Getting Parts Fitted

[smoothshooter]

Another question: I have an 1851 Navy and 1860 Army ( both Uberti's ) that I would like to have spare hands fitted to, so that when the originals break I can drop them in without having to hunt around to find someone who knows how to do this on short notice.
I carry and shoot these guns quite a bit, shooting many hundreds of rounds through each every year.
The few gunsmiths who know how to do this around here are usually many weeks behind on their work, and are getting harder and harder to find.
Who can anyone recommend to do this work with a reasonable turn around time that I can send these guns to one at a time so I always have at least one of them around?

 

[ccmountainman]

you will likely have to go to VTIGUN, or Cherry;s or Taylors to buy the parts.
You may or may not have to do a little finish honing your self.
Dremel, jewelers file, emery cloth.
Real easy, just slow and easy.

 

[Tinker2]

If you have it fit now and you don’t need it for an undetermined amount of use, than it may need to be fit to again to compensate for the wear and tear on the rest of the gun.





William Alexander

 

[Kansas Jake]

I was thinking the same thing.

 

[M. De Land]

Just alternate them each time you tear down the gun for a complete cleaning and they will each wear together.
Truth is you will never wear a properly hardened and adjusted hand out. What usually goes is the flat spring on them and then you can change that out with one made of piano wire and almost never break it again.

 

[AZbpBurner]

Just alternate them each time you tear down the gun for a complete cleaning and they will each wear together.
Truth is you will never wear a properly hardened and adjusted hand out. What usually goes is the flat spring on them and then you can change that out with one made of piano wire and almost never break it again.

About a year ago, I replaced the worn hand on Dad's old Uberti 1861. He brought it home in 1969, and I grew up with it - my job was to disassemble, clean and reassemble it after every trip to the range. Dad finally gave it to me, since the hand was worn (despite clean and lube after every firing. A replacement from VTI was almost drop-in fit, with just a little emery cloth touch up.

The piano wire spring sounds like a plan for when the next flat spring breaks :thumbsup:

 

[M. De Land]

It probably was not hard enough or adjusted correctly from the factory.The width,length and profile of the nose is important in proper hand fit as it changes position on the ratchet tooth through a normal stroke cycle.
I've had to replace several triggers on Pietta's that were not made hard enough, even after I re-cased them they would not hold an edge.
All the replacements I've made of A-2 tool steel hold their edge very well.

 

[Tinker2]

Just a thought, but since the cylinders are by necessity somewhat soft, I don’t think a hardened hand that outlasts the cylinder would be my choice.


Again, just a thought.


William Alexander

 

[crockett]

I understand what you are thinking, a hardened hand will wear away the more expensive to replace racket/cylinder. That may or may not be correct. Maybe some experts could add their experience. I think if the hardened hand was rough, then sure, that hard and rough hand could chew up the racket teeth. However, if the hand is polished mirror smooth then it shouldn't wear the teeth (I think). I am basing this idea on cleaning rods used for rifles. The best are stainless steel and very hard. The aluminum cleaning rods are soft and tend to pick up grit and the grit wears the bore. So....I'm thinking a soft hand with all the fouling from black powder- a soft hand may hold grit and actually wear the racket more quickly. As I said- I don't know. Maybe some folks that have dealt with this issue could chime in.

 

[Artificer]

In the 30 plus years I worked Italian revolvers for NSSA shooters, I found there is something else to consider. Though it may have changed a lot since 2005, I noticed there often was significant differences in parts, even from the same manufacturer, over a period of time. Sometimes rather major changes were made all of a sudden, sometimes it took a few years, so new parts would not fit older guns. On hands, I noticed differences in pin/stud sizes (or retaining screws and holes) and sometimes the shapes of the hands from the same manufacturer over the years.

So if one plans on keeping and shooting a BP revolver a lot, it probably is a good idea to buy some extra parts and save them for a future time of need.

Gus

 

[dickydalton]

Good advice Artificer. Every time I buy a new gun I get a new mainspring, a couple complete hands and a couple trigger/bolt springs. I already have bought a few hammers and triggers and screw sets. If I have time I can try to make the springs but just in case.....

P.S.
My C-Series 1851 Colt had the hand spring break on the 2nd or third cylinder I fired.

 

[M. De Land]

Yeah, I agree, you don't want a hand nose as hard as a trigger tip but good hands are not soft by any means
and neither are ratchet teeth.
A file will cut either readily but you can tell they do have some hardness. My guess would be 35-40 Rockwell.
A barrel will usually be in the 28-32 Rockwell C scale range if I remember correctly and hand noses and ratchet teeth are harder than barrel steel from what I can tell using a file.

 

[Artificer]

I WISH I had thought to check many muzzleloading parts with the Rockwell Tester we had at the RTE Shop at Quantico. I don't know if this helps, but here are some items I did test:

WWII and earlier M1911 and M1911A1 "Soft" Slides ran 15 to 23 on the C Scale. The frames did not register on the C Scale.

An original Sharps and Hankins, WBTS Navy Carbine "Cone" or nipple ran 46 on the C scale. The only reason I know that was because I tested a broken one to see how hard it was when I made a replacement for it.

Gus

 

[ccmountainman]

I've noticed the same thing, when I replenish stock.
Had a BP store for a few years, now do it as a hobby.
I'm finding screws, hands, springs, rarely are a match any more.
Been telling customers they will likely have to finish fit or adapt in someway.
Sometime one from VTI or a direct Pietta importer will match better, sometimes not.
So when I find a reasonable deal on used parts I will grab it. Hopefully matching older guns better.
Now I have people send me their part. I try to match from there.
We believe Pietta did some retooling a couple years ago. But what all did they change? That we don't know for sure.

 

[Artificer]

I've noticed the same thing, when I replenish stock.
Had a BP store for a few years, now do it as a hobby.
I'm finding screws, hands, springs, rarely are a match any more.
Been telling customers they will likely have to finish fit or adapt in someway.
Sometime one from VTI or a direct Pietta importer will match better, sometimes not.
So when I find a reasonable deal on used parts I will grab it. Hopefully matching older guns better.
Now I have people send me their part. I try to match from there.
We believe Pietta did some retooling a couple years ago. But what all did they change? That we don't know for sure.

I used to buy parts directly from Navy Arms, Euro Arms, Taylor's, and also from Dixie and some other places. Like you, as the parts changed, I had to ask around and look for old parts.

Also, I've found that SOME parts work better in other manufacturer's guns than in their own guns or some times one or two parts work better than their own parts.

Finally, there are some revolvers (and other BP guns) manufactured over the years that had such bad quality of parts, it wasn't worth stocking parts and trying to fix the guns, as they would fail so quickly after being fixed.

Gus