H & R .58 cal

[D Sanders]

A friend of mine has a .58 cal H & R muzzleloader for sale. It looks a lot like a civil war Zouave, but it has a half stock. Has anyone heard of such a rifle and what it may be worth? It looks to be in very good condition. He is asking $350.00 for it I cannot find anything on the web to give me any information about the rifle.

Hawken Hunter

 

[torn moc]

Thats a Great price on a Great rifle!!!
I had a .45 H&R Springfield that would shoot the eyes off a gnat at 75 yds.
I would advise to grab that deal QUICK!
you dont see the .58's very often.
post some photos after you bring it home!!!

 

[RADeO]

My 1977 Dixie Gun Works catalogue shows a rifle as you describe. It is called a "Springfield Stalker" and was available in both .45 and .58 caliber.

The cataloge description indicated it as a redesign of the H&R .45-70 Trapdoor carbine, sharing the same lock, butt plate, and trigger guard as the cartridge guns.

Listed price in 1977 was $185.

 

[SCATTERSHOT]

Yep, it's a Springfield Stalker. As noted above, it uses the same action as the 45/70 Trapdoor carbine, so it has four clicks to full ****. This takes some getting used to, but after you do it a few times you'll love the gun!

BTW, they also made them in .45 caliber. I bought one that was made in .45, and the bore was so bad I had it reamed out to 20 gauge smoothbore as a "foraging gun", and it works great as a smoothie, too.

 

[spud]

I still got your .45 stalker scalper and it shoots great!

 

[Swampman]

http://www.xmission.com/~drudy/hist_text-arch5/msg01097.html

 

[Zonie]

My 1980 Dixie Gunworks Catalog doesn't show it.

The 1980 catalog does show a H&R "Huntsman" muzzleloader but it is one of the early attempts to make one of those modern things.

Tha lack of a "Springfield Stalker" kinda indicates that they were not produced in 1980 so that should give an indication of how old the gun mentioned in the post is.

IMO, the $350 being asked might be a little on the high side unless the gun is in pristine condition.

If it has the little dings and rust pits that are often seen on muzzleloading guns that are 30 years old I would think a fairer value would be in the $250- $300 range.

 

[bob308]

great shooting rifles. but i too think it is over priced. there have been 2 of them in .58 on the net for a year now one onauction arms and one on gun broker. both starting at $350. no takers.

 

[torn moc]

The Springfied Stalker is listed in my 1974 catalogue....
Yes Spud...I know you like the one I traded you...( plus the Fact that it has your fathers makers mark on it makes it very special ! )
Actually the $350 pricetag is reasonable onsidering the high quality of these arms and comparing to todays prices it is a Steal !

 

[Swampman]

Are these guns anything like the guns that Val Fogget (of Navy Arms) used in Africa?

 

[torn moc]

correction: Val Forgett
Martinsburg WV.

Great man! Have done much trading with him.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Forgett used a carbine version of the Zouave rifle and a heavy half stock that sort of resembled a T/C "Hawken". The H&R actually used the lock and some bits from their trapdoor repros--hence the four click lockwork.

 

[longcruise]

Does this rifle break open like a single shot shotgun in order to cap it?

 

[bingo1952]

No it is a muzzleloader that looks like a Trapdoor carbine.

 

[musketman]

A friend of mine has a .58 cal H & R muzzleloader for sale. It looks a lot like a civil war Zouave, but it has a half stock. Has anyone heard of such a rifle and what it may be worth? It looks to be in very good condition. He is asking $350.00 for it I cannot find anything on the web to give me any information about the rifle.

Hawken Hunter

Isn't this an inline rifle?

 

[RADeO]

No, its not one of them "unmentionables" :grin:
It looks very similar to a Trapdoor carbine, except for the fact that it loads from the proper direction, unlike the Trapdoor. :rotf:

 

[longcruise]

No it is a muzzleloader that looks like a Trapdoor carbine.

I know what the Stalker looks like, but from his description of the rifle it could either be a Stalker or an H&R Huntsman.

The Huntsman was an ok rifle (albeit an in-line :shocked2: ) but it was inclined to shoot the lock up loose. There was no permanent cure for it. It was a poor design. Currently NEF makes the H&R products and produce a newly designed Huntsman with an improved lock up.

If his rifle is a Huntsman it is for sure the older poorly built lock up cause that was the only one they made in a .58. There was also a .45 Huntsman made back then.

I bought one of .58s back around 76 or 77. It was very accurate with a prb and a conical but it did indeed shoot loose eventually. I sold it a few years ago to a guy who was well aware of it's shortcomings and felt it was fixable. I got $150 for it and felt lucky. Used the proceeds to buy a Traditions Deerhunter kit in .50 cal for the wife. Best upgrade I ever made in an ml gun.

 

[Swampman]

Neither the Huntsman or the Sidekick(both excellent guns) are currently in production. Remington has them back on the drawing board to improve things that folks don't like.

 

[Zonie]

Well, I'm not sure about the Stalker but the Huntsman is definitely an "In Line" so further discussion of that gun is against the Forum Rules.

As for a relative of the Trapdoor, if the Stalker has such an arrangement it too would be outside the limits of this forum as it is a later design than the typical traditional gun.

Even the Sharps with its cloth cartridge and percussion cap has been judged to be outside the limits of discussion on this forum because it was designed to load from the breech.

 

[Ken Morrison]

I had business in Denver Colorado last week. While there I visited the Bass Pro Shop.

On the used rack was an H & R .58 caliber ML Looked pretty good. Sorry I don't remember the details of the lock but it had a side hammer. Price was around $300.

Maybe someone is interested.