James Lowe 1740 Pistols. Shootable?

[Scott Jones]

Appears to be screw barrel pistols: took a couple apart for our museum; they hold very little powder. Don't recall exactly how much I could put in under the ball, but it was less than 20 grains 3F with about .50+ size bore; wondered how the ball even made it out the muzzle. If he really wants to risk damaging the locks, he needs to find someone to check out the pistols and guide through loading procedures.

 

[andy52]

Appears to be screw barrel pistols: took a couple apart for our museum; they hold very little powder. Don't recall exactly how much I could put in under the ball, but it was less than 20 grains 3F with about .50+ size bore; wondered how the ball even made it out the muzzle. If he really wants to risk damaging the locks, he needs to find someone to check out the pistols and guide through loading procedures.

you actually fired a set of Queen Ann pistols?

 

[Scott Jones]

No: just loaded out of curiosity to see how much they would hold. I looked at the data sheet I made for the museum; they were .59 caliber, but didn't include powder quantity. This brace of Queen Annes were not safe to shoot under any circumstances; brass frames don't take too much abuse. I do know folks who shoot antiques, but only ones in good condition.

 

[44Bro]

They are screw barrels. Find the right size ball, fill the powder chamber(it won't hold to much), put the ball on the seat, screw the barrel on, prime and fire. I'd use 2F just because the pressure would be a tad lower (velocity down too).

 

[TFoley]

Appears to be screw barrel pistols: took a couple apart for our museum; they hold very little powder. Don't recall exactly how much I could put in under the ball, but it was less than 20 grains 3F with about .50+ size bore; wondered how the ball even made it out the muzzle. If he really wants to risk damaging the locks, he needs to find someone to check out the pistols and guide through loading procedures.

'kay.

1. Fill the chamber under the ball cup with 3Fg.

2. Place ball on top, in the depression.

3. Screw that RIFLED barrel back on until it either lines up or runs out of thread.

4. The last half-turn or so will be tight, because you are forcing the ball into the rifling.

5. Fire it.

6. Be surprised at the recoil, because instead of dribbling out of the barrel, the ball was forced into the rifling.

How do I know this? From shooting a .50cal replica of a Queen Anne pocket pistol. At ten yards it cleared 3/4" of marine ply backing board with ease.

 

[dave_person]

Hi,
Because they are turn off pistols, they have a fixed volume powder chamber. The ball size will be the diameter of the bore because the lead ball will make the gas seal with no need of a patch. James Lowe was a London maker so his guns almost certainly have London proofs on the breech or barrel. You have to measure the bore size to determine the ball size. Then, I would start with 2F black powder, fill the powder chamber half way with powder (probably about 10-15 grains) and fill the rest of the chamber with corn meal. Then put the ball on top of the powder and screw the barrel on. Prime and fire. Hopefully, you have the ring barrel wrench because the barrel will get a little tight after shooting a few rounds. As you gain confidence in the safety of the gun, eventually just fill the powder chamber with powder. Inspect the bore and breech before you shoot to make sure there is no heavy pitting from corrosion. Pay particular attention to the bottom of the powder chamber. Turn off pistols were very strong and very powerful given the fixed charge. After shooting, take the lock off, clean it in hot water with a tooth brush, spray with WD40 to disperse the water, and then wipe it clean and apply a little gun oil to the tumbler and sear and to the feather spring. Clean the barrel and breech the same way using patches for the bore and chamber, dry, spray WD40, wipe clean and lightly oil. Do not go heavy on the oil particularly the lock because it can soften the wood in the mortise. Also, before shooting check the trigger and lock mechanism to see everything functions safely. Look at the tumbler notches and nose of the sear for wear. Make and fit wooden flints in the cocks and dry fire to check the guns. Check that the guns cannot be fired at halfcock. Always close the frizzen before firing. Never fire it without the frizzen closed.

The greatest collector of British guns for all time, Keith Neal, repaired, cleaned, and shot almost all of his guns (thousands). He collected them to shoot them not to have wall decor.
dave

 

[Keyhole]

I’d inspect them closely, then clean and shoot them with a light load.

