Getting started engraving ??
- Thread starter Bubba45
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
Brownells has a nice starter kit.
I would recomend you stay away from any machine engravers for the time you are learning. They are VERY expencive, and they come with NO instructions at all. The companies that make them try to rope you into taking classes from them, and all those classes cost more then the machines will cost.
All you need is 3-5 tools and a hammer, with an engravers ball/vice, and the time to teach yourself. A few good books are a lot of help.
Teach yourself the skills, and don't fall into the mindset that you need to spend a lot of money. You will spend enough as you buy tools and learn to use them, but to start out it won't be bad at all.
Feel free to e-mail me and we'll talk. I may be able to help you in some small way. I am by no means a master engraver, but I do ok.
Steve Zihn
I would recomend you stay away from any machine engravers for the time you are learning. They are VERY expencive, and they come with NO instructions at all. The companies that make them try to rope you into taking classes from them, and all those classes cost more then the machines will cost.
All you need is 3-5 tools and a hammer, with an engravers ball/vice, and the time to teach yourself. A few good books are a lot of help.
Teach yourself the skills, and don't fall into the mindset that you need to spend a lot of money. You will spend enough as you buy tools and learn to use them, but to start out it won't be bad at all.
Feel free to e-mail me and we'll talk. I may be able to help you in some small way. I am by no means a master engraver, but I do ok.
Steve Zihn
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2003
- Messages
- 6,535
- Reaction score
- 1,515
I pretty much second Steves advise, but would add that Lynton McKenzies first tape in his series would be a big help. You will learn how to properly sharpen the gravers, very important, and get started doing simple cuts. I would suggest that you buy the tape first off in order to get a better understanding of what tools you need. I find little need for the engravers ball vise. I think you can learn to work around that. I made one out of a bowling ball that works well enough, but seldom use it. I do 90% of my work with the parts on the gun, or mounted in a regular vise
Mike Brooks
Cannon
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2005
- Messages
- 6,686
- Reaction score
- 35
Engraving was THE most difficult thing to learn for me. I took a class that Lynton McKinzie taught bak in 1987. It was a long row to hoe after that.
I do all of my engraving with 3 Momax cobalt 1/8" square engravers that are sharpened differently. For American longriflke work I find that these are all I need.
I use my versa vise to hold blocks of wood that I glue the rifle parts to before engraving. My chasing hammer is an old small brass hammer. My graver holder is a 4" long 5/8" bolt....no rocket science here. :haha:
I do all of my engraving with 3 Momax cobalt 1/8" square engravers that are sharpened differently. For American longriflke work I find that these are all I need.
I use my versa vise to hold blocks of wood that I glue the rifle parts to before engraving. My chasing hammer is an old small brass hammer. My graver holder is a 4" long 5/8" bolt....no rocket science here. :haha:
Mike Brooks
Cannon
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2005
- Messages
- 6,686
- Reaction score
- 35
Yep, it has a set screw so I can quickly take the graver out to sharpen, which is all I seem to do on some projects.... My brass hammer must be 2oz or less I suppose. :hmm:
Thank You Topper and Bubba, for your kind words.
Good point Mike, about Lynton McKinzie's tape. I would agree totally. It's excellent.
You can learn more from watching him for 3 hours than you can teach yourself in 6 months.
Good sharpening stones are something you need, and don't get discouraged if you find you spend a LOT of time sharpening when you are first learing. It's just part of the game.
Keep going even when you think you "will never get it"
You will........
just don't give up
Good point Mike, about Lynton McKinzie's tape. I would agree totally. It's excellent.
You can learn more from watching him for 3 hours than you can teach yourself in 6 months.
Good sharpening stones are something you need, and don't get discouraged if you find you spend a LOT of time sharpening when you are first learing. It's just part of the game.
