Is It Safe? ITX Lead Free In A C&B

[Cpl. Ashencheeks]

Probably not.

But I am going to run this by anyway.

I live in California, and as many probably already know, we poor sons of buccos can't use lead during hunting activities in a large part of this state.

So this effectively knocked out the use of cap and ball revolvers as a sidearm during hunting in large part of this state.

So I got to thinking and possibly came up with a plan to get those pieces of iron back out there; maybe and that is a big maybe.

I have got some of those ITX roundballs in the 45 caliber (.436 on average) and they fit well in my project matchlock barrel with a thin patch.

However, they are far too small to fit in a cylinder of my Cap and ball revolvers without definite risk of chain fire, so this was bugging me to no end and there is no easy solution to this.

This right here is about the best I could think of to use these in a cap and ball short of possibly getting their company to make some crosshatch textured conicals.

Well, I have the roundballs, but not enough of the other type of eggs (huevos) to try this out.

They would have to be loaded off the frame and the rb belt direction would need to be acknowledged to be kept in the right position in relation to the cylinder mouth.

The paper patching on the roundball would be a few layers of wet cigarette rolling paper allowed to dry, wrapped in a teardrop fashion with the point of the teardrop being at one pole of the belted ball, a pen mark at the other pole, and the equatorial belt being at the center.

Clean loading procedures would have to be adhered to where no crushed or film of powder could be reached to the main charge, hence the need for both cornmeal and a waxed carton wad cut with a sharpened .45 LC case to try and prevent the increased potential for chain fires.

Smaller charges are in mind for obvious reasons.

A terminal projectile report would also be important.

I would really want to test this at safe distance in some kind of pistol vise from these arms before trying it otherwise.

I am not sure about really trying this, but many here should keep in mind that your states may be headed for the same laws that are effecting us right now. At some point soon, they want a complete ban of lead in our state, even at our ranges. I suppose later at the point they have us using wax bullets, they will even find excuses to take that away.

Please discuss this as to what we could possibly do to get our old BP arms back out in the hunting areas.

 

[roundball]

Zero hands on experience with C&B revolvers.
BUT...doesn't the projectile have to be soft enough material to swage into the forcing cone or something?
If so, would ITX be soft enough for that?

 

[Cpl. Ashencheeks]

These roundballs are pretty hard and I believe made with some unknown tungsten alloy.

I tried imprinting some plier marks and it was for the most part a no-go. It will scratch, but it is very difficult to deform.

Soft lead is still the best thing to run from a cap and ball revolver, but our state government is doing their best to remove lead from all sporting use in our state.

So, we out here in California have to come up with different options.

A crosshatched conical at .451 made similar to buffalo pistol bullets would probably work better if made from this material, but this company has not even thought to exploit this part of the black powder market yet.

I have run cast roundballs and conicals with a high zinc content in the lead (drossed wheel weights) from a C&B many years ago, but it is not good for the rifling and has an increased chance of jamming in the barrel.

The hardness of the ITX RB seems pretty close to the cast high zinc content lead rounds.

They are smaller projectiles and that is why I figured paper patching in some manner to take up the extra space in the cylinder and down the barrel.

I would want the round as close to the forcing cone as possible without interferring with the operation of the revolver.

I believe being closer to the forcing cone increases accuracy with conventional lead roundballs.

I would not know how much accuracy to expect with the above setup though.

I usually like to have that shaved ring from oversized lead roundballs sized at .454 because it is reliable and sealed; much less worries of a chain fire ever happening.

I also seal my back cones with an old product called cap guards, they work well for the most part.

Still, I would hope someone might start to manufacture a textured conical in a compliant alloy and the above graphic would not even be considered because the crosshatch texture would size to the cylinder and still be safer from reaching the main charge.

I am not sure how well it would behave in the rifling down the barrel with a different type of metal, but those lead buffalo pistol conicals were pretty good at engaging through the barrel.

 

[Travis Gregory]

I would b less worried about a chain fire because u could seal the chamber with grease. However tungsten is very hard . If the bullet didnt get lodged in the barrel causing damage the rifleing wouldnt last long because the bullets are so hard. It would have to be patched in such a way that the bullet itself never contacts the rifleing as is the case with a prb in a rifle.

 

[Rick Son]

I'm in Ca. I WILL NOT COMPLY!!!!! There is absolutely no reason for it.just make sure to pick up the kill it's not lead that bothers the condor anyway.They didn't even know what carian was becuase they were hand fed un natural foods.They were dying from eating in dump grounds areas that may have had some lead but mostly trash they couldn't digest,if i need to shoot lead i by god am gonna shoot it.If they come up with something as good or better,i'll be glad to shoot that..I got no use for the District of Columbia or Sacarottintomatoes!

 

[azmntman]

Chief Moonthunder for President!!

Run Chief Run! Run Chief Run! Run Chief Run!

:thumbsup:

 

[Cpl. Ashencheeks]

I am not one of those who have brainwashed into thinking the lead ban is about the condor.

I am very aware of this imported bird not really being the real reason for the lead bans here.

I have been stopped by a game warden only one time that I can remember and he only asked to view my license.

One other time while on a squirrel hunting trip in 2012, I had gone back to my campsite that night and I was awakened from my slumber from hunting activities elsewhere earlier in the day by 2 officers.

The officers tapped on my vehicle window where I was sleeping, because they wanted to check my equipment. They had been told someone was stealing other people's camping equipment in the area.

They determined that there were no problems with me and moved on.

I am still not sure whether they were game wardens or sheriff deputies, because they kept me blinded with their lights.

The officers never really did check my equipment, but if they were game wardens, if they did check my hunting gear and I was not in compliance with this stupid lead law, it could be a violation that could eventually lose me my hunting license.

I do not want to lose my hunting license is another major reason I am considering this, because if I lose my license here, that suspension from hunting can carry over into another state, even if they don't have any lead bans.

I don't really want to comply with this lead nonsense myself, but it has already been determined that 99% of hunters are in compliance when stopped in areas that are in the shadow of this imported critter, yet this dungdip bird is still dying off.

So compliance has been providing proof that this bird is dying for other reasons. This gives hunters the moral high ground.

Fact is, California is about one the most mineral rich states in the union, and a good deal of one of those minerals is galena (a lead rich ore), along with others such as arsenic, mercury, and other potentially poisonous mineral compounds.

These minerals are naturally occuring in our ground, in our water ways, and sometimes even part of natural gaseous emissions.

There is really no scientific possibility to remove all the naturally occuring offending substances from our environment.

By nature these substances are in much greater abundance than any melted lead projectiles are.

BTW, I am very adept at using a sling (David & Goliath type sling), so if they ever find one those birds lying on the ground with it's head bashed in by huge chunk of galena, I just might be the one who did it.

Yep, lead certainly can kill condors, but it would not be definite that it has to go through the bird's digestive system to do so.

P.S.

I would probably vote for you to.

 

[tenngun]

hide your lead some where, get you some fack stuff to carry in your bag, show that to the gw,bet you wont have to pull a ball from a loaded gun if it looks like your reloads are fake.
I think the whole anti lead thing is aimed at 1)making it to expensive to shoot, 2)making it diffucult to run ball at home.