Help me identify this flintlock

[RatherDashing]

I'm new here, and new to flintlocks. I finally picked up one at a gun show for cheap that needed some work. Would you guys help me identify this musket? The only markings on it is "69 cal". It is missing a ramrod, and I need too know the right size and style to replace it, correct? It is also missing the brass near the muzzle and I would like to find a part for that. Any info would be helpful. And yes, I do know what the other firearm I purchased is (Vz 24).

 

[azmntman]

more pics please

 

[BigBoreBLR]

Cva and hi standard make these affordable 2 piece stock rifles in the 70s, cva were made in spain, hi standard by miroku in japan. The patchbox and stock bar stock style trigger and the lock show it. Someone added a tower style hammer and maybe jazzed up the ram rod thkmbles. 5/16ths rod right?

Some warn people the guns not safe to shoot, it got the cap version and load 40gr fffg goex in it. I'm still here 10 fingers 2 eyes.

Rework where the trigger pivot pin closer to the sear. Makes a day n night difference in the trigger feel.

It's a customised jukar. Just remembered the name.

 

[BigBoreBLR]

If I'm right, that's the 2 piece barrel, that's the one people say not to shoot.

My hi standard is the 1 piece octogon barrel from breech to muzzle.

Is that an actual 69 cal barrel, or is it a 45 cal?

You could carefully use a drill bit end as a sizing guide.

For a 45 cal a 7/16ths will fit in but not a 1/2.

A 69 cal a 11/16th may or may not fit a 21/32ths will.

 

[ohio ramrod]

The stock is two piece, not the barrel! :hmm:

 

[BigBoreBLR]

Need better pics too, but the octogon could thread into the round portion. Some jukar riflea were like that. Barrel length would be helpful too.

 

[RatherDashing]

The whole thing is about 47inches long, the barrel being around 31 inches. The stock is two piece. I do not know if the barrel threads into the octagon section or not. I measured the bore, and it is indeed 69cal. Very temped to load in some paintballs....

Any help is appreciated, I am completely new to flintlocks. Also, what do you think it is worth, and is it safe to shoot?

 

[BigBoreBLR]

Disregard what I said, the closeups and bore definitely not make it what it appeared to me from the first pic.

 

[Mickc01]

Welcome to the board, Mr Rather Dashing. :hatsoff:
That gun definitely looks like one made in the late 60's or 70's. And I could be wrong but don't think it's a CVA or Jukar. In any case, would be VERY leary about shooting it. If you do, I suggest strapping it to a tire and test firing it from a distance the first time. Can't ever be too safe. Just my 2 cents....Mick

 

[TFoley]

The whole thing is about 47inches long, the barrel being around 31 inches. The stock is two piece. I do not know if the barrel threads into the octagon section or not. I measured the bore, and it is indeed 69cal. Very temped to load in some paintballs....

Any help is appreciated, I am completely new to flintlocks. Also, what do you think it is worth, and is it safe to shoot?

From what I've seen of the single example of this gun here in UK, it seems to me that it's already in the best place you could put it - on the wall.

Two-piece barrels are not permitted here in UK - any suspicion that the barrel is actually sectional at any part forward of the breech-plug, if fitted - is an automatic 'fail' at the 'first view' in either of the two proof-houses.

tac

 

[Zonie]

Just looking at the pictures, it does appear to be a 2 piece barrel with the round part screwed into the octagon part.

That said, it would be worthwhile to run a cleaning patch on a cleaning jag down the bore.

If the patch seems to "hang up" for any reason when it reaches or goes past the front of the octagon, I'd proclaim it to be an "Offical Wall Hanger".

Although I haven't seen one first hand it has been reported that the screwed in round part of the barrel often has a gap or even a mismatch between its bore and the bore in the octagon.

If this is true, it will rip up any patches that are shot from it.
It also might even be unsafe to fire.

 

[RatherDashing]

I think I have figured it out. I believe it is a Ultra-Hi Japanese reproduction made in the 70's. I have read that some of their stuff is junk, while others is so-so. What I need now is the brass piece at the end and a ramrod. Suggestions on where to find either of those?

 

[simonbeans]

I have seen a few of those "guns". In my most polite voice,
"that's a piece of junk". On the wall or as a fence post would be my use of that thing.

 

[Zonie]

I think I have figured it out. I believe it is a Ultra-Hi Japanese reproduction made in the 70's. I have read that some of their stuff is junk, while others is so-so. What I need now is the brass piece at the end and a ramrod. Suggestions on where to find either of those?

Track of the Wolf sells brass ramrod tips at a real reasonable price.
https://www.trackofthewolf.com/list/Item.aspx/847/1

You might also want to read these links about ramrods
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/...p?tid/195826/post/290073/fromsearch/1/#290073
http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/...tid/287268/post/1376432/fromsearch/1/#1376432

 

[rijerolmon]

If you can locate a machine shop or garage in your area that has a fiber optic scope then you can get a good look at the bore. I believe that you are looking for a brass nose cap, take some measurements and check with Track of the Wolf for one that can be made to fit.

 

[Wes/Tex]

Just looking at the pictures, it does appear to be a 2 piece barrel with the round part screwed into the octagon part.

That said, it would be worthwhile to run a cleaning patch on a cleaning jag down the bore.

As I understand it, the Japanese version was a two piece screw-in arrangement but the Spanish was one-piece. Or so the story went back in the day. They were imported by Arms International as both "Kentucky Long Rifle" and "Minuteman Muzzle-Loader". The only difference seems to be a hinged patchbox lid on teh "Kentucky" since they're both .69 smoothbores. Libety Arms called them "Tower Flintlock Rifle" and came in two versions...regular or 'Deluxe'...polished & plated for an extra $15.00.

 

[Turtle Creek]

If the quality of the lock is indicative of the rest of the piece I'd simply display it.

 

[Pete44ru]

I've never before seen (in over 50 years) a forend cap with a rear edge slanted that (wrong ?) way.

 

[Wes/Tex]

I've never before seen (in over 50 years) a forend cap with a rear edge slanted that (wrong ?) way.

You missed all the fun years! :wink: :haha:

 

[MSW]

one guy's free advice, but here goes:

I believe that you have a two piece barrel, which I would not shoot if it were my choice. if you insist on trying to shoot this, I would do so using a string, and put something solid between yourself and the gun when you do so.

since there's a ring where the joint puts the two barrel pieces together, I doubt that you'll ever get much by way of accuracy out of this gun.

it does look kinda cool, in a decorative 'man cave' sort of way, and I would go ahead and use it in that capacity.

one guy's advice: free and doubtless well worth the price!