Inletting swamped barrel

[Slim36]

I recently joined up in Dec. and have spent numerous enjoyable hours reading past posts. I am new to muzzleloading and am wanting to build a Penn. style rifle in .54 cal. Have many yrs of custom cabinet and furniture building under my belt and a small shop, also some minor machinist skills from farming as well. Wanting to buy parts and stock blank but a bit overwhelmed if I could handle the swamped barrel inletting. Thoughts and advice appreciated.

 

[Drago]

Welcome, I am no expert but a strait barrel would be alot easier for a first build. I did just learn that you can have the barrel profile and ramrod cut for you and you get a very good fit. Just a thought if you really want the swamped barrel. I have not built one but can see how hard it would be to layout and inlet one.

 

[Coot]

You will get more answers if the moderators move this to the "gun builders bench" sub forum. That said, a friend is a custom builder & he makes no distinction between a swamped, tapered or straight barrel - he inlets all of them by hand, using flexible metal guides that he screws down on the stock blank, with the spacing matching the barrel profile. This system is more time consuming than using power tools but he achieves extraordinary wood to metal fit. Some using standard barrel profiles will send their stock off to have the barrel inletting done by computerized equipment.

 

[dleach]

Inletting a swamped barrel is tough if you've never done it before. I just did my first one for one of two guns I'm working on. It would have been much easier with a less figured blank than the one I chose or maybe with sugar maple which is harder instead. I got a lot of break out on the inletting and I'm assuming its from the hard soft of the wood. I started with a router to make the initial channel by using the smallest of the width of the barrel, a 3/4 bit in my case. I used a small router bit that matched the bottom flat and set it to the depth of the highest part of the bottom channel. From there it was all by hand with chisels. I ended up using resin to smooth out the inletting. Yeah, I know. I bet haines and the rest of the original smiths used pine tar or something....lol

 

[kaintuck]

We here, are all frustrated furniture makers :youcrazy:
So if you have that already going for you....have at it!
1.get some rifle making books
2.i like my Leevalley 1/4" hand planes
3.nice sharp chisels
4. Lots of elbow elbow grease

Or send out the 1st one to someone like Dave at knob mountain, or just buy barrel/stock together from him already dropped in, and then you do the lock TG etc in letting.....

I don't have much in the power tool area....pencil, straight edge, planes, chisels, rasps, gouges, good vise, sturdy work bench, stinking big tom cat, and glasses of tea......and time.
It's a nice hobby that will get under your skin...... :surrender:

 

[LRB]

That is the method that John Bivins and Wallace Gusler discovered was used by some of the 18th c. gunmakers. They found screw thread marks on a few guns that had not been completed removed, and saw tooth marks in the channels. A 3/8" square bar is set on each side of the barrel which has been roughed in deep enough that the bars capture it. The bars are screwed down with the screws being to the extreme outer edges. The barrel is removed, then a saw is used that has the set in the teeth removed on one side. From there it is chisel work.

 

[Drago]

So they used a long hand saw to cut in the sides with the guides screwed in place and then chiseled out the channel? That does sound like a faster way than knives and gouges, maybe not as precise.

 

[LRB]

I believe it was a small hand saw, like some use for dove tailing boxes by hand. You're only cutting in about half the depth of the side flats. You gotta think if John Bivins used this process, it produced a good fit. He shows it in the book, "GUNSMITH TIPS & PROJECTS".

 

[Vaino]

I used the "Bivins Method" to inlet the first four bbls....after that I've been sending them out.

As was said, the bbl breech end is inletted so that the bbl lays flat on the wood and w/ a swamped bbl, the 3/8" square cold rolled "rails" are clamped to the bbl so that they follow the swamped bbl outline. The bbl is also clamped down against the wood. Numerous round head wood screws attach the "rails" to the stock {these screws are very close to the outside edge of the "rails"}, the bbl is removed and a short miter saw w/ rake of the teeth removed on one side is held against the "rail" and the bbl outline is sawed in. When both sides are done, I drilled a series of holes the full length of the inlet and the webs between the holes are chiseled out.Spotting compound is applied to the bbl and the sides are fitted using a chisel. As the bbl is lowered into the wood, the angled flats are chiseled in and then finally the bottom flat. Usually less than half the bbl is inletted, ensuring that the wood at the breech end of the bbl is 1/32" above the bbl.

The spacing of the screws varies according to the curve of the bbl outline....closer at the "waist" of the bbl and 2-3"" apart at the straight lengths. The screw holes get removed when the forestock is shaped.

No matter how a swamped bbl is inletted by hand, it's time consuming, to say the least.....Fred

 

[drwatson1873]

I remember the "Bivins Method" being described in detail and having a good photo series in a multi-issue series in Wolfe Publishing's Rifle magazine many years ago...it must have been in the early 1980's as it was when I started building a Poorboy rifle for my wife. (No, I didn't try the method then, and haven't tried it yet.) The finished product of Mr. Bivins' article was extremely nice...if I recall rightly Rifle magazine used it as the cover illustration on one of issues in that series. He also detailed briefly the hammer fit method for the buttplate in that article.

 

[Va.Manuf.06]

I believe it was a small hand saw, like some use for dove tailing boxes by hand. You're only cutting in about half the depth of the side flats. You gotta think if John Bivins used this process, it produced a good fit. He shows it in the book, "GUNSMITH TIPS & PROJECTS".

Good advice Wick. A straight handled backsaw with the set removed from one side (the side which contacts the rails) and the front of the saw is cut at a 45 degree angle to help sawdust to be pushed out ahead of the blade. You only need about five inches of blade working. It does very well and can be used to begin the inletting for straight octagon barrels as well.

 

[galamb]

Here's a pic of (approximately) what is being described - this is with 1/2" x 1/8" flat steel rails.

 

[Coot]

I believe that in the case of inletting my fowler barrel, a veneer saw was used as the cutting tool. Makes for a very thin & precise cut with no set to the teeth on the guide rail side.

 

[stinkyfeet]

You can also buy pre-inletted stocks for swamped barrels and the match barrel from TOTW might be a better idea to start out with since it should only take minor fitting and inletting.

 

[fusil de chase]

If you are new to gun building:
I was given the advice on here to get a copy of Gunsmith of Greenville County. Best advice ever given on the internet.

Get the book.

re doing your own inletting, just do it yourself it represents a very small portion of the work involved in gun building and the money you save pays for the next blank.

 

[Bill Knapp]

Call Dave Keck at Knob Mountain Muzzleloading, If you send him the barrel, and blank, you will get an inlet so perfect, you will think the wood grew around the barrel. Many of the Master builders use Dave as a time saving resource. he can also rough pre shape your stock from the lock mpanel to the butt for any number of styles.

Bill

 

[Pete G]

I don't see much difference in a swamped vs. straight barrel as far as inleting goes, but once you handle a gun with a swamped barrel the straight barreled gun will feel like a tractor axle in your hands.

 

[kaintuck]

:haha:

The difference is, you need a " cuss jar" when hand in letting a swamped barrel!
:rotf:

 

[kaintuck]

:haha:

The difference is, you need a " cuss jar" when hand in letting a swamped barrel!
:rotf:

 

[jamesthomas]

Did Tom-Tom step on the reply button Kaintuck? :grin: .