Home made barrels

[streetsniper]

I'm still working on my barn gun and already planning my next build(all this is a wonderful obsession). Just wondering how hard it would be to make my own barrels from scratch. The subject fascinates me. The making of my own boring as well as rifling machine as well. They're made of wood, something I love to work with. My concern is the barrel stock. Do I use tubing or can I use solid stock and then bore it and ream it? I know it would be time consuming as well as labor intensive but that's what hobbies are all about. Where would I locate suitable stock. I know some old timers used pure iron so soft they could shape them with draw knives. Hand forging would require more space and equipment than I have available. Any help would be appreciated. And don't tell me I can't do it.That would only make me more determined to prove you wrong. As always your wisdom in these matters has inspired me to no end. Billy

 

[MSW]

ok, streetsniper, since you told me not to tell you you couldn't do it...

no. you can't. it's not allowed. it take way too much time and trouble. it's too expensive. you'll put your eye out. eat your vegitables. learn to spel. chew your food. don't run with scissors. you'll put your eye out.

there, that ought to motivate you!

(actually, i think you do need a forge.) when you get it set up and running, be sure to post photos!

good luck with your project!

(p.s.- i've always wanted to try mixing high carbon an cromium nickel into a damascus pattern and then make a barrel blank out of that... the alternating dark and light would be really cool looking--- just a thought)

 

[Mulebrain]

Snipe,

You really need to get ahold of the book Foxfire number 5.

It goes into great depth on barrel making, and gun building.

I would say however, that building the forge and bending the iron over a mandrel to form a barrel is not for the faint of heart :grin:

Tough job!

 

[bob308]

it is not hard to do. you have more tools then the old guys did.

to answer your question don't use tubing. drill a soild bar we used 12L14. it drills and rifles nice.

 

[Bob Gular]

Streetsniper said:"I know some old timers used pure iron so soft they could shape them with draw knives."
I hope you are kidding because whoever relayed that "fact" to you surely was.

 

[flashpanner]

I am with bob308 stay away no run away from tubing. I'd go with the leaded steel. It machines nice. Forge welding can be done and learned but it is has a steep learning curve. I can see how it would be very rewarding. I have entertained the same idea of a scratch build barrel. Maybe we need counseling???

 

[Ed Wingenroth]

I’m retired now but over forty-five years ago I started my carrer in a forge shop that used open-die hammers and up-setters so what I am about to tell you is from actual experience.

Forging steel shape’s from billet or bar stock is a craft in its own. To learn the art of forging, you would enter into a realm of metallurgy, heat treating and the mechanics of metal forming.. No easy feat”¦

Everything I have read about the old time gunsmith was that they bought their barrels blank and drilled and rifled them to suit. If you elect to pursue this method, be sure to purchase your bar stock from a company that will certify both chemical and physical properties and then have the bar stock ultrasonically tested for internal voids and seams and then have the exterior checked for cold lap’s and seam’s. These can be repaired..

Not meant to run you off but you should know what your in for”¦ This is why the barrel makers only make barrels !!! Now, consider the cost...

Good Luck ”¦

Ed”¦

 

[thewho66]

How about just buying blanks from a barrel maker then. It would seen they are already certified, I dont know if any of them would part with them though.

 

[streetsniper]

Actually, the the quote of old timers using drawknives was from foxfire 5.

 

[Many Klatch]

Just buy a smoothbore in the caliber that you want then then rifle it. You don't need to tell the barrel maker what you are going to do with it. After you learn the fine art of rifling, then you can graduate to drilling out your barrel from a solid bar.

Many Klatch

 

[John92]

The "old-timers" didn't use anything but Wrought iron for making barrels. They were just a lot better at it than most of us.

 

[William Joy]

I have access to a hydraulic deep hole drilling machine and have a full machine shop. Also access to a extensive blacksmith shop. A friend of mine is very accomplished in damascus steel work. I am at the moment working on 2 matching damascus steel pistol barrels, locks and furniture for a cased set ( all damascuss). To say it is a difficult is an understatement. At the beginning I planned on makeing my own old fashioned tools - but it is just to much money.( At least at the moment).
Rifling a barrel on an old rifling bench is time consuming but not that difficult. Drilling one out of a bar is an other game. I tried a few pistol barrels on my lathe ( 60 inch bed) and it can be done but for a rifle barrel there is no way! Then on the other side on a deep boring machine I can drill a 38 inch barrel in approx 45 min. I believe this is why they used to forge them over a mandrel ! ( and then it seems to be easier to use a boring bar to bore the existing hole and then a reamer to finish. ( pistol barrel)
Also to machine the outside you need a milling machine with a huge table and an index table. Yes, I know it can be done by hand - if you have the time and skills ......
Good Luck!! I have the same dreams! Let's hope both of your dreams come true - and a good straight barrel!

 

[psushchyk]

My understanding of how the long rifle barrels were made pre-industrialization, was by the gunsmith fabricating the barrel by wrapping wrought iron strips around a short central iron bick and then welding the wrought iron together, using a barrel anvil. A barrel was made in short sections and then welded together. The bick was removed and the barrel was then hand staighted by sighting down a string, to take out high spot. The bore was next reamed and polished.

The rifling machine was wooden framed affair with a long central spiral shaft which which held an iron rod with a cutter on the end. The smith ran the rod and cutter down inside the barrel bore, cutting one groove at a time and increasing the cutter by inserting paper shims under the cutter.

The smith had to make perfect forge welds and blown out barrels were simply accepted as part of the trade.

Colonial Williamsburg has a gunsmith shop where the smith fabricates flintlocks in the authentic way.

 

[psushchyk]

Here is a website on colonial gunmaking.
http://www.nationalgunsmithsassociation.com/about.html

It even has audio. Enjoy.

 

[C_Laubach]

Barrels of the period where made from a flat piece of iron called a "skelp". The skelp was hammered into a trough. The cross section is the shape of "U". Typically you start to weld in the middle of the skelp and work your way to the ends. Once the area to be welded has reached temperature the skelp is pulled out of the forge and placed on a swage-block the helper inserts a tapered rod (called a mandrill) and the smith welds the area by hammering the area bringing the two sides together. You usually only get 1" to 1-1/2" welded per heat. Clean the area with a wire brush flux with Borax and repeat previous until the barrel tub is finished. Hammer flats and straighten. Basically it is ready to rough
bore, ream and rifle than breech and draw file the outside and proof.

The forging process has been documented www.americanpioneervideo.com/


Chris Laubach

 

[arquebus]

Streetsniper said:

Actually, the the quote of old timers using drawknives was from foxfire 5.

And I have also seen it mentioned in Ned Robert's "The Muzzleloading Caplock rifle" too, I think, or possibly Walter Cline's "The Muzzleloading Rifle". We're getting ready for a move, so most of my books are packed away so I can't access them to check!

 

[tg]

Were the flats pounded in or drawfiled, I saw a demo where they were pounded on a short hand gonne circa 15th century, I wondered if that held over to the longrifle barrels of the last half of the 18th century.

Just re-read the post and got the answer thanks..

 

[Bob Gular]

Mostly the flats were ground in the round blank and finished by drawfiling.

 

[Bob Gular]

"Actually, the quote of old timers using drawknives was from foxfire 5". Just proves that some people (the author) will believe any thing that they are told. Those mountain folks probably had a good laugh when they saw some of thier "facts" in print. They were just making the point that soft iron makes a good barrel, not that you can actually cut it with a drawknife.

 

[Elnathan]

I believe the flats were forged. It makes no sense at all to forge a round barrel and then grind it octagon, as it is more difficult to forge anything round than with flats, and it would be wasteful of both time and material to grind off all that metal. The flats would be refined with a grinding wheel, which is why there are grinding marks on the flats of some old rifles.

From Foxfire 5: "Jim Moran, a gun buff and historian we interviewed at length in his home in Kingsport, Tennessee, told us, 'The McInturffs were in here in the early times over in Limestone Cove. Hacker Martin told me that the softest gun barrel he had ever freshed out was a McInturff barrel. They made a type of iron there that you could just shave with a drawknife. It was that soft. They cut the flats on the barrel with a drawknife - scraped them down."

Bearing in mind that the barrel was probably forged octagon to begin with, I think what he is talking about is taking small shavings off to refine a surface, not taking great big chips off as if you were shaving wood. I hit the tang of my Rice barrel with a wood chisel and took a shaving off not too long ago - this with a fairly soft home-made chisel against soft steel - and I have no problem believing that an unusually soft iron barrel could be refined with a drawknife, especially if, as is probable, the drawknife was harder and sharpened with a sturdy edge with such a purpose in view instead of the standard wood-cutting drawknife.