Flintlock can fire from half cock

[David W.]

It's possible it has a wood inletting problem. You can check the lock to wood fit with lamp black.

I'm also curious about the extra part on the main spring.

I would probably tell him you think it needs a new lock, and see how much he'll take off the price. Also, that's not the best wood to metal work, and carving I've seen. Overall though, if you can get it for a decent price, it's probably a good buy. Do you know what shape the barrel is in?

 

[54ball]

I think you should buy it. This looks to be a good quailty rifle.
A basic kit runs $600 plus, so even if you have to relplace the lock I think you'll come out way ahead.
It could be dirty or something as simple as a sticky fly.
A good dissassembly, clean and lube may fix her up. At that price it's worth the gamble.

 

[Dane]

Obviously, if it has the problem out of the stock, it's not the trigger plate. You need someone to look at the lock that understands how a flint lock works.
It's really pretty simple. When the cock is drawn back, the sear spring should drop the sear into (first) the half cock notch, then the full cock notch. If this is not happening, then I would first suspect the sear spring not having enough tension to do it's job, secondly some form of problem with the geometry of the tumbler/sear combination. (broken sear tip, full/half cock notch, etc. This is not a problem that can be diagnosed without seeing the lock.

Do you know what brand the lock is?? Do you know anyone with the ability to go and diagnose the issues with you??
$400 is a good price. The lock and barrel are worth that. IF the lock functions.
Once the problem is found, it could be fairly expensive to fix. If the existing lock cannot be repaired, then you're looking at a new lock, re-inletted into the stock, and all the complications that adds.
Obviously, it is NOT safe to carry as it is.

Hope this helps. Not meant as doom and gloom, but reality.

 

[nchawkeye]

Buy it...

Of course get it as cheap as you can and point out that there aren't many people out there that can work on a flintlock that know what they are doing...

It's a Siler lock, I have 2 of them...It looks like the last fellow never pulled the lock off and cleaned it after shooting...The tumbler is all gummed up...

Now, if you buy it, email Jim Chambers at flintlocks.com and send it to him and let him clean it and go through it and fix whatever needs fixing...

Another point, that gun has double triggers, they can be misadjusted or simply inlet too deep...That causes problems as well...

Offer him $300-$350, not many people want those old charcoal burners anymore....

 

[Robby]

From what information and pictures you have provided I think it is one heck of a good deal for the price!! It is also a good opportunity to learn something. When you get it post questions in the gun building forum. Plenty of help there, and your problem is solvable without any great expense. Good luck!!!
Robby

 

[steved]

I also agree that if you get that rifle for $400 or less you are getting a good deal. Looks to be a fine piece of maple and you said the bore is clean, so if you have to pay to fix or replace the lock you will still come out ahead.

 

[don hepler]

I'm pretty sure it is a Siler lock, I am looking at my Siler lock and the only thing I see different is the exta spring piece someone has slipped in between the main spring. You said it could be fired from half cock, even when the lock is removed from the gun. That is deffinitly a problem. The lock looks pretty greasy and needs a good cleaning. Which may or may not solve the problem.

If the rest of the gun is in descent shape I'd jump on it. It's a shooter, with a lot of character.

 

[tlallijr]

I agree it would be a good deal and not much to get it straightened out and working properly . It has a nice patina to it with all the handling marks and with the barrel looking as good as it did I made an offer of $375 and am waiting to hear back . The bad thing is the store owner seemed a little offended by my low offer and claimed the rifle was already priced for a quick sell . I hope I didn't get too greedy looking for a steal of a deal and somebody else ends up getting it .

 

[nchawkeye]

Of course he "acted" offended...

He wants to make more money!!

It's all part of the negotiating process...

 

[DUSTY 14]

if you get the rifle send the lock off to siler and i bet they will get it working safely cheap. maybe even if it is not theirs. seem to know the value of customers not just a sale

 

[Col. Batguano]

If he's serious about selling it he will make you a counter. These sorts of things don't sell that easily, especially if they have issues. Most people want stuff they can use right away. These 1-off custom guns don't have a manufacturer to "return" them to (or sue) either, which in most consumers' minds is a negative.

It's priced higher than the average used TC, GP. Lyman, or CVA. so it's in the specialty shooters' market, and that's a pretty thin one.

Take your time on this. It may still be on the shelf in a few months.

 

[Baxter]

You are asking the dealer to give you a 21% discount on a used item - may be fair but in my estimation, I think that this is a $429.95 rifle. You may be facing the prospect of a new lock - but I'll bet the present lock can be put in order but I'd use the potential for needing a new lock as a bargaining chip - I'd ask the dealer to look at the inside of the lock and point out the "alteration" that needs fixing. We all love a "deal" but there is the possibility of insulting the dealer's intelligence and business acumen and when that happens, the bargaining door gets shut very tightly. Why $429.95? Why not? Pull out cash money and see how that works. baxter

 

[54ball]

Cleaned up with a new or fixed lock TOTW would most likely ask over a thousand for it.
If you want it, pay the man his $475.00.

 

[Powerkicker]

Where is this shop? I'd consider buying the thing for his asking price and have him ship it down to me.

 

[tlallijr]

The shop called me today and said the rifle could be mine for $400 . I told him I would pick it up tomorrow....Thanks everyone for the input . Now hopefully I can get it functioning right and enjoy it !!

 

[nchawkeye]

Good deal!!!!!

I just got my lock back from Jim Chambers, had him polish and tune and check out for next season...Might be a good idea to have him look at that one...

 

[MSW]

congrats on your new rifle... i agree that you should send the lock to Jim Chambers and see what he can do with it... even if he says it's toast, you're ahead of the game...

if that happens, get a Deluxe Large Siler, put a good black english flint in it, adgust the flint to strike the top third of the frizzen, and you'll be making good smoke in a jiffy.

by the way, you may want to buy a mainspring vise ...
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/1038/1/TOOL-VISE

this one is about twelve bucks, or the fancier one...
http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/1038/1/TOOL-VISE-DX

a bit more expensive, but it looks cooler (and this style is easier to use) ...

the first link shows how the thing is used - you bring the lock to full cock after you take it out of the mortise, slip the vise onto it and snug down the tab, and then you trip the sear to release the cock. this allows the cock to come down, but the spring remains compressed in the vise, and the lock can be completely disassembled for cleaning, which i don't think you need to do every time you shoot, but once a year isn't a bad idea.

sparingly use a non- gumming lubricant when you put everything together .... especially one that doesn't gum up in the cold. and don't feel compelled to torque down the screws intil they scream for mercy.

good luck with your new rifle ... a very nice looking piece!

 

[tlallijr]

MSW, Thank you and everyone else for all the input. I am planning to make the trip to Dixon's within the next few days to pick up some supplies including a mainspring vise if they have one. I also have talked to Karen at Jim Chambers who has encouraged me to install the parts myself. I am going to send the bad parts to her and she will get me the proper parts all ready finished and ready to drop in. If I have any trouble with the lock after that I can send it in and have them look at it. Thanks Tony

 

[tlallijr]

My new tumbler came today from Jim Chambers so I got the lock back together. It's all clean, polished and working properly now......can't wait to shoot this rifle at the range! Thank you everyone for the help. Tony

 

[Dphar]

Completely degrease the lock, re-oil sparingly and try it for function.
It may be so greased up as to not work right. If this does not effect a cure you need a gunsmith.
Mainspring is weak most likely and the shim increases the power. Needs to be re-arched or replaced.
Its possible someone has dry fired the triggers with the lock in 1/2 cock and broke the 1/2 cock notch in the tumbler and/or the sear nose.
Dan