FRIZZEN

[sproulman]

most likely this has been brought up before.

i read how to temper your frizzen.

i tried it and could not get it right.

then i read where 1 of us put frizzen in vise with clothes hanger in hole.

this was FACE UP.

I THEN HEATED THE BACK OF FRIZZEN TO RED HOT,THEN PUT THE kasenit ON WITH SPOON.

it would bubble then start to disappear.

i would add more.

i did this for about 15 minutes, using about 3 spoon fulls.

after that, dunked it in oil to cool.

after cool, scraped off the kasenit and put in the oven at 375 for 1 hr.

after that,i let it cool down.

i took a rich pierce flint and tried it.

MY GOSH, THE SPARKS I NOW GET, THEY ARE MANY MORE THAN I GOT WITH THE NEW T/C FRIZZEN AND NOW ARE WHITE HOT,NOT ORANGE OR RED.

through the help i got on here from many of you and 1 or 2 really helped me on the pm thing, i cannot be more happy.

after seeing this ,you know how much your t/c frizzen is not tempered ,a world of difference.

all these years i never had sparks like that,over 38 years.all t/c frizzens i used old/new too.

i feel t/c frizzens will work, as is too, i never had miss fire on the new t/c frizzen that had only 4 sparks or red in color, it went off but NOW, man, its a shower of WHITE HOT SPARKS.

boy, i am very happy and thank all of you and those other 2 that went beyond to to personelly pm me on every step to make.

thanks, THE SPROULMAN

 

[Onojutta]

I wonder if its just T/C frizzens that don't come hard enough or if all production frizzens could benefit from the same treatment.

...Clinton county, eh?

 

[michaelsbagley]

I hear from just about anyone I ask about Kasenit for hardenning a frizzen, and it sounds like great stuff...

But I am in a pinch for time, and was wondering if I could get similar results from borax? Or is there another easier to find at the local hardware store substance that I can use?

Thanks for any suggestions!

 

[flintriflesmith]

Borax will not do it. It is a flux but does not introduce carbon in to the iron/steel.

 

[rich pierce]

Borax won't harden anything so far as I know, it is just used as a flux for forge welding. Kasenit is the way to go. It doesn't hurt to be careful and draw back the toe of the frizzen to a softer temper. I take it to purple by eye. If you stick the frizzen "face" (part that the flint strikes) in any piece of fruit or vegetable (your pick from the garden or orchard, but carrots, beets, lettuce are not that good lol) then heat the toe with a torch, the apple, melon or squash will act as a heat sink and protect the face from softening.

Then of course get a good flint to test the newly hardened frizzen. :rotf:

 

[44-henry]

The borax definitely won't work. If you had some potassium cyanide handy that would work in the same fashion, but a lot more dangerous :nono:

If you have a heat treat furnace or a forge anything with carbon in it will work (grass, bones, charcoal, etc) and you simply pack it in a crucible and bring the whole works up to critical temperature (or above) and hold for a set period of time followed by a water quench. I do most of my casehardening in this manner, but I typically am after the colors as much as the surface hardness and Kasenit for all its uses does not give colors.

 

[Jblk]

You can usually find casenit in about every shop that handles welding supplies at a reasonable price.

 

[preston cook]

if one should not be fortunate enough to have access to a forge what other way can the frizzen be heated to a hot enough temp.?

 

[Birddog6]

I hear from just about anyone I ask about Kasenit for hardenning a frizzen, and it sounds like great stuff...

But I am in a pinch for time, and was wondering if I could get similar results from borax? Or is there another easier to find at the local hardware store substance that I can use?

Thanks for any suggestions!

In a pinch for time Not a problem. Order it Next Day Air & you will have it tomorrow. :wink:

 

[Len Graves]

Trucker, Any burnz o matic type torch should get you hot enough, with these cautions. you should go where there are very little air currents, try to heat evenly, try to keep heated to soak the temp through. Using Mapp gas with this type torch will get you more heat. With this set up we are talking the very minimum for the job. I have done it, but prefer oxy acetelene. You get much more heat, and can vary gas to oxy.ratio to get a carbon flame. A good fire brick back ground or chamber to help hold and reflect the heat will also help. all this being said of course a nice furnace works best.
Good luck.

