GPR to a trekking rifle

[M. De Land]

Well of course do what suits your fancy but in my experience adequate performance trumps handyness. Barrels cut shorter than forearms look odd and you can't put it back once it's gone.
The extra barrel idea is a good one.
Opinions vary but having hunt Alaska for 41 years annually, often in the alders as well, I've never seen the need for excessively short barrels. Probably because I don't drag animals but rather cut them up and pack them in which case you don't sling a rifle but carry it in your hands generally. Mike D

 

[Loyalist Dave]

I was sincere in my question guys... I have a TC New Englander with a 1:48 twist and a 26" barrel so that's slightly more than a 1/2 twist to the ball..., so why not 1:78 if it's not a big deal to stabilize the bullet with a 1/2 turn when a 1/3 turn will do? OR is it beyond 50 yards when problems would happen unless I had a really hot load?

LD

 

[Zonie]

You seem to think the barrel length and the rate of twist somehow effect one another.

If the barrel has a 1:48 twist the ball or bullet will be turning one full turn every 48 inches if it is shot out of a 48 inch long barrel or a 12 inch long barrel. The barrel length has no effect on the number of revolutions per inch, foot or yard.

The barrel length does have an effect on velocity with a given powder load and the velocity is directly related to the speed that the ball/bullet rotates.

This speed of rotation is very important with elongated bullets that need to spin at high speeds to stabilize them. Stabilizing a elongated bullet keeps it from tumbling.

Speed of rotation isn't very important on a roundball because roundballs won't "tumble" or go "end over end" If the roundball is spinning fast enough to offset the air pressures that are trying to deflect it then it will do fine.

 

[galamb]

The "barrel makers" all have their "own formula" for determining twist. Some of it is based on loose science, some on tradition and yet others seem to pick a twist out of the air.

50 cal, standard offerings:

Green Mountain: 1:70, 1:28
Colerain: 1:56
Rice: 1:66
Long Hammock: 1:70
Lyman: 1:48, 1:60, 1:32
Other production: 1:24, 1:28, 1:48, 1:66

So just comparing Colerain and Green Mountain, a 28" Colerain will give you half a twist but you need a 35" Green Mountain to give you half a turn.

Does a Colerain give you "MORE" stabilization? you can argue that - in either case the barrel is far more accurate than the abilities of the "majority" of shooters.

Forsyth showed twist of above 1:100 were not only viable, but quite accurate, but only if the rifling depth was considerably more shallow than is common on production barrels today.

And how far do you want to shoot anyhow? 100 yards, 200 yards, 300 yards??

If it's under 100 then as you note, a smooth bore will do that - any stabilization at all below that range with a PRB is just "bonus"..

 

[AWsaddles]

Another thing to consider is usually pistol shooter shoots a considerable amount less powder than a rifle of the same caliber.

While rpm is directly related to bullet stabilization,it is achieved by a combination of velocity and rate of twist per inch.

If a bullet is turning at say the amount of 1 revolution per foot at a set velocity and you double the velocity it is still only turning at the 1 revolution per foot but at a much higher revolution per min or in shooting case revolution per fraction of second.

Since a pistol is usually fired with a lighter load and less velocity it takes a faster spin in rifling to achieve the needed rpm to stabilize a bullet that rifle could

 

[M. De Land]

Mike, I had a 50 caliber TC half stock that I ringed shooting maxi balls. The bulge was about seven inches back from the muzzle so I cut and re-crowned the barrel at 20 inches and It looked so dorky I replaced it with a new 1 x 34 inch .54 caliber from Douglas. Wasn't very accurate either but I don't think that was because of the shorter length.
I still have that rifle and it is a good shooter. Mike D.

 

[excess650]

"Anyone can spout theory if they're not the ones packing."

This forum is notorious (sp) for the short barrel haters. This fellow is calling his gun a trekking rifle. Heaven forbid that he would call it a canoe gun. Then we could have a real field day telling him what he can't and shouldn't do.

Yep I have one of them thar canoe/buggy rifles in .40 caliber. It shoots just fine with it's 16 in barrel and is more accurate than I am. Carries very well in thick brush light as a feather too. Oh and it's got sling swivels too.

Yowzers that thing is short!

I have a TC Grey Hawk (24"), TC White Mountain Carbine (21"), TC New Englander (26") in addition to other, longer rifles. The Grey Hawk is noticeably handier than the New Englander despite only 2" less barrel. The WMC is like a toy.

I do some hunting in a laurel thicket, and have used up to a 32" barrel, but find the shorter barrels handier. IF my shots were limited to 50 yards or less I would have no qualms about shooting a 20" .50 with PRB.

If that LGP was mine, I would be looking for another rifle with shorter barrel I think that I paid less than $200 for my WMC and it has swivel studs and a peep sight.

 

[gunmaker43]

This shorty weighs 4 1/4 lb. Tho not a rifle. 26" 24 bore "trekker" gun. Easy carry & accurate to 50 + yd. with a PRB and deady on birds with #6 or #7 shot.....Tom

 

[ncmtmike]

Well Folks,after the weather changed here,I got out an about,and came across this T/C Renegade,26" barrel,it don't use a rock,but you can't have everything all the time :shake: so i got it a good price,guy even threw in a couple tins of caps. So I thank each an everyone who has made a contribution to this thread,guess I now own a cap-gun :haha:

 

[gunmaker43]

so go shootin' Tom

 

[BrownBear]

This shorty weighs 4 1/4 lb. Tho not a rifle. 26" 24 bore "trekker" gun. Easy carry & accurate to 50 + yd. with a PRB and deady on birds with #6 or #7 shot.....Tom

Maybe not a rifle, but that little gem is as close as I've ever seen to what would be an "all around" gun for my needs.... Small, light, accurate while deadly on birds. Easy to picture myself lugging it through the hills all day every day and happily feeding myself and my family with it.

Ummmmmmm........ Sounds like trekking to me! :hatsoff:

 

[frogwalking]

Hey Mike. You can take a hacksaw and shorten the rifle. File it good and square. Use a countersink to recrown it. Cut a new front sight dovetail with your hacksaw and a triangle file with the teeth ground off one flat. You will need to probably move one or more thimbles, install the swivels and you are done. You don't need a gunsmith for that, a good hobby builder can do it. Find one near-by or do it yourself. It is your gun. Fix it any way you want it.

 

[gunmaker43]

It is a joy in itself. I've made 5 of those this year, all flintlocks, 3 for some local trekkers, 1 to NY & 1 to CA....Have 2 more in planning stages. 32 bore X 34" bbl. & 16 bore X 26" bbl......Tom

 

[M. De Land]

Nice looking guns Tom and in 26 inch barrel length about as handy and functional as they come.
That 54 Renegade will make a very good walk about rifle as well me thinks.
I have one of the old 26 inch heavy barreled Navy Arms Hawken Hunters in .58 cal and it sure is handy in the brush although heavy with the thick barrel they have. Mike D.

 

[excess650]

This shorty weighs 4 1/4 lb. Tho not a rifle. 26" 24 bore "trekker" gun. Easy carry & accurate to 50 + yd. with a PRB and deady on birds with #6 or #7 shot.....Tom

Tom,
Do you have any more pictures? That thing is a flyweight!

edit: I discovered that by clicking on the picture I was able to find many more photos.

 

[gunmaker43]

It is a "lite" carry,as I said made quite a few this year. Here's another. Tom

"Indianed up"