Not alot….just enough to make them smile

 

[KC Clem]

Those look like museum quality pistols, the threads at the breech look perfect. No pitting on the barrels or locks, no stock wood damage. I'd still want to shoot them if they were mine, though.

 

[TFoley]

Hi,
Because they are turn off pistols, they have a fixed volume powder chamber. The ball size will be the diameter of the bore because the lead ball will make the gas seal with no need of a patch. James Lowe was a London maker so his guns almost certainly have London proofs on the breech or barrel. You have to measure the bore size to determine the ball size. Then, I would start with 2F black powder, fill the powder chamber half way with powder (probably about 10-15 grains) and fill the rest of the chamber with corn meal. Then put the ball on top of the powder and screw the barrel on. Prime and fire. Hopefully, you have the ring barrel wrench because the barrel will get a little tight after shooting a few rounds. As you gain confidence in the safety of the gun, eventually just fill the powder chamber with powder. Inspect the bore and breech before you shoot to make sure there is no heavy pitting from corrosion. Pay particular attention to the bottom of the powder chamber. Turn off pistols were very strong and very powerful given the fixed charge. After shooting, take the lock off, clean it in hot water with a tooth brush, spray with WD40 to disperse the water, and then wipe it clean and apply a little gun oil to the tumbler and sear and to the feather spring. Clean the barrel and breech the same way using patches for the bore and chamber, dry, spray WD40, wipe clean and lightly oil. Do not go heavy on the oil particularly the lock because it can soften the wood in the mortise. Also, before shooting check the trigger and lock mechanism to see everything functions safely. Look at the tumbler notches and nose of the sear for wear. Make and fit wooden flints in the cocks and dry fire to check the guns. Check that the guns cannot be fired at halfcock. Always close the frizzen before firing. Never fire it without the frizzen closed.

The greatest collector of British guns for all time, Keith Neal, repaired, cleaned, and shot almost all of his guns (thousands). He collected them to shoot them not to have wall decor.
dave

Thank you, Mr Persons, for reinforcing most of my comments.

 

[XVIIc Wheelock]

From the looks of the pistols, they look virgin...never shot...may be wrong, if they had been shot, they were taken care of properly...they are magnificent!

 

[springfield art]

Yeah, this is a brass framed replica that someone detailed up with stampings to look like a real one. Neat, though! Your good photo with the Italian proofs say it all. This just screams "it's from the Centennial period"! Good luck!

 

[Relic shooter]

BEAUTIFUL PISTOLS !! IF THE BREACH & THREADS ARE IN AS NICE CONDITION AS THE EXTERIOR.
Over the past 60+ years i've collected & fired hundreds of original firearms of the same era.
As other forum members state, these pistols hold a limited powder charge of BP & required round balls of bore diameter.
If you lack bore diameter balls I've shot screw barrel pistols with patched round balls.

Prior to loading & shooting, pour powder into the breech's powder cavity to determine how many grains of BP it takes, then with barrel firmly screwed in place load your patched round ball & fire away as a typical muzzleloader.

 

[TFoley]

BEAUTIFUL PISTOLS !! IF THE BREACH & THREADS ARE IN AS NICE CONDITION AS THE EXTERIOR.
Over the past 60+ years i've collected & fired hundreds of original firearms of the same era.
As other forum members state, these pistols hold a limited powder charge of BP & required round balls of bore diameter.
If you lack bore diameter balls I've shot screw barrel pistols with patched round balls.

Prior to loading & shooting, pour powder into the breech's powder cavity to determine how many grains of BP it takes, then with barrel firmly screwed in place load your patched round ball & fire away as a typical muzzleloader.

Not patched. Just the bare ball.

 

[Scott Jones]

'kay.

1. Fill the chamber under the ball cup with 3Fg.

2. Place ball on top, in the depression.

3. Screw that RIFLED barrel back on until it either lines up or runs out of thread.

4. The last half-turn or so will be tight, because you are forcing the ball into the rifling.

5. Fire it.

6. Be surprised at the recoil, because instead of dribbling out of the barrel, the ball was forced into the rifling.

How do I know this? From shooting a .50cal replica of a Queen Anne pocket pistol. At ten yards it cleared 3/4" of marine ply backing board with ease.