 

[fiddler]

I wonder if its just T/C frizzens that don't come hard enough or if all production frizzens could benefit from the same treatment.

...Clinton county, eh?

Lancaster County, eh? Where are you at? I'm in Ephrata.

Fiddler

 

[Stophel]

Trucker, Any burnz o matic type torch should get you hot enough, with these cautions. .

It just blows my mind every time I hear someone say this.

How on earth do you folks get something like a frizzen bright orange hot with a propane torch?!?!?!?!?

I can't see any way you are ever going to get it anywhere near hot enough with an ordinary propane torch. I sure can't anyway. I've tried. No way, no how. I can just BARELY get something as small as a sear hot enough to harden with a propane torch (and it takes two), there simply is not anywhere near enough volume of heat for me to do a frizzen. Now, if you had a little propane forge, that might be different.

 

[fiddler]

yea, I tried propane.........no go. Switched to MAPP.......viola!

Fiddler - another satisfied kasenit user

 

[rich pierce]

I have a wide tip for my propane torch that is plenty hot for a frizzen hardening w/o making a real fire-brick forge. I use one fire brick for a base, set 2 others on it at 90 degrees to make a sort of "corner of the room with a floor but no ceiling" arrangement. Put the frizzen down in the corner and play the torch on it. 3 minutes and it's bright orange and uniform all over and ready to quench. I use the same setup to make chisels etc from old files, etc.

 

[44-henry]

Stophel,
Wouldn't be my first choice either, but I bet you could do it with one of the little bean can type forges designed for the small propane torches. You would definitely need to contain the heat with some kind of shield otherwise no way.

Alex Johnson

 

[Zonie]

"...
It just blows my mind every time I hear someone say this.

How on earth do you folks get something like a frizzen bright orange hot with a propane torch?!?!?!?!?..."
----------
I've done it, several times.
You are right when you use the singular "a". One torch isn't enough but, if you use two propane torches with the flames converging and hold the part where the flames meet they will provide more than enough heat to get the job done.

 

[BEP]

I use an old-fashioned blowtorch ”“ the kind that burns white gas or Coleman fuel. They aren’t that common anymore, but they are around, and they really work great. Turned up all the way, you will be able to get even the largest musket-sized frizzen to that nice "salmon" color, without having to worry about overheating a smaller frizzen. In my opinion, they are well worth the trouble of locating one. If you don’t know how to operate one of these old-fashioned torches, for heaven’s sake get someone who does to instruct you. Good luck.

 

[Stophel]

Them things is scary, man! :shocked2:

 

[BLAHMAN]

Trucker, Any burnz o matic type torch should get you hot enough, with these cautions. .

It just blows my mind every time I hear someone say this.

How on earth do you folks get something like a frizzen bright orange hot with a propane torch?!?!?!?!?

I can't see any way you are ever going to get it anywhere near hot enough with an ordinary propane torch. I sure can't anyway. I've tried. No way, no how. I can just BARELY get something as small as a sear hot enough to harden with a propane torch (and it takes two), there simply is not anywhere near enough volume of heat for me to do a frizzen. Now, if you had a little propane forge, that might be different.

If you have firebrick (used to line fireplaces and wood burners) you can make a small "oven".... I place two as a bottom, then two turned and angled about 90 degrees, then place two on top.....I place my work piece in the middle and the heat from the propane torch will stay and bounce off the enclosure....

The firebrick I have measures about 5" wide, 2" thick and about 8" long.....

 

[chipper]

Any of you folks use a hardened fizzen with no temping? I've been making knives and strikers for the last few years. In my development I found that a striker is way better off not being tempered. If it has curly ends or a fancy design, I draw them back but never the face/striking area. In my un-official test I found that At both 375 and 450 degrees the striker becomes too soft to really throw the best sparks.
Anyway, your comments are welcome.
Regards
Loyd Shindelbower