Keep going even when you think you "will never get it"
You will........
just don't give up
flashpanner
45 Cal.
- Joined
- Dec 31, 2004
- Messages
- 564
- Reaction score
- 0
I made a engraving ball from a discarded bowling ball. The price was right, it was FREE! I made a stand/dish for it from some discarded FREE oak pallets. I used my router to put a flat spot on the ball to mount a piece of wood on it for a clamping surface. I then hold down my piece with some screws on the wood block. The ball allows me to gimball it all aroud and there is enough mass (10# blowing ball, duh) to keep things in place when tapping on gravers.
I'd like to add a question to the subject - I break the tip off of my gravers after about a few minutes of tapping with the hammer. I started with a 50 degree face angle, went to 55 degree, 60 degree and down to 45 degree with the same results - the "wetting-up" angle is 10 - 15 degrees. The gravers are from Fred Miller and also some made from O1 harded & tempered tool steel (60 on the Rockwell "C" scale). The practice plates are 1018 cold rolled steel What gives :cursing:
Mike Brooks
Cannon
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2005
- Messages
- 6,686
- Reaction score
- 35
Cold rolled steel has a lot of hard spots in it. I'd recommend learning on brass practice plates.
hawkeye1755
54 Cal.
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2005
- Messages
- 1,775
- Reaction score
- 0
SteveSteve Zihn said:Brownells has a nice starter kit.
I would recomend you stay away from any machine engravers for the time you are learning. They are VERY expencive, and they come with NO instructions at all. The companies that make them try to rope you into taking classes from them, and all those classes cost more then the machines will cost.
All you need is 3-5 tools and a hammer, with an engravers ball/vice, and the time to teach yourself. A few good books are a lot of help.
Teach yourself the skills, and don't fall into the mindset that you need to spend a lot of money. You will spend enough as you buy tools and learn to use them, but to start out it won't be bad at all.
Feel free to e-mail me and we'll talk. I may be able to help you in some small way. I am by no means a master engraver, but I do ok.
Steve Zihn
Don't underrate yourself. :nono:
The work from you what i saw was fantastic.
:hatsoff:
- Joined
- Aug 25, 2003
- Messages
- 6,535
- Reaction score
- 1,515
Find and try cobalt gravers for steel. They last much better on any material. I find steel almost easier than brass.
paulvallandigham
Passed On
- Joined
- Jan 9, 2006
- Messages
- 17,537
- Reaction score
- 94
The tools may be hardened but not tempered. That makes them as brittle as a file is. The cut, but you have to be very gentle with them, I suspect that you are using too heavy a hammer, and hitting the tools too hard. It takes a while to develope a rhythm to keep a line growing, I was told to first practice my technique using a pice of lead sheeting.
The other tip I can extend to you I learned watching an Engraver work at Dixon's Gummaker's Fair a couple of years ago. His hammer's handle was bent down at a .45 degree angle, allowing him to hold the graver so the point was towards him, and not away from him. His left hand held the hammer above and in front of him, so he could tap towards himself. This allowed him to better control the angle of the graver, and thus the depth of the cut, while giving him full view of the point of the graver as it cut metal. He could speed up or slow down as needed to stay on his lines.
By inference, this technique also allows you to see how the metal is cutting under the graver, so that if you do hit a hard spot, or occlusion, or vug, you can slow down and change angles to protect your graver's point.
The other tip I can extend to you I learned watching an Engraver work at Dixon's Gummaker's Fair a couple of years ago. His hammer's handle was bent down at a .45 degree angle, allowing him to hold the graver so the point was towards him, and not away from him. His left hand held the hammer above and in front of him, so he could tap towards himself. This allowed him to better control the angle of the graver, and thus the depth of the cut, while giving him full view of the point of the graver as it cut metal. He could speed up or slow down as needed to stay on his lines.
By inference, this technique also allows you to see how the metal is cutting under the graver, so that if you do hit a hard spot, or occlusion, or vug, you can slow down and change angles to protect your graver's point.