Thanks: good to know, even if I was being a bit facetious.

 

[NorthFork]

I sure would NOT. There was no proofing far as I know in 1740 and i like my hands where god put them.
Tell him buy a proofed safe pistol.

Oh good grief. You think your T/C, Colerain, Rice, Hoyt, etc barrel is properly and legally proofed? They are not. Hey OP, shoot the thing.

 

[NorthFork]

Interesting.
I understand the caution, but like others have said-those guns were made to be shot. True, they are not nearly as strong as modern reproductions, but it seems to me that staying within, preferably below, loads of the era in which they were manufactured would be safe.
Still, I am no gunsmith, so the idea of taking them to a gunsmith seems sound.

Who says they are not as strong as moderns? Ever look into 12L14 steel? I'd trust skelp welded iron over 12L14. And for the record I own 12L14 steel barreled firearms and shoot them regularly.

 

[NorthFork]

Appears to be screw barrel pistols: took a couple apart for our museum; they hold very little powder. Don't recall exactly how much I could put in under the ball, but it was less than 20 grains 3F with about .50+ size bore; wondered how the ball even made it out the muzzle. If he really wants to risk damaging the locks, he needs to find someone to check out the pistols and guide through loading procedures.

Really?? You don't know much about screw barreled pistols do you?

 

[NorthFork]

'kay.

1. Fill the chamber under the ball cup with 3Fg.

2. Place ball on top, in the depression.

3. Screw that RIFLED barrel back on until it either lines up or runs out of thread.

4. The last half-turn or so will be tight, because you are forcing the ball into the rifling.

5. Fire it.

6. Be surprised at the recoil, because instead of dribbling out of the barrel, the ball was forced into the rifling.

How do I know this? From shooting a .50cal replica of a Queen Anne pocket pistol. At ten yards it cleared 3/4" of marine ply backing board with ease.

Yup, this! See my previous post in relation to this. Some folks don't know squat about what they are spewing on forums. They think 'cause the 'chamber' only holds ' a few grains' that it is a toy.

 

[NorthFork]

Hi,
Because they are turn off pistols, they have a fixed volume powder chamber. The ball size will be the diameter of the bore because the lead ball will make the gas seal with no need of a patch. James Lowe was a London maker so his guns almost certainly have London proofs on the breech or barrel. You have to measure the bore size to determine the ball size. Then, I would start with 2F black powder, fill the powder chamber half way with powder (probably about 10-15 grains) and fill the rest of the chamber with corn meal. Then put the ball on top of the powder and screw the barrel on. Prime and fire. Hopefully, you have the ring barrel wrench because the barrel will get a little tight after shooting a few rounds. As you gain confidence in the safety of the gun, eventually just fill the powder chamber with powder. Inspect the bore and breech before you shoot to make sure there is no heavy pitting from corrosion. Pay particular attention to the bottom of the powder chamber. Turn off pistols were very strong and very powerful given the fixed charge. After shooting, take the lock off, clean it in hot water with a tooth brush, spray with WD40 to disperse the water, and then wipe it clean and apply a little gun oil to the tumbler and sear and to the feather spring. Clean the barrel and breech the same way using patches for the bore and chamber, dry, spray WD40, wipe clean and lightly oil. Do not go heavy on the oil particularly the lock because it can soften the wood in the mortise. Also, before shooting check the trigger and lock mechanism to see everything functions safely. Look at the tumbler notches and nose of the sear for wear. Make and fit wooden flints in the cocks and dry fire to check the guns. Check that the guns cannot be fired at halfcock. Always close the frizzen before firing. Never fire it without the frizzen closed.

The greatest collector of British guns for all time, Keith Neal, repaired, cleaned, and shot almost all of his guns (thousands). He collected them to shoot them not to have wall decor.
dave

Hey OP, if you don't trust the rest of us, trust this MAN. He knows of what he speaks.

 

[andy52]

Really?? You don't know much about screw barreled pistols do you?

you're not nearly as cordial as I am...