High humidity reeks havoc

[CaptainVane]

High humidity in Maryland today. Went to range. With T7 it was frustrating.
My ‘48 Colt .31 pocket didnt do too bad except accuracy was off compared to normal.
But the ‘51 Navy .36, i can usually get 6 or 7 cylinders before it wants a disassembly and wipe down. Today after 2 cylinders (12shots) the fouling was so bad the cylinder would barely turn. After 3 I called it a day, besides my hands were sweating so bad the grip was sliding all over.
Maybe the little one wasnt as affected cause it takes less powder, but the Navy just did not want to be there today.
What’s your experience with powder fouling and humidity?

 

[William P Sepessy]

Humidity has been bad the last few days in this part of the country. You would think the humidity would help soften the fouling. Next week I'm going to test a new heel bullet mold in the 36 Navies and I will see what happens.

 

[wiscoaster]

...
What’s your experience with powder fouling and humidity?

I'm a black powder noob, and I was astonished at how rapidly black powder fouls the barrel. Today, I tried shooting with chamber lube and was even more astonished at how much the fouling is reduced by using the lube. Contrary to popular misbelief, as I understand it, the purpose of the lube is NOT to prevent chain fire, but to lube and clean the barrel with each shot. And by golly, I've found that's true, and it works. It doesn't really matter whether you top off the chamber with lube, or whether you lube your patch, you just use plenty of lube and it works!!

The formulas I've tried so far:
40% beeswax + 60% Crisco
40% beeswax + 60% Olive oil

The olive oil lube was a little easier to use, but I think might get too soft in really warm weather.

 

[nkbj]

Dang right wiscoaster. Lube is like the coffee you dunk a crusty cruller in.

 

[IanH]

Chamber grease DOES prevent chain fires, if it doesn't melt and run out first. It also helps keep the cylinder from caking up with fouling so badly it won't turn after the first cylinder full is fired. Barrel lubing is an important, but almost secondary benefit.

On humid days the fouling from BP can get so bad it's like black paint running all over everything. Flintlock pans and pistol cylinders/barrels condense moisture from the air as they cool from being fired, making a gooey mess. That's just part of the fun! A roll of paper towels in the range bag is your friend, and I've been known to keep an old Windex bottle full of water/Ballistol mix (10:1 or so) handy, hold the revolver upside down and slightly barrel down, and spray out the goop from the front of the cylinder pin, barrel, and frame.

 

[wiscoaster]

Chamber grease DOES prevent chain fires...

As I understand it, it's the ball's seal to the chamber wall via slightly larger ball diameter and shaving a lead ring that prevents the chain fire.

 

[IanH]

As I understand it, it's the ball's seal to the chamber wall via slightly larger ball diameter and shaving a lead ring that prevents the chain fire.

That's not always enough. Neither are lubed felt wads under the ball, but they do help a lot.

 

[wiscoaster]

That's not always enough. Neither are lubed felt wads under the ball, but they do help a lot.

Hmmm. OK, can you cite instances, or is this just your opinion? No problem with being extra cautious.

 

[IanH]

Yeah, I've had a chain fire long ago, three at once. Not fun. I thought what you thought but I was wrong. Used either Emmert's lube or whatever I had in a tube or sometimes wads ever since and never had another problem. A friend had a chain fire with just wads but I think he was using balls that were barely snug in the cylinders as he would occasionally have one back out under recoil and tie up the revolver.

Chain fires are not an old "wive's tale".

 

[M. De Land]

High humidity in Maryland today. Went to range. With T7 it was frustrating.
My ‘48 Colt .31 pocket didnt do too bad except accuracy was off compared to normal.
But the ‘51 Navy .36, i can usually get 6 or 7 cylinders before it wants a disassembly and wipe down. Today after 2 cylinders (12shots) the fouling was so bad the cylinder would barely turn. After 3 I called it a day, besides my hands were sweating so bad the grip was sliding all over.
Maybe the little one wasnt as affected cause it takes less powder, but the Navy just did not want to be there today.
What’s your experience with powder fouling and humidity?

My experience has been more troublesome on very hot dry days or very cold dry days with Black Powder. I have no clue what happens with substitutes other than Pyodex which never seemed to foul stop my guns if it would light which I found problematic on very cold days.

 

[M. De Land]

That's not always enough. Neither are lubed felt wads under the ball, but they do help a lot.

Chain firing is caused from the rear end through the nipple often as not when a cap does not cover the orifice after detonating the charge. This very often is caused by to weak a hammer spring keeping it down on the nipple after discharge. If the hammer is blown back to half cock then the spring is to weak or the nipple is washed out and letting to much gas pressure back through the orifice. Shooters tend to like light trigger pulls and they often get this by reducing the hammer spring tension.
A better route for reducing trigger pull is to install a sear lift and leave the main spring alone.

