Flintlock Pistol

[JR Anderson]

Can anyone help identify the attached. I was told it is a reproduction at time of purchase however I am not sure. The barrel looks to be Damascus steel plus the engraving and screws look to be real. The only marking on the gun is a #09 on the right side of the barrel. Please let me know what you think.

I hope the attached pictures can be opened. Thanks

 

[curator]

Pictures of the lock side would be helpful. It is obviously a "percussion" pistol, not flintlock. Possibly French based on the fluted grip and trigger guard spur.

 

[hawkeye2]

What curator says +1, French or possibly Belgian. I believe it is an original from the later percussion era and not a reproduction. Are there any markings visible on the barrel? Generally, though not always, repros carry markings on the visible portion of the barrel. Those could be things like the country of origin, proof marks, brand, warnings, etc.. Quite often originals show no visible markings on the barrel but they may be found underneath instead.

Your photos are good but you should always start with the lock side and give us a close view of the lock and its markings too. A close up of the finish on the barrel would be helpful too.

 

[arquebus]

Looks very similar to one I own, though the grip cap looks a little different & mine doesn't have the spur on the trigger guard. Mine has Belgian (Liege) proofs on the barrel, but is otherwise unmarked. Caliber is approximately .53 caliber & has eleven-groove rifling. It is probably the most comfortable percussion pistol I've ever owned/shot, & it shoots better than I can most days. I use a .527" roundball, .010" patch & 15gns of 3Fg.

 

[smoothshooter]

The single most important side of the gun to show is the lock side. That is where most of the telltale characteristics are on muzzleloaders.

More pictures, please.

 

[JR Anderson]

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[JR Anderson]

Hey smoothshooter,
I hope I got the pics right. As you can see there is no lock mechanism on it. Am I going to be able to find a lock for it? Or is it not worth it..
Sorry about the delay, I got busy over the last days. You guys on this forum are the best!! Thanks JR

 

[JR Anderson]

Hello arguebus,
Man thanks for the pics, I believe I found the same makers mark as you have on your pistol. I guess if I got the pics right you can see there is no lock on the pistol I have. You think I may be able to find one? You have been a ton of help for me. I really appreciate all the help.. Thanks jr

 

[JR Anderson]

Hey hawkeye,
I got no lock on the pistol as you can see, I got a word from arguebus and found the makers mark. Can you see the finish on the barrel ok in the pic of makers mark? Looks like damascus, Im not sure.
I would like to find a lock for it, if possible. I am having a little trouble with the pic download, let me know if a better pic is needed. Again you guys are the best for helping me, I do appreciate it. Thanks JR

 

[JR Anderson]

Thanks curator, I dont know these pistols at all..
I guess you can see there is no lock on it, would like to find one though. You guys are awesome help!! Thanks JR

 

[Fernando Keilty]

Hey there

As seen in the penultimate photo, the barrel has a punch test of Liege the G note, the asterisk and part of the oval, indicating that the gun is Belgian. Too bad the lock missing

Fernando K

 

[Tinker2]

there is no lock on it, would like to find one

Nice looking Damascus barrel

If you want a lock you will most likely have to make it
Get a back action donor lock; make a new lock plate to fit
Put the donor parts on the lock plate you made


William Alexander

 

[arquebus]

JR, that mark on the barrel is a proof mark, not a maker's stamp. I have no idea who made the pistols, but I'd be surprised if yours & mine weren't made by the same person. You are right, the barrels are damascus, or at least lap welded, as were most barrels of that time-frame (c.1850s). Does yours have the multi-groove rifling like mine? I have also seen similar pistols with 'cannon-style' rifling, which has approx. two dozen very fine grooves, almost like microgroove rifling.
As for the lock, I think you'd have to be very lucky to find one that would just drop in & work. I'd be happy to post a picture of the insides of my lock & the dimensions if that would help.

 

[Pete G]

I would start a search for a lock at Dixie Gun Works. They have a lot of old parts in inventory that are not in their catalog. You could start with an e-mail and the pics you have posted here.

 

[Dphar]

You might find a lock that is close but finding a drop in is pure luck. It will need to be fitted by someone who knows the ins and outs to get things right. A SKILLED ML gunsmith/restorer. Not just a ML parts assembler because its going to require actual gunsmithing in all probability.
Right now the pistol is not worth much. The lock may have been removed to restore a more valuable pistol or could have been removed at so time to keep children from shooting it when it was given them as a toy. Or someone was fixing the lock and events resulted in its being separated from the pistol???? Its almost surely a hardware store grade pistol. Birmingham England and Belgium made them in their thousands upon thousands. Then were still exporting MLs to Africa for the natives and as wall hangers in the 1950s. But this is a better quality pistol than these generally were.
Dan

 

[arquebus]

This style of pistol (somewhat compact, of medium bore) is generally described as a "Traveller's Pistol", intended to be carried in a cloak pocket or similar for self defence. While certainly not a high grade item, they are well made & were well finished & I can certainly see them as being carried by the bourgeois, merchants, etc.

 

[Tinker2]

It is a lot better looking Damascus barrel then a run of the mill gun.
I think it’s worth fixing from what I can see. If it was mine, I’d fix it.

“It will need to be fitted by someone who knows the ins and outs to get things right. A SKILLED ML gunsmith/restorer. Not just a ML parts assembler because its going to require actual gunsmithing in all probability.”

I am sure you are right.
I was somewhat simplistic in my previous post



William Alexander

 

[Grumpa]

As above.

It is worth restoring. You will have a nice, restored, original pistol preferable IMHO to a reproduction.

 

[arquebus]

I agree with Grumpa, while all BP guns are fun to shoot there's something special about using an original. Pistol shooting doesn't come easy for me, but this particular pistol does quite well.....even in my hand! These two targets were shot earlier this month (10 shots @ 25yds, one-handed), the black is 8" diameter, scores were a 92 & a 93-2X which is about as good as I can expect from myself these days.