How Wide should a sight blade be?

[Jim-Iowa]

While I'm saving for parts for a Southern Rifle.
I have been trying to get my first muzzleloader back in shape to shoot.
I had lost the front sight, some where while in storage.
So set out to make one today.
:grin: I have made three so far, this afternoon.
The dovetail was 1/16" deep and I had no 1/16" stock in the shop.
So I used the 3/16" stock I had.
1st one I got too narrow by the time it fit the dovetail.
2nd I used the .032 brass I had on hand and that blade is way too narrow.
3rd I cut the dovetail and used a chainsaw file to contour the top 1/8 th inch.
It looks pretty good for a novices attempt.
Now I do have some .080 brass from the buttstock(some dummy really butchered the butt when trying to change the LOP about 20 yrs ago. I'm sorry ol friend)
Would .080 brass make a decent blade?
Once thats done I'll try fixing it's butt.

 

[Birddog6]

Don't go by the thickness, go by what you can see well for what you are shooting at. Makes no dif if it is .015 or a .250. As long as it serves what you need, that is all that matters.

Now personally I like a wide squared U on the rear & a fat front sight. Years ago I liked a thin blade on front but I can't see it well now, so I use a thicker blade, about .080 I guess.
:thumbsup:

 

[Bountyhunter]

Sight on my rifle is .095" thick. That is just shy of a tenth of an inch. I like it. It is easy to pick up. It is kinda unique.

 

[Vaino]

Sorta depends on bbl length....my squirrel rifle has a 42" bbl and the front sight is .100 thick steel w/ a silver insert for better visibilty. The rear sight has a square notch that's enables me to see plenty of daylight on both sides of the front sight. Have taken a whole lot of squirrels w/ this combo since 1981.....Fred

 

[Bountyhunter]

I agree Fred, thing is, that the farther out they are, the thinner they look to these old eyes! I use an iron blade that is browned heavy like the barrel. It is undercut on the back, except for about .10" at the top, which is squared off and polished bright. In good light the whole sight is visible. In poor light, only the little shiny spot is visible, making the sight almost like a fiber optic. A lot of the old hunters at Bents Fort used front sights like this.

Bill

 

[Jim-Iowa]

Well it's a CVA Mountain Rifle with 28" barrel.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

I'm sorry if this sounds like a wise-ass remark, but just how many Bent's Fort hunters have you interviewed? Open sights have always been problematic. The set-up which one guy swears by, many others will swear at. There have been a staggering number of gizmos and gadgets tried over the years because people, hunters in particular, have not been satisfied with what was available.
For targets, I like a wide flat top front blade and a flat top rear with deep square or U notch wide enough to show lots of light on both sides of the front blade.
For hunting I've found no iron sight better than a peep rear with 1/8" aperture and a large ivory bead up front. That being for long barrels 36" or longer. For carbine length barrels I'd step down to a 3/32" front bead. The ivory bead is visible in very dim light but will not be dazzling in bright sunlight.

 

[Jim-Iowa]

Thanks for all the comments!
I've decided to try the .080 brass and mimmick the TOW FS-Ca 1B target sight.
I may have to open up the rear sight a bit.
But since I like the patridge style sight on my handguns, I think it might work fine if not PC.
Worst case senario would be that I have to start over. Heck it's only time and scrap in the shop.

 

[Bountyhunter]

Well, during the '80's I used to live near Bents Fort and I never missed an event there. So I talked to a lot of the hunters. Most of the guys who participated at that time used their guns for hunting rather than paper punching. So to answer your questions, however many guys were at the events over a period of about ten years.

The participants at Bents are very closely refereed as to what they can bring into the fort or into a camp. So, there wasnt no gimmics or gadgets there, just open sights that would pass the muster at any refereed BP event. The front sight I am speaking of is simply how you shape it. It will work with any legal open sight rear. Puttin a peep sight and ivory bead on my Hawken? That'd make it look like a pimp gun.

You ever been to Bents?

