Jug choking

[Smokinfeathers]

someone the other day mentioned it was easy to jug choke a smoothbore. I’ve got a tc new Englander I’d like to do it too

 

[Flintandsteel]

It's easy if you have the tools, and the knowledge to do so. If not, send it to Bobby Hoyt.

 

[smoothshooter]

It's easy if you have the tools, and the knowledge to do so. If not, send it to Bobby Hoyt.

Bobby told me over the phone last year he did not do jug choking. He may have started since then, but I doubt it.

I have not done it myself, but have researched it a lot. It is not easy to do if you have not done it a lot, and it's a good way to screw up a barrel if you don't know what you are doing. Even finding information on what dimensions and tapered angles the relieved part of the bore should be ground to in the various gauges is almost impossible.
The proper tooling is very difficult to find, and expensive.
There is a reason it is so hard to find someone who has the knowledge, experience, and equipment TO DO IT RIGHT.

 

[Zonie]

smoothshooter is right when it comes to the difficulty of making a jug choke without the special tooling to do the job right.

Although a jug choke is just an enlargement of the bore at some distance below the muzzle, there is a lot of material needs to come out. This isn't something that is easily done with a brake hone and an electric drill in an afternoon so enlarging the bore a few thousandths of an inch, which is what a hone is designed to do won't create a jug choke.

 

[Dave Marsh]

Lowell Tennyson in Blue Grass, Iowa does it as well as Danny Caywood www.caywoodguns.com/
To my knowledge Bobby Hoyt does not. You like the jug choke.

Dave

 

[smoothshooter]

smoothshooter is right when it comes to the difficulty of making a jug choke without the special tooling to do the job right.

Although a jug choke is just an enlargement of the bore at some distance below the muzzle, there is a lot of material needs to come out. This isn't something that is easily done with a brake hone and an electric drill in an afternoon so enlarging the bore a few thousandths of an inch, which is what a hone is designed to do won't create a jug choke.

I have found that even the companies that make and sell chambering and forcing cone reamers for the firearms business don't carry jug choking tooling, and some have never even heard of it until I asked about it.
Danny Caywood of Caywood Guns in Berryville, AR, and Michael Orlen in MA do jug choking.
Have heard that Rice Barrel Co. is doing jug choking on some of their barrels, but don't know what sizes, or if they will choke a barrel not of their manufacture.
I have a .54 smooth rifle I would like to have jug choked, but it has been impossible to find anyone who will do a bore that small.

 

[kentuckycharliec]

I have the tooling to do .580(24Ga.) up through .729(12Ga.). These are custom tools designed from original old gunsmithing books of the early 1900s , when such work was common.
If you decide to have work done, in some cases, depending on wall thickness, or actually thinness, you might have safety issues, so get a qualified Gunsmith. This usually applies only to antique firearms
I am a licensed Gunsmith, working both Muzzleloaders and modern guns, have a FFL, and can do references upon request. My rates vary between $125-175, plus return shipping. My business is Eastern Sky Arms, Bonnyman KY. Send emails of interest to [email protected] so as to not tie up this thread, please.

 

[Stumpkiller]

I had my cylinder bore T/C New Englander jug choked to Skeet #2 (between IC & Modified). The smith who did it no longer does, unfortunately. Very much worthwhile for that barrel.

Happily it did not effect the round ball accuracy (which was good).

 

[Brokennock]

I have found that even the companies that make and sell chambering and forcing cone reamers for the firearms business don't carry jug choking tooling, and some have never even heard of it until I asked about it.
Danny Caywood of Caywood Guns in Berryville, AR, and Michael Orlen in MA do jug choking.
Have heard that Rice Barrel Co. is doing jug choking on some of their barrels, but don't know what sizes, or if they will choke a barrel not of their manufacture.
I have a .54 smooth rifle I would like to have jug choked, but it has been impossible to find anyone who will do a bore that small.

Any contact info for Michael Orlen? Him being in Massachusetts might save me some shipping hassles if I decide to have this done to one of my 20 gauge smoothbores.

Thanks.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I made my own tool several years ago.
It worked out well. I got imp.cyl and mod patterns from a double.
Was it worth it, no not really, I shot no better than with cylinder.
Shall I do it again? No.

 

[tenngun]

Never had a chocked ml, and not hunted with anything but an ml since the 1970s. Are you going to add any significant range by chocking.
Duelist 1954 has a you tube vid shooting well at thirty yards by using 100 grains and two oz shot.
He got hits at forty yards with the load but not compact enough to be a reliable hunter. At thirty it would’ve a turkey killer. Thumper and Rocky are usually taken much closer.

 

[Smokinfeathers]

Mine is cylinder bore last one I had had screw in choke; decided to leave it alone though as picked up a knight mk86 with turkey choke n am gonna try it out on these 100’ up tree squirrels!! Gonna try new englandrr too as it didn’t pattern bad at 60’ at all

 

[Robby]

I have done three, two 16 ga., and one 12 ga. using this tool.
https://www.brownells.com/gunsmith-...accessories/shotgun-barrel-hone-prod7930.aspx
Yes it does take some time but it can be done, and is much faster than making something similar to the original tool which would for only one caliber. No I don't remember how long it took. They do have coarse stones available and they do speed things up. My patterning before and after shows that it does tighten things up.
Robby

 

[nhmoose]

Here's his info

 

[Brokennock]

Here's his info
View attachment 16125

Thank you.

 

[Lobo]

I'm again it

 

[Daryl Crawford]

Somebody feeling the itch to help a relative noob out. I've heard of jug choking a barrel but have seen some conflicting stuff on what it really means. Similarly I've seen conflicting info on what advantage it offers.
This noob thanks you all in advance.

 

[Zonie]

I don't know what you've heard but jug chokes are used in muzzleloader smoothbores with a cylinder bore barrel.
A muzzleloading smoothbore with a jug choke has an area starting about 1 to 1 1/2 inches in from the muzzle enlarged by a fairly large amount. This enlarged area continues several inches down the bore towards the breech. Often the enlarged area is 3 to 6 inches long.
Both ends of the enlarged zone taper back to the original bore size.

As you know, a modern choke is smaller than the bore size, the idea being to crush the shot into a tighter lump of pellets as it leaves the barrel.

With a jug choke, as the shot moves up the barrel towards the muzzle when it comes to the enlarged jug choke area, the pellets start to move outward or expand, like it would if it had passed out of the barrel. This causes the pellets to move away from each other. This expanded lump of shot then comes to the taper at the muzzle end of the jug choke and it compresses it back to the original bore size.

This re-compression of the shot is the same idea that the modern choke uses, that is, the shot group are compressed to a smaller size lump.

In both cases, the final effect is to cause a reduction in the amount of expansion of the shot group after it has left the barrel thereby creating a denser pattern of shot downrange.

The advantage of using a jug choke in a muzzleloader is, if there is enough barrel wall to allow a jug choke to exist, it can be added to any smoothbore barrel. That allows bore size wads and cards to be easily loaded instead of needing to use undersize diameter wads and cards that would fit thru a modern style choke.

The jug choke also allows loading close fitting roundballs into the gun and it doesn't seem to have any effect on the accuracy for the roundballs.

 

[Brokennock]

It is basically the same principle as "backboring" a modern shotgun, such as for a specialty trap gun. Which is why modern choke constrictions have different effects in different barrels.

 

[Daryl Crawford]

Thanks. This info makes much more sense than some of the banter I heard.