Flintlock Light Loads?

[macentyre]

I'm a big fan of light loads in my modern rifles. Always been intrigued with 32 cal flintlock rifles, but I can't afford one right now. So, I was thinking... when I get my lock working in my 45 caliber Pedersoli Kentucky, why not shoot a light load under a .44 ball?

IIRC, I read that for smaller calibers the minimum charge is half the weight of the ball.

What is the lightest charge you would use for a .44 ball (~125 grains)?

 

[greysmoke]

Not sure about a a.44 but I've done some plinking with 15- 20 gr. FF in my .54 . Have to hold a little high at 30 yds.

 

[macentyre]

A 54 caliber ball is about 190 grains, right? How much noise does it make using 15-20 grains of powder?

Seems like a really light load would work better in a muzzleloader, since the projectile is not as tight a fit as with a modern rifle. Less oomph needed to roll it beyond the muzzle.

 

[hanshi]

I've seen and tried the light load concept in a couple of deer calibers and it's no problem to come up with something that works. I don't shoot light loads in large calibers simply because I have a small caliber that takes care of that niche. A .54 ball is about 225 grains. I was out shot once in a woods walk by a guy using 29 grains of powder in his .50 (175 grain ball).

 

[coloradoclyde]

So true, one of my .50 cal rifles actually shoots better with a 27 grain load than with anything else.

 

[Lonegun1894]

.490 (for a .50 rifle) RB is 177 grs, depending on alloy used, and a .530 (for a .54) is closer to 230grs. I can't speak for the .54 loaded that light as I haven't tried it in mine, but I have used one like that in my .50 (10grs actually, and fired from a 28" barreled CVA St. Louis hawken percussion) and it wasn't very loud, but it was loud enough to get the neighbors attention in the backyard once, unlike a couple of my modern rifles. What I would be concerned with, is that you may get to a point where the nipple or flash hole allows enough pressure to be released to where you may get a ball stuck in the bore. But at least it will be easy to remove if/when it happens.

 

[Kapow]

Let me plant an idea in your head and see how you do with it. It is an idea I employ and I am sure many others do too. First of all forget about all those silly rule of thumb wives tale formulas.

Work out your most accurate hunting load first, say 60gns FFFg for example. Then sight that load in for say 75yards which would be getting close to your max hunting distance, depending on game and conditions.

Now reduce your powder charge to a level that prints dead on at the distance you wish to plink or target shoot at. For example, 40gn at 50yrds.

 

[MJMarkey]

I used to have a 45 Cal rifle that I shot .440 balls in, I used 70 grains of 3f black powder. By your statement that would be a light load nearly half the weight of the ball. It wasn't light at all.

I would bet you could get a good performance with something like 30 grains.

 

[macentyre]

I'm going to try all of those suggestions, especially Kapaw's idea.

However, a cat sneeze is supposed to be nearly silent. All the gas expands in the barrel... not gonna be as silent in a barrel that has a touchhole, but it can be close. It's a 20 yard load.

I shoot squirrels in the backyard with Aguila Super Colibris, which are primer only .22 loads with a 20 grain bullet. In a 20" barrel, they go about 700 fps, and are far quieter than an air rifle.

Cat sneezes made using a 45 grain .310 ball in a 30 cal modern rifle are not silent, but close. It's the least powder that will consistently get the ball out of the barrel. That's what I want to try with the 45 cal flinter. I think I'll start with 10 grains of powder and see how much lower it can go.

 

[Walks with fire]

I have never had a caliber less than .50 but I dry balled it once and took the vent liner out and put a very small amount of 3f in there and replaced the liner. It came out with no problem but if I remember correctly it wasn't quiet. Couldn't have been 10 grains in there.

I would love to use my .50 for small game with a small charge but unfortunately it's not legal in PA. If I could ever find a 1/28 to 1/30 twist 13/16" .008/.010 deep grooved barrel I might own a .32 or .36 flint rifle that could shoot a ball well with 10 to 15 grains powder. The quieter the better. A .22 short or CB is great in my opinion.

 

[coloradoclyde]

Round balls at low velocities will ricochet terribly.
Something to keep in mind, I learned that the hard way.

 

[Rifleman1776]

I read that

Tell us what your actual shooting experience is with light loads.

 

[Swede50]

My cousin and I shot through hedge apples using his Browning 50cal with 10grs Pyrodex.
It punched a hole through without destroying them with a little more powder they disintegrated.

It has been to many years ago to remember how loud it was.

I am sure the 10gr charge would take out any bird or squil but the drop would be a lot depending on the distance.

 

[Eric Krewson]

I used to squirrel hunt with my 50 loaded with about 20gr of powder behind a PRB. The gun sorta' went bloop instead of bang but was deadly accurate out to 30 yards. Only made head shots and the low velocity ball would only cut a crescent shaped hole out of their skulls with very little damage.

 

[the Black Spot]

Let me plant an idea in your head and see how you do with it. It is an idea I employ and I am sure many others do too. First of all forget about all those silly rule of thumb wives tale formulas.

Work out your most accurate hunting load first, say 60gns FFFg for example. Then sight that load in for say 75yards which would be getting close to your max hunting distance, depending on game and conditions.

Now reduce your powder charge to a level that prints dead on at the distance you wish to plink or target shoot at. For example, 40gn at 50yrds.

Good stuff. You can sight in at 13 yds and be real close to dead on at 75 yds, just fine tune once you check at longer distance.
I have tried 30 gr in my 50, may have to try 20 gr. this would be just for plinking since the only time i could small game hunt with a 50 in arkansas is during deer season and then I would be at my 60 gr load.

 

[bpd303]

Just something to think about. You will need enough powder to fill the patent breech so the patched ball does not block the touch hole.

 

[macentyre]

Just something to think about. You will need enough powder to fill the patent breech so the patched ball does not block the touch hole.

I thought about that... the ramrod doesn't allow me to push the ball that far.

This morning, I tried 7, 6, & 2.5 grains with a .44 ball weighing about 125 grains, shooting at a plywood target 13 yards away. The 7 & 6 grain loads shot 4" low. The 2.5 grain load shot 12" low. That is the problem with such heavy bullets and light loads... no problem getting them out of the barrel, but they drop a lot!

They did ricochet badly, but I was protected, and I shot at a slight angle to the plywood target.

I think I will use 15 grains as the lightest load for 45 caliber, and expect it to be a bit loud.

For 2.5 grain cat sneezes, I might try a wax bullet carrying a BB or a pellet.

 

[bpd303]

Not a good idea to be shooting a ball that's not seated on the powder.

 

[macentyre]

Not a good idea to be shooting a ball that's not seated on the powder.

Of course, but couldn't be helped... seated on that tiny amount of powder would have blocked the hole. I couldn't remove the touch hole plug, as mentioned above, in this particular rifle.

 

[vulture]

I think I've mentioned this before, but....years ago I was a member of a black powder clug locally, and we shot at aprox. 25 - 30 yards at most of our shoots. The normal load for a 50-54 caliber rifle was 35 grns. of FF or FFF, depending on your preference. None of us wore ear protection as the sound was just not that loud, and accruracy was about the same with that load at those distances in my personal built .54 Leman as it was with a full house load out to 100 yrds. The wife of a friend of mine used a .45 and the recoil and noise was very mild, she was not a big woman. If it were me I would not mess with trying to use a smaller ball, just reduce the loads as has been suggested, you will find what you want and it will be a joy to shoot, and if you work it right you won't have to adjust the sights from the light load to the heavy hunting load.