 

[Jim-Iowa]

Never been to Bents Fork or talked to any Bents Fort Hunters. Spent a week near Westcliff and around Canyon City every summer for 7 yrs straight. And have a brother living in West Cliff.
My experience with BP is quite limited.

Have done some centerfire benchrest shooting, but thought I would get run off the board if I mentioned putting my 36X scope on a frontloader? :grin:

 

[paulvallandigham]

I come at this question from a different perspective: I was a revolver and pistol shooter before I got into Black Powder rifles, or shotguns. The front site on most revolvers today are quite wide, for the length of the barrel, and in order to do fine shooting at long range targets, where the target was smaller than the front sight was looking at the target, I learned to make an imaginary line down the middle of that wide front sight, and put that imaginary line on my target and hold it to hit the target. I am speaking about shooting pop cans at 100 yds. so you have a perspective. I eventually shot the Metallic Pistol Silhouette Course, where bang plates are set out to 200 meters to shoot with handguns.

When I began shooting Black pwoder rifles, I used the same technique- imagining a line down the center of that front sight- to concentrate on the front sight, and not the target, and certainly not the rear sight! I did find that I needed to open the rear sight notch up so there was equal amounts of daylight along each side of the front sight, equal to the width of the front sight as it appeared through the rear sight, if I was going to see my front sight well, AND put my imaginary line on the center of my target. As I have aged, and eyesight is less than it was, the wide front rear sight notch works very well for me. I now treat an open rear sight as a " peep " sight, with the top cut off. I level the top of the front site with the ears on the rear sight, and center that imaginary line on the target. It does not matter to me much now if the front sight is a post, or a post and bead, or just a bead. I still imagine that centerline running down the sight and center it on the target. I have no trouble splitting cards on edge, or splitting my ball on the edge of an axe to break two clay targets with the one shot, one on each side of the axe blade, or in snuffing candles without shooting the stick or wick. I also seem to put that round ball exactly where I want it to hit on a deer when I hunt. If this technique can help some of you, please try it, and let me know how it works for you.

Paul

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Sorry for the misunderstanding. When you said "old hunters at Bent's Fort", it never occurred to me that you meant modern day actors playing old hunters at modern day Bent's Fort.
Yep, been there several times, one time when Richard Chamberlain was playing John Fremont on a movie shoot.
The reason those guys are closely monitored is because in the past they have gotten drunk and rowdy, destroyed property and one idiot fired a blank load into the face of a visiting tourist with injurious results.
During the day of the real Bent's Fort gun makers and hunters were experimenting with sights to try to get around the obvious problems of glare in the bright prairie sun and fading out in dull light. Front sight inserts of ivory, bone, wood, platinum, gold, silver and what not were made and used by hunters seeking better results than gotten from the common low barleycorn sights that were standard equipment on rifles back east. That is the sort of "gizmos and gadgets" to which I refer. Things like hooded front sights, aperture front and rear sights, sights which folded to switch from hooded pinhead to open flat blade and other ideas, some of which are still in production today, such as the ivory, silver and gold beads. The sight you describe, with its' top rear face cut to a 45% angle, is rather like that once marketed as the "sourdough blade" with gold or silver face. That was a good idea in dark woods but still dazzles in bright sunlight making it hard to locate the top and leading to high shots under those conditions.
It is not surprising that in any one group or club you'll find many people using similar equipment. One member convinces his friends "this is the way to go" and sometimes it even works, under some conditions.
I don't think a rear peep and ivory bead front makes my Leman look like "a pimp gun" but rather like the rifle of a hunter seeking the best accuracy under all conditions, just as real hunters have always done.
I've never believed that "because everyone else does it" was reason enough for me to do so. I've always been more interested in results than in trying to look like everyone else who are all trying to look like their fantasy idea of a mountinman, or like Richard Chamberlain playing John Fremont. I now reside in Fremont County, Colorado but I don't know what kind of rifle sights John Fremont may have preferred. I prefer what works. :grin: