have to knap the edge.
So flip the flint bevel up or bevel down, move it forward or move it backward. Do whatever you need to do to position the flint so it strikes at that 55° to 60° angle.
That is just possibly the best tip I ever got from this site and I was originally told that about 13-years ago. Made a WORLD of difference for me.
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:
Dan
nchawkeye
58 Cal.
Let me add one more thing...
With powder in the barrel and NO powder in the pan a flintlock can still go off...
So, if you have a situation where the barrel is loaded and need to knap or change flints DO NOT "dry fire" to see if you have sparks...
Many of us on here have had our flintlock go off when doing this...If you need to change a flint, just change it, shoot and then do your final adjustments or knap with something that won't throw sparks, shoot and proceed...
Have Fun!!!
With powder in the barrel and NO powder in the pan a flintlock can still go off...
So, if you have a situation where the barrel is loaded and need to knap or change flints DO NOT "dry fire" to see if you have sparks...
Many of us on here have had our flintlock go off when doing this...If you need to change a flint, just change it, shoot and then do your final adjustments or knap with something that won't throw sparks, shoot and proceed...
Have Fun!!!
hanshi
Cannon
You are correct + :thumbsup: . I have done this several times as a test and the percentage of live fires with an empty pan was unsettling.
Another :thumbsup: for the caution about not dropping the cock on the frizzen if the barrel is loaded.
All it takes is one little spark bouncing around in the pan and making its way thru the vent hole to set off the powder charge.
All it takes is one little spark bouncing around in the pan and making its way thru the vent hole to set off the powder charge.
I use a hammer-stall to cover the frizzen on my rifle. That makes it impossible to throw a spark because the entire frizzen is enclosed within leather.
I attach it to the trigger-guard with a thin leather lanyard (leather lacing actually) so I can knock it off the frizzen when I'm ready to shoot and not worry about where that piece of leather went.
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:
Dan
I attach it to the trigger-guard with a thin leather lanyard (leather lacing actually) so I can knock it off the frizzen when I'm ready to shoot and not worry about where that piece of leather went.
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:
Dan
That's good but, just how do you adjust and position your flint when the hammer stall is installed?
I think the topic is about how to position a flint in the cock. The comments about testing the newly installed flint were to warn the unsuspecting that even with the pan totally clean, loaded flintlocks can and do fire from just one errant spark.
I think the topic is about how to position a flint in the cock. The comments about testing the newly installed flint were to warn the unsuspecting that even with the pan totally clean, loaded flintlocks can and do fire from just one errant spark.
Obviously, you have to remove the hammer-stall from the frizzen while you are adjusting the position of flint. Once it's been adjusted, I put the hammer-stall back in place and put the cock in the 1/2-cock position (after I have put powder in the pan).
I would also think it would be obvious that you don't try to adjust the flint while your flintlock is loaded but it certainly bears repeating - DON'T ADJUST THE FLINT WITH POWDER IN THE BARREL.
Once you have fired, don't reload until after you have adjusted the flint if you are getting poor sparking.
If I don't have powder in the pan, then I leave the pan open with the cock all the way down so there's no pressure on the spring. I still leave the hammer-stall on the frizzen though, even with the pan open.
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:
Dan
I would also think it would be obvious that you don't try to adjust the flint while your flintlock is loaded but it certainly bears repeating - DON'T ADJUST THE FLINT WITH POWDER IN THE BARREL.
Once you have fired, don't reload until after you have adjusted the flint if you are getting poor sparking.
If I don't have powder in the pan, then I leave the pan open with the cock all the way down so there's no pressure on the spring. I still leave the hammer-stall on the frizzen though, even with the pan open.
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:
Dan
