Hawken peep sight help

[Millsman]

Recently acquired a Hawken flintlock. With 80 year old eyes a peep sight is a need not just a want. So I purchased a Hawken 719 Vernier tang sight which the rifle was already pre-prepared to mount. Great....except....and here is my dilemma/question. Unless I lock the sight in an approximate 90 degree position and thereafter very carefully never bump the sight (fat chance) how do those of you who use this setup guarantee it stays in the same position?
I would like to carry it to the range in a cloth sleeve with the sight lowered to facilitate fit.But when elevated will my initial guesstimate of 90 degrees be an 87 or 92? At 100 yards it’s hard enough, a two or three degree difference will end any hope. Your thoughts please on how to insure returning to the original setting or how to modify the sight to insure re-indexing. Thanks.

 

[EC121]

It is simple. Once you get it where you want it, make a scratch on the swivel part and the base for a reference mark. If you want to get fancy, a knife file will work, but I use a pocket knife. Line up the marks and bang away. BTW you might find that that peep hole is too small except in the brightest light.

 

[Rifleman1776]

Been a very long time since I saw one of those. But, I seem to recall, they have/had a detent ball and spring that positioned the sight the same every time. Does yours not.
BTW, I would appreciate identifying rifles like yours as: "TC hawken" That is a completely different animule from a real Hawken.

 

[Kansas Jake]

If none of those things work, my immediate thought was to make a 90 degree gauge that uses the barrel to index the vertical position of the sight. It would have to have some cut outs to go over the sight mount, but something in brass or blued steel would look neat.

 

[Semisane]

Mine has a spring loaded detent ball as referred to by Rifleman1776. Perhaps the ball on yours is stuck in its channel and not engaging the detent.

 

[bubba.50]

That was a pretty major drawback on those T/C ladder sights. Teehey tend to not be very stable & move around a lot under recoil. Needs a constant eye on it.


As for “not callin’ it a Hawken”, that’s what T/C called it so that’s what I’d call it.

 

[Millsman]

Thanks to all who responded. I immediately looked to see if there was a detent ball and there is not, however......there is a small hole on the exterior of the sight base which can be lined up with a matching hole in what I will call the sight swivel. By inserting a small nail or brad in the exterior hole and using the nail to engage the hole in the sight swivel then locking the sight with the locking screw you have an indexing of the sight. Again my thanks to those who responded.

 

[BrownBear]

Mine has a spring loaded detent ball as referred to by Rifleman1776. Perhaps the ball on yours is stuck in its channel and not engaging the detent.

Same here. Works great, and I even leave the sight flat till I need it in the woods.

I wonder if there's an "age" thing at work with earlier (or later) models having the detent while others don't I've seen that kind of transition over time in other TC products, and in other brands as a matter of fact.

 

[BlackHillsBob]

i did something different on my main squeeze side lock. im your age also but for some reason my eyes are getting better with age. i took a nice open sight and silver soldered a washer to it to make it a peep ghost ring sight.it is the same as a peep only on the barrel and even look traditional even if its not. its on my mountain man side lock 50 i built for my self. i think the supplements i take have really worked to make my eyes improve instead of go bad. i have a soule sight on my 45/70 and really like it.

 

[Steve Milbocker]

EC121 has a good point. I have MVA vernier sights on several non muzzleloading rifles. The ones I hunt with have the aperture drilled out to 7/64" and that works quite well. Peeps are a wonderful thing for those of us with less than stellar eyesight that wish to shoot irons on rifles that would be a sacrilege to put glass on

 

[Irish lad]

The Hadley adjustable disc is a nifty gadget too.
Irish

 

[F.G. Ford]

Hi,
Those "Hawken" vernier sights had a nasty habit of breaking one side or the other of the tower that holds the aperture, so be careful when folding forward or back.
I believe they are made of some kind of brittle metal.
I have two that are broken.
The small ball and spring was the first thing lost when taking the sight apart.
Question: Was that a period nail, or did you use a square nail?
Good idea of using the nail to keep the sight vertical.
Fred

 

[Brian Mcdonald]

I had the same trouble with the rear sight on my new flintlock hawken style rifle i purchased last fall. It came with a nice adjustable buckhorn that i believe is the same as on the lyman gpr. I could never shoot it very consistently as my 67 year old eyes couldnt see the rear notch & the front sight at the same time. I finally used a chainsaw file to round out the inside of the rear sight, turning it into a huge ghost ring & now im happy again. I now get good consistent hunting accuracy, maybe 3 inch groups at 80 yards. I use a pretty loose patch for easy fast reloads so im not trying for max accuracy.

 

[Kansas Jake]

That will never work. It is just a big hole with an open space on top.

Actually, that is a very creative idea for us older guys.

 

[Brian Mcdonald]

That will never work. It is just a big hole with an open space on top.

Actually, that is a very creative idea for us older guys.

It works for me, & an unintended benifit is that i dont notice movement of the lock or the flash any more so i dont flinch so much.

 

[32 ballard xl]

I had the same trouble with the rear sight on my new flintlock hawken style rifle i purchased last fall. It came with a nice adjustable buckhorn that i believe is the same as on the lyman gpr. I could never shoot it very consistently as my 67 year old eyes couldnt see the rear notch & the front sight at the same time. I finally used a chainsaw file to round out the inside of the rear sight, turning it into a huge ghost ring & now im happy again. I now get good consistent hunting accuracy, maybe 3 inch groups at 80 yards. I use a pretty loose patch for easy fast reloads so im not trying for max accuracy.

View attachment 10676

That used to be called a Buckhorn sight. Later called a full-buckhorn sight. Marble's still make them.

 

[Dead-Eye]

You know, I used to wonder the same thing every time I watched "Quigley down under" and Tom Selleck would just raise that tower, lock it in place, and shot that bucket at 1200 yards. I learned about the indexing pin later.

Jim

 

[Griz44Mag]

You know, I used to wonder the same thing every time I watched "Quigley down under" and Tom Selleck would just raise that tower, lock it in place, and shot that bucket at 1200 yards. I learned about the indexing pin later.

Jim

(Don't believe everything you see in the movies!) LOL.

 

[Dead-Eye]

You're right there! And, to be truthful, although I wouldn't mind being Mathew Quigley (or Tom Selleck, for that matter), I really watched that movie to see Laura San Giacomo (crazy Cora).

Jim

 

[WRustyLane]

Yep, she's a beaut, really!