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Ignition source ?? (read carefully...)

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the analogy of the fire piston fits much more closely with loading a rifle than it does with unloading a rifle.

Excellent point!

If you are scared to pull a ball, you surely should not be loading one. :)

It's also possible to loop a strap around the end of your rod, tie it to a tree and pull the ball. That way, if the gun does fire, you hit the tree, not yourself.
 
OK, here we go again... (from the winner of the GOLD-H)

Scenario #1. Extream barometric pressure set off the charge because of the change in elevation from where he was hunting and where he lives, the change in pressure compressed the powder enough to set it off pass it's flash point.

Scenario #2. Chemical reaction, the patch lube (once warmed, chilled then warmed again) broke down into it's rudimentary elements and had an adverse reaction with the chemicals in the black powder making it unstable...

Scenario #3. HE WAS SMOKING WHEN HE PULLED THE BALL!!!
Ashes fell off of his ciggerette and landed on the nipple/touch hole, it was enough of a heat source to set off the charge.

(you kept saying "NO CIGAR", and you were right, it was a ciggerette.)
 
Now wait. He sid the vent or nipple hole was . . .
Plug vent or nipple so breech end is totally sealed air tight.

So, as the ball is pulled it drops the pressure in the barrel towoards a vacuum. I know the boiling point of water drops as pressure decreases, so perhaps, if you yanked that ramrod hard enough (and it didn't split or strip the ball off the puller) you create the conditions where the flash point of the powder drops to below room temperature. Poom!

Never happen.
 
Now wait. He sid the vent or nipple hole was . . .
Plug vent or nipple so breech end is totally sealed air tight.
But he didn't say what it was plugged with...

It may have been plugged with a match stick and the ciggerette could have set off the match and the match could have set off the powder and the...

"Never mind, I'm clutching at straws..." :(
 
Just a thought, could the oil used to lube the barrel and patch decompose and in decomposing cause spontaneous combustion of the powder charge.

Another task for Wechlo.
 
Why didn't he just shoot the $%#@&^ round ball out before he headed home?

On the thought of a padded workbench, he should have grounded the barrel first, the padding of the bench broke the natural ground...
 
This was an interesting thread that also turned out to be a little fun...when I first posted it a few weeks
ago, all the responses at that time were like the majority of these, in that they did not answer the question,
and it points out a couple things that are probably worth mentioning:

1) It seems that we as human beings...myself included / no flame intended...sometimes just do not read
things thoroughly enough, whether because we're anxious to respond with some good advice, or because
we're just in a hurry or whatever, don't know.
There were certainly a number of obvious, good, general gun handling / safety responses, but however good
and well intended they were, for the most part they didn't address the question at all.

Claude & TG get a cigar and a gold star...they directly answered the question.

2) The second observation is that there really is no ignition source inside a sealed bore that could ignite the
powder charge under those described circumstances of pulling a load.

While BP certainly must be treated with due respect, it doesn't mysteriously ignite all by itself...and it's not
like nitroglycerine that might explode from rough handling, etc...it has to have an ignition source...and in
the conditions described of pulling a load, it's safe at least until the ball is out of the bore.

Then everything from the extremes of "nukes to lightning" become fair game for the open muzzle of course...
but at that point...we're really back to the same conditions we're at every time we load a powder charge
into a bore in the first place.

So to me, pulling a ball as I do it is of no safety consequence at all...but FYI, even at that, I still limit my
exposure in front of the muzzle to just the hand on the ramrod for the few seconds it takes to screw in
the ball puller and slide out the ball...just basic gun safety.

Like all of you, I've read / learned about a lot of the things to consider when pulling a load...ie: T-handle in
the fork of a tree...strap around the ramrod tied to something...shooting it out...etc, etc, but after I
stumbled across the comment for the second time in various Internet articles or magazines about "soaking
a bore/load in water for at least a half hour" before attempting to pull a ball, I really began to question the
validity of all this concern over pulling a ball...and could think of no possible ignition source under my
circumstances...and that's why I posed the question to see if anybody really knew of any...and the answer
is that there really doesn't seem to be any ignition source available to a sealed bore under those
circumstances.

Thanks, Bill :: :: ::
 
Sadly, we live in a world where sleeping tablets must carry the warning "May Cause Drowsiness" and take-out coffee cups must have "CAUTION - CONTENTS HOT" printed on them. Who can blame a gun shop owner for recommending someone soak the charge? We are a socirty of victims.

If Joe Blow shoots his hand off pulling a charge, he (or his insurance provider) will sue the powder mfg., the gun mfg., the gun distributor, etc., etc. until he succeeds. He'll never say "I must have done something incorrectly."
 
If Joe Blow shoots his hand off pulling a charge, he (or his insurance provider) will sue the powder mfg., the gun mfg., the gun distributor, etc., etc. until he succeeds....

And the members of this Forum.

For God sakes! Everyone stop posting or we'll all go to jail. ::
 
Too late. The font selection of this new forum format has caused me permanent eye damage and severe mental anguish. I need a new custom flint rifle, er, I mean counciling and rehabilitation, that will cost you about $2,500. You'll be hearing from Dewey, Cheatum & How - my attournys. Of course, they'll need $100,000 so the total suit will be $102,500.
 
Just one more observation to Roundballs question and comments. I always thought soaking the barrel before pulling the ball was after a missfire where there was the possibility of a spark still somewhere within the ingition area.
Soaking the charge gives you something to do while the spark burns itself out.
After hunting where the gun wasn't fired you should be pretty safe, although I see no reason to plug the vent or niple hole.
 
Actually, I'm glad you asked that, because in light of my post about this, I don't want anyone to have any
misconceptions about my gun safety practices...plugging the nipple and/or vent may not even be necessary
but It's just one more thing I do for the little extra peace of mind I get while driving home with the charged
rifle laying in the truck...at least there's no way anything is going to light off the charge by accidently
entering through the nipple or vent.

Percussions - I use a tiny 1/8" rubber vacuum plug from auto supply stores to seal nipple, hammer down;
Flintlocks - I use a small piece of OD MIL Spec "dry" duct tape over the vent, frizzen open, hammer down.

I charge my rifles in the garage before leaving in the dark to go hunting, do the same thing to keep out
moisture, get to the stand, stick the tape on the side of the stock, prime the pan, pull the trigger, buck falls
down, etc, etc. :: :: ::
 
Generally speaking it is not "Joe Blow" that starts a law suit. In case of a death it is the lawyer for his estate. In the case where he shoots his hand off an insurance practice call subrogation kicks in and all of the unpaid creditors get on the band wagon. Joe's insurance pays most of Joe's medical, but not all and Joe, he spent his money on wine, women and, in this case, muzzleloaders and can't pay the remainder of his hospital bill. So the insurance company and the medical care providers sue everybody involved.

That is why McDonald's coffee cups have a warning on them.
 
Thet's probly why a "nozzle" I bought for my garden-hose, had this warn'n on it,... CAUTION: Do not spray water into electrical outlets!!

hhmmmmm!! :: Jest "HOW" are we,..... suposed'ta git rid of tha "dummys"????
 
Ta quote roundball: "Claude & TG get a cigar and a gold star...they directly answered the question. "

Ah thin Ah otter at least get a lead star. Ye did ask fer an Engineering kind o answer so's that's what Ah gived ye. Course all that talk 'bout pressures an thins did get a lil boring but that's what us engineers are soposta do.

Caint hardly wait ta get ma little lead star so's Ah can go make me 'nother cast round ball with it!
 
Roundball, What I meant was I see no reason to plug the hole while pulling the ball. For transport home to the ball pulling area or any other place I think it an exellent idea.
 

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