How do you cold forge stuff?

[andy gaboric]

I am intertested in learning how to cold forge parts for ml's as it pertains to build rifles. The reason I ask is that I am going to talk to a guy who is well known for building his ml's and he told me that he "cold forages his butt plates thimbles and etc.. not knowing what this means I assume that you just beat on the metal but without a forge. I am also assuming that is for soft metals like brass and the like am I correct in this statement, and also what all is involed?
Thanks,
Andy

 

[Stophel]

That's pretty much it. Beat it cold.

One might wish to anneal the metal from time to keep it malleable...especially with brass.

The only thing I really "forge" is triggers. Put a piece of steel in the vise and pound the manure out of it to make the "pad" for the finger. I reshape brass buttplates too, and you have to be careful and anneal it sometimes to keep it from cracking.

 

[paulvallandigham]

I can't imagine anyone taking all the time needed to " cold forge" anything! Have you ever seen a ring made from a Quarter( silver back in the day), that had a hole drilled into its center, and then a steel rod inserted into the hole. After that a small hammer is used to gently tap the outer edge of the quarter to beat the silver alloy down to make the ring. If you hit the metal too hard, it deforms, and ruins the ring, which often shows the serrations on the edges in the middle of the ring.

That is cold forging.

Cold forging brass, that is NOT repeatedly annealed( heated to red hot, and then immediately dunked in cold water to soften the brass) will often cause cracks and splits, and a ruined object. Pipes can be made from flat ( or sheet ) stock of brass, cut to width, and the shaped with the use of a vise, and rods. SOME Buttplates- but not all--- can be made from sheet brass, or "german" silver. ( See Northwest Trade guns, and the butt PLATES typically put on these guns for examples of plates made from flat stock.)

But, most of the original buttplates are cast, and filed to shape, so that the entire process of putting a buttplate on a stock can be done efficiently and economically.

Trigger guards are the other object that can be cast, or forged from sheet brass. However, the forged brass guards often are made in pieces that have to be brazed together when completed. If made from steel, then the pieces are welded. Casting trigger guards was done to produce a very low cost item. Hot forging is the next fastest way to produce these kinds of items, with their curves, and varying lengths.

Toe plates, side plates, escutcheons, barrel hangers, are all examples, in addition to the pipes, of items that can be hammered or made out of flat stock. Even muzzle caps of some kinds can be made from flat stock, provided you have the tools to solder( silver solder) or braze the parts together. Hershel House has a video, I believe, on how he makes all the parts of a gun from scratch, but I believe he is HOT FORGING much of the "architecture" for the gun, and NOT cold forging the pieces.

 

[J.D.]

Cold forging furniture is merely shaping sheet metal. Most late period iron buttplates and guards were made by cold forging two pieces, which were then Riveted and brazed together.

Brass or iron thimbles are formed cold, as are one piece nosecaps.

Forms, of some sort, are almost necessary to form most parts.

God bless

 

[ohio ramrod]

Making rings out of the silver quarters was a big thing when I was in high school. Done properly with a quarter from the year you graduated gave you a nice ring with "liberty" and the year around the ring. It was something almost all seniors did. We are showing our age when we talk of these things.

 

[Twoholes]

Do yourself a favor and buy a small forge. I just sold one without a blower for $35.00. It's easy to forge and lots of fun. I am getting ready to start a gun within the week and will make all but the lock and barrel on the forge. I will post lots of pictures so you can get an idea of how to do it. If you have any questions message me.

 

[Birddog6]

You can cold forge allot of things for a rifle. I do it all the time. Sometimes I do it cold, sometimes I heat & anneal it, sometimes heat it & forge it, etc. And I don't use a forge for making the trim, I just use a torch, vice & once in a while use an anvil. But usually all of it is done at the big vice with several hammers & pieces of steel I have shaped to bend things over. You can make all the trim without a forge if you want to do it that way. I am not knocking the forge idea, should that be what ya like, I am just saying you can make all the trim without one if you wish. :wink:

 

[andy gaboric]

Wow it sounds pretty involed, I am new to the whole rifle building idea. Do not get me wrong I really want to do it but I also just want to know what all is involed and more importantly how others do it, I do not like reinventing the wheel. Thanks for all of the advice.
Thanks,
Andy

 

[Birddog6]

Most buy the parts & build with the rifles, as it is allot easier & quicker & cheaper. I do both, some I buy & some I make, just depends on what I am building & who for. Some of the Tennessee rifles I make the customers want all hand made trim, as allot of the old original southern rifles had all hand made trim, etc. Others don't care, they just want a southern rifle.

