Jack Garner Smoothbore?

[Russ T Frizzen]

The English and Early Virginia locks from Jim Chambers are excellent fowler locks. Got a couple and they are wonderful--dead reliable and handsome as well.But it does depend on which period the fowler is from. If Jack Garner is willing to use whatever lock you prefer, you can't beat any of the Chambers locks, including the Siler. I have three Chambers Siler locks and they are first rate. There is no reason not to please yourself. I have one of his locks made with a bronze plate and pan. It looks great against the maple stock. Sparks like a Zippo on steroids. Don't know how PC it is. Don't give a rat's @$$, either. When the PC police start paying for my guns, I will cheerfully stand aside and let them choose which parts are used. It's different story when you are enacting a certain historical period, but otherwise, what you are really after is a good companion on a hunting trip or a walk in the woods. And you want to do it for a reasonable cost. Well, I would anyway.
By the way, there is a beautiful Southern gun on Track's site. It's under Updates, Page 3, 5th gun down. Its actually called a smooth rifle, but I see a fowler influence.

I figure it this way. You only pass this way once. You deserve a fine gun. And you are paying for it. Not the PC folks.

 

[tg]

I did not see any PC police posting, but with the gun you decribed it woule likely be a late 18th century piece early 19th piece with the iron furniture and I guess Southern? style sideplate , I suspect an English import lock would be the norm rather than a 1770 period Germanic lock, how close to the norms of the times is your choice, the closer you get the price of poker generally goes up, and when this topic arrises many jump in with don't give a %^$^stuff which is fine but some folks do like to know, I for one have grown weary of even trying to talk about historicaly correct guns parts and styles on this forum as most seem to care not and have a fit and fall in it when it comes up so I will let others advise on gun history and hope those who are looking for some info will be able to read between all the "do what you want it's your gun and it don't matter" stuff and find what they are seeking.

 

[Rebel]

Jack said he uses the Large Siler lock, and a small, Tenn. style sideplate. Would an L&R Tradegun lock or Queen Anne be more appropriate? Like i said, i want it for hunting and one that will be reliable, not so much for period correctness, but if i can get both, that would be fine. Thanks for the advice.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

tg-Rebel's original post didn't specify PC as being a criteria. I'd go with the English lock myself or the similar Early Virginia style. But it is his fowler and he said he wasn't going to re-enact with it, so, yup, whatever he wants is the bottom line.

I have a few historically accurate reproductions and I value them highly. Should I wish to enact the F&I War or Revolutionary War eras, I have the guns to do it. I have a Hawken(late period)that I'm told is so PC that Sam Hawken would think he made it. For me the best part is that these firearms are terrific shooters. But, when seriously re-enacting, I believe you have a responsibility to be scrupulously accurate in all the required gear. When all you want is a good hunting arm, I don't see how it matters if your lock is a little too early for the gun in question. And secondary use of a part(s) was certainly not unknown. That an early Germanic lock or a trade lock might have been reused doesn't strike me as being the slightest bit implausible. And then there are the "bitsa" Muskets thrown together for war time use. Locks and barrels and furniture from several nations were used and many survive. And they are pretty neat guns in their own way. And they are most definitely PC. Now, a true fantasy gun, say using an 1803 Harper's Ferry lock and an 18" barrel on a F&I war period fowler is something I would personally find a bit much. Then again, I have seen worse offenses.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Rebel, I have an L&R Queen Anne lock on one of my guns. Took a lot of work to get it tuned to the point where I could count on it. The similar Chamber's English locks are much better in my opinion. And would satisfy most folks PC concerns.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

For those who receive "MUZZLEBLASTS" each month, there is a very fine article on a New England fowler by James Whisker. The lock on this one would be tough to duplicate, but the rest could be done. What is really interesting is the butt with its English flavor and, in particular, how thin it is. Lovely fowler.

 

[redwing]

RUSS T< Wish I had said that> You are SOOOOO, RIGHT!

Redwing :redthumb: :RO:

 

[Rebel]

Thanks for the posts Russ. I have heard of a lot of bad experiences with L&R, so was really hoping to find something else that would work beter. What i want is reliabiltiy more than authenticity. But if i can get both, that would be great. I may talk to Jack and see if he can substitute a Chambers lock for an additional fee, and if so, how much more it would be. It is not worth it to me persoanlly, to pay and extra $100 or more just to get a lock that is more PC, but no more reliable. Thanks to all for their input.

 

[CrackStock]

Sorry -- mine is an L&R and works flawlessly. I am also a tad partial to L&R as I have been to Bill's shop a couple of times just to visit. But then, I had purchased his lock from Jackie Brown before I moved to South Carolina and met Bill.

Chambers has an English Fowler lock

RE Davis has a Tryon lock or a Tulle lock

I have a Pedersoli Lott lock that you could have -- cheap.

L&R also has Queen Anne and Early Trade locks.

I do not like to step on Jack here, but I think that he should offer a more correct lock for your fowler. You might ask.

CS

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

I should have pointed out that once tuned, my L&R lock has never given me a moment's trouble and has lit off a few thousand rounds.

 

[CrackStock]

Russ T,

By tune, what did you find needed doing?

I always polish the lock plates and springs and look for any burrs on my locks when I get them, but nothing else needed doing on mine.

CS

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Well, it's been years, but I recall having to polish and de-burr the lock and it seems to me there were problems with the tumbler. The hole the tumbler turns in on the plate was rough as a cob. Had to lap it in by hand. Once in service, it has proven to be a good lock, but given a choice between it and one of Jim Chambers fowler locks, I'd definitely go with the Chambers lock.

 

[fatboy]

I have tuned up a few locks so they would function correctly. A friend at work needs his Siler lock worked on frizzen wont open completely during firing this has been a problem on a few others we tried to change the position of the flint and nothing seemed to help. Had to tune mine up polish and so on and it works like a champ ,time to get the file and stone out. I think you will always run into a lock that can use a little tune up . Regardless of who makes it :m2c: :imo: :results:

 

[Rebel]

Are you absolutely sure it isn't opening all the way, and that it isn't rebonding back after opening? I had that problem with the Davis lock on my Track N.W. Tradegun. Thought the frizzen wasn't opening. Tried longer flint, bevel up, bevel down, nothing helped. Thought the mainspring was to weak. Finally remembered a tip i read in an old ML'er mag about putting a piece of white paper on the frizzen spring and then cocking and firing. Then look at the paper to see if the frizzen tail hit it. If there is a little dimple on the paper, the frizzen is opening all the way, but is closing part way again. That is what my problem was. Wasn't the mainspring, but the frizzen spring that was a bit weak. Just a thought.

 

[Hoyt]

frizzen wont open completely during firing

My large siler was doing the same thing. The frizzen was rubbing against the barrel..had to let off on the lock bolt just a hair.

 

[fatboy]

Rebel and Hoyt you both have valid points , it isnt opening 2 of watched as he was shooting I will tell him to try loosing the front lock bolt a bit and see if this helps I know i had to do that on another rifle also and it works now.

 

[Rebel]

LHunter, it could be opening and closing part way without you even being able to see it. It happens in a fraction of a second and would be all but impossible to see without high speed photograpy. Just a thought, and it is easy to check.

 

[fatboy]

Thanks for the ideas Rebel i'll help him check it out further.