 

[nick_1]

OMG if i hear the nipple causes it one more time i am gonna puke.. its loose balls in over full chambers with sloppy powder all over the place and no lube. if it was loose caps you would think it would chain fire every time a cap falls off. I certainly know the times I had chain fires it was max loads with no lube. I could replicate it easily and did. load her up nice and full with real BP and forget to lube. chain fire. same load again with lube, no chain fire. same load again with no lube , chain fire. all you folks who claim its loose caps should go load a up a cylinder right now and only cap one nipple. shoot it and get back to us.

 

[M. De Land]

OMG if i hear the nipple causes it one more time i am gonna puke.. its loose balls in over full chambers with sloppy powder all over the place and no lube. if it was loose caps you would think it would chain fire every time a cap falls off. I certainly know the times I had chain fires it was max loads with no lube. I could replicate it easily and did. load her up nice and full with real BP and forget to lube. chain fire. same load again with lube, no chain fire. same load again with no lube , chain fire. all you folks who claim its loose caps should go load a up a cylinder right now and only cap one nipple. shoot it and get back to us.

Your wrong about that ! If the hammer blows back from to weak of a main spring or washed out nipple and the cap does not seal it off, it will chain fire eventually. Apparently your hammer is staying on the nipple through discharge and sealing from the back end.
Another occasional problem I have witnessed is out of round or misaligned with the loading rammer, chamber mouths that do not cut a full ring of lead at loading that leaves a gap in the lead seal. Over ball lube does help but does not completely stop flash over and chain fire. I've switching to under ball lubed wads and so far so good.
I've yet to have a chain fire in five decades of percussion revolver use but there is still time.
Take a look at where the fire comes out in a shot from a percussion revolver in the dark. There will be a good bit at the rear of the cylinder as well as the front and muzzle. I do wonder if some of this is not comming down the arbor port in the cylinder from the front end and bouncing off the recoil shield and out the side. I know for a fact the arbor loads up with fouling driven in from the front end.
It happens the same way it does in a flint gun that has no powder in the pan and will still fire on occasion as sparks bounce around the cock and pan some of which find their way into the vent and discharge the gun up to about a third of the time in some guns.

 

[44Bro]

Your wrong about that ! If the hammer blows back from to weak of a main spring or washed out nipple and the cap does not seal it off, it will chain fire eventually. Apparently your hammer is staying on the nipple through discharge and sealing from the back end.
Another occasional problem I have witnessed is out of round or misaligned with the loading rammer, chamber mouths that do not cut a full ring of lead at loading that leaves a gap in the lead seal. Over ball lube does help but does not completely stop flash over and chain fire. I've switching to under ball lubed wads and so far so good.
I've yet to have a chain fire in five decades of percussion revolver use but there is still time.
Take a look at where the fire comes out in a shot from a percussion revolver in the dark. There will be a good bit at the rear of the cylinder as well as the front and muzzle. I do wonder if some of this is not comming down the arbor port in the cylinder from the front end and bouncing off the recoil shield and out the side. I know for a fact the arbor loads up with fouling driven in from the front end.
It happens the same way it does in a flint gun that has no powder in the pan and will still fire on occasion as sparks bounce around the cock and pan some of which find their way into the vent and discharge the gun up to about a third of the time in some guns.

Here's what Ol' Sam had to say on the matter. Pages nine and ten. He also gives the cure in the drawing.

 

[nick_1]

over ball lube absolutely does work. how many of you have actually had chain fires and corrected them and then recreated the chain fire deliberately and then corrected it again. ?

 

[nick_1]

love how the guy who has never had a chain fire tells the person who has had chain fires, cured the problem, recreated the chain fire deliberately and then cured it again that I am wrong.

 

[French Colonial]

I quit using lube over the loaded chambers years ago, all it does is create a mess.

I use a lubed wad between the powder and ball and a ball that is tight enough to shave a ring a lead when loaded.

You guys just keep arguing until mister heavy handed moderator gets tired of reading this thread.

 

[wiscoaster]

....This very often is caused by to weak a hammer spring keeping it down on the nipple after discharge. If the hammer is blown back to half cock then the spring is to weak ....

Sorry, but that explanation makes no sense. Did you get it backwards?

Edit to add: I gotta learn to read all posts in a thread before replying.

 

[wiscoaster]

over ball lube absolutely does work. ....

May I offer an alternative theory of why it works? It's not so much that the lube "seals" the chamber as much as it's that the lube "cleans" any powder residue off the front of the cylinder as it rotates against the forcing cone? It seems to me that regardless of ignition source, if there's no powder residue anywhere outside a chamber, there's no chance of it propagating from one chamber to another.

 

[nick_1]

by the same token lube also gets that extra spilled powder soaking wet. I have shot plenty cylinders without lube and with tight balls and normal loads with no problems. i do prefer a little lube to keep the fouling soft. If I was shooting 40 +gr of real PB I would use lube. the lubed wads may work really well as others have said, I just dont want to add another step and another thing to buy.