So it is up to the individual builder & how in depth you want to get into making it.

Starting out, I suggest you buy all the trim & learn to build the rifle first & build it correctly. Then after you have a few builds under your belt, if you want to make some of the trim, then go for it.

:thumbsup:

 

[Robby]

aga, Part of the fun is, "reinventing the wheel", so to speak. Enjoy the the ride, enjoy the destination, its all good. :thumbsup:
Robby

 

[Vaino]

The only item I cold forge is the steel trigger and the brass RR pipes and muzzle caps are formed cold using a rod and wood form respectively, although the brass sheet is annealed before starting. The tail of the entry pipe needs to be annealed often while processing to avoid tears. Seeing I make all of my Pboxes, the lid and the dome if there is one, are all formed w/ hard maple form dies. Good advice to learn how to build a complete MLer and then get into making some of the parts. The parts that I usually make and which aren't that difficult are the trigger and plate, muzzle cap, RR pipes, sideplate, toe plate, bbl lugs, various inlays and the Pbox.....Good luck....Fred

 

[Vaino]

To cold forge a trigger, I start w/ .100 thick cold rolled stock, cut out the rough shape, clamp tightly in the vise and peen the area of the trigger shoe w/ a 3/8"-1/2" dia. hardened rod hit w/ a hammer. The rod is constantly moved around mainly lengthwise while being struck w/ the hammer until a shoe width of 3/8" is achieved. The dimples from peening are easily filed smooth and the underside of the shoe is also filed smooth. The ornamental "finial" to the rear of the shoe is filed and the shoe is curled using a Mapp Gas torch for a red heat and then bent w/ rounded long nosed pliers. Once you do one and find out how easy it is, the "store bought" don't ever look as nice.....Fred

 

[rich pierce]

Here's a buttplate blank (to be finish filed) cold forged from plate brass. Ballpeen hammer and a swage block.

 

[Robby]

Nice swage block Rich, been looking for one for years, old smithing stuff is hard to find around here anymore.
Robby

 

[rich pierce]

Friend found this one in his basement.

 

[mazo kid]

Great instructions! A few years ago I took a hobby blacksmithing class for a couple of semesters. The instructor made it look SOOO easy, making the demonstration project part in one or two heats. It took most of us 8-10 heats to even come close. The instructor was an artistic blacksmith, made some of the most intricate items. He always said there were only 2 kinds of blacksmiths in Hell...those who hammered their iron cold and those that didn't charge enough for their work. :rotf: :rotf:

 

[fort fireman]

I took a farrier school out in Oklahoma a few years back. Our instructor could have a shoe made with the holes in 2 heats. He was pretty good. With a few weeks practice I could have the shoes shaped in 2 heats but I needed a 3rd and sometimes a 4th to get the hole punched. It was however pretty cool to make those shoes and forge but that is as far as I've taken the forging.

I would like to try my hand a cold forging some of the trim for a build some day.

 

[mazo kid]

I took a farrier school out in Oklahoma a few years back. Our instructor could have a shoe made with the holes in 2 heats. He was pretty good. With a few weeks practice I could have the shoes shaped in 2 heats but I needed a 3rd and sometimes a 4th to get the hole punched. It was however pretty cool to make those shoes and forge but that is as far as I've taken the forging.

I would like to try my hand a cold forging some of the trim for a build some day.

About the only thing I recall cold forging was a trigger. With carpal Tunnel in both wrists (both also "repaired" but not much) I limit my pounding to short times.