Gosh dang it I need help.

[paulvallandigham]

The fact that the gun can shoot the first two round to a small group makes me think the problem is not inside the barrel. That would eliminate lead buildup, rough bore, and even choice of powder, ball, and patch. Do wash your pillow ticking before using it, and lube it with wonderlube, or bore butter, or use the olive oil, beeswax and alcohol mixture that some are advocating for patch lube. I have been using the 1000 lube for years without complaints.

I had a friend who was shooting a CVA hawken that fired a couple of rounds like yours, and then sprayed balls all over the range. Only when he let the gun cool down did he get shots back in the black, and then only 2 rounds before it began acting up again. His gun had two or three barrel wedges in it, and he found that the one in the middle needed a sledge hammer to get it out! Once he took it out, he could not get it back in. The stock was warped in the middle of the forearm. He left that key out, and shot the gun without it. It shot into a small group all day long! So, his problem was with a warped stock, and tight barrel key. The problem was so similar to what you are describing that I thought I might mention it to you, so you can check this out. Try shooting with only one barrel key in the stock, whether you have two or three, or whatever. Obviously, if you only have one key, then removing wood from the stock, or getting a new stock is in order. I personally ran into this same problem with a modern .30-30 Winchester rifle, and removed a lot of wood from the forend to fix the problem. But it was fixed.

 

[buckknife]

That patch could look alot better if that was the one shot with 30gr of powder and a wad of some sort.I think you have got some good advice here and i agree with cayugad that you need to check the bore.whats a patch look like that has been shot with 80gr of powder and no wad?
i will tell you a little story about my first traditional type gun.it was a cva hawkins that had been set around much like yours for the last 25 YEARS.When i got it there was a little rust toward the last inch of the muzzle.A couple of patches showed only a very slight rust.Well this thing loaded very hard with a .015 patch and they looked like they had been run threw a meat grinder.I had some that look like the patch in the pitcure but most were a lot worse.
With the advise from some more knoledgble people about shooten roundballs i was told to take a clean dry patch of flannel that is used for cleaning the bore and slowly in one stroke run it down the barrel.if it stops any ware or like mine stop in a lot of places chances are you have a rough bore from either rust pitting or something else.After 25 years if it wasnt lubed on a regular bases it could be pitting from rust.Remember mine didnt look real rusty either.
i was told to use steel wool on a jag with peroixid.Well i did and besides the pitting it opened up a lot of wounds in the barrel to find probably 3 times as much pitting as i felt on the dry patch test.barrels was no good for round ball but would manage 3 inch groups at 50 yards with conicals,but that was before i did the steel wool thing.Im hopen this isnt your case and like cayugad says it may just have some rough rifling.
Also leading could be a factor and i would go after that first before trying any laping with any compound.Tere is a lot of good products to get the lead out,then i would try the dry patch slowley down the bore in on long strock to see if it holds up anywares.
also if your run that dry patch down and suddenly there is no resistant at all there is the posibility of a ringed barrel.that happens when a roundball is not seasted down on the powder qand a air space is left.On ignition the ball acts as an obstruction in the bore and the barrel can acutally swell there.Same can happen when a conical slips of the charge,meaning the loose fitting bullet slid forward when the gun was pointed down and had a air space inbetween the bullet and powder.
Lets hope this is not whats going on with the gun.Get the lead out first if any then do the dry patch down the bore when your sure its time.
We had this same disscussion here about a year ago with a feller and a used gpr,the culprit ended up being a ringed barrel.
Thats my 2 cents if its worth that much :haha:

 

[Forster]

I'm no expert and these guys know a heck of a lot more that me but I was thinking, Looking at your patch it is a bit off centered. I use a 54/56 cal patch for my 50, I found that more than once I have had a 50 cal patch go down a bit off center and throw flyers. I find the bigger patches to be more forgiving. Just my thoughts, Jim

 

[catskin]

I want to thank you guys for all the great suggestions and advise - I printed out this thread and showed it to some of the local guru's (who will never get this computer thing) and they were equally impressed with the level of knowlage displayed here.

Thanks again, I will keep working on it and let you know how things shake out.

 

I agree with Stone Bridge, that patch looks as if it may not be big enough. Just for fun, try cutting at the muzzle or just use a bigger patch. Good luck.
:hatsoff:

 

[catskin]

I bought some walmart ticking today - I just finished washing it and it's drying now