Knapping

[Sham66]

Howdy!

Can someone explain the process and what is involved with "knapping" a flint?

Thanks!

James

 

[amccall]

Usually I take the little knapping hammer or a brass 3/8 rod and tap the flint to break off little flakes. It does not take much and if the flint is jagged do not worry, in fact it might work better. :v

 

[riarcher]

http://www.geocities.com/knappersanonymous/?200515
:hatsoff:

 

[Twisted_1in66]

http://www.geocities.com/knappersanonymous/?200515
:hatsoff:

I don't think that's what he was looking for unless there is some info about knapping flintlock flints in there somewhere. That link goes to some great in-depth info about flintknapping points, knives, etc., but I didn't see anything that is really related to knapping your flint in your flintlock to sharpen it so it throws sparks.

He-Bear explained it better. It doesn't take much and for heaven's sake don't use a steel implement to tap/knap the flint if you have a load in the pan or barrel. One spark could easily set it off.

Try a search on knapping by Stumpkiller. He's posted before about a method that I think he calls hammering the flint, which uses the frizzen to help knap the flint.

------------------------------------------------
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:

 

[SCATTERSHOT]

Basically, knapping a flint refers to sharpening its edge to make it bite into the frizzen and spark better. Several ways to do this, but just tapping the edge with a hunting knife or something similar works. Be sure to plug the touch hole if the rifle's charged.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Here's a good description of flint maintenance.
[url] http://members.aye.net/~bspen/flintlockfaq.html#14[/url]

"Hammering the Flint" is actually more like pressing hard. (Empty gun, or course) I tip the flint all the way forward after pulling the trigger and lowering it manually, then, tip the frizzen back on top of the flint and draw the cock back slowly (takes two hands, but can be done with the gun cradled in your arms). Just as it lies across the tinyiest of the flint edge, press it hard against the flint. It spalls off a bit of the edge in EXACTLY the right place to make it line up with the frizzen. I can't promise that doing this frequently won't loosen the frizzen, but I do it pretty regularly. The frizzen is built to take a pounding. Literally.

I also have a "nick" out of one edge of my pouch screwdriver and I set that on the flint and tap it smartly to knap off little chips to sharpen the edge.

 

[Arrowstorm]

I have no clue how to start out with a rock and shape it into a nice, pretty beveled flint for use in my lock. But I have found a pretty decent way to get my flint sharp when it's starting to get dull.

I bought a flinter's ring of tools when I first started and it had on there, a touch-hole pick, a pan brush and a little hex rod that I use to tighten the top jaw by sticking the rod in the hole in the jawscrew. But I read that some people like to cut a little notch in a rod or back of a knife blade, so I did that with my hex rod. I cut a 90 degree angled notch in my hex rod. Next I butt the notch against my flint with the top of the flint edge in the notch (whilst flint is secured firmly in the lock jaws) and give it tiny bumps with my knapping hammer. This shaves of tiny flakes, and as long as my flint isn't so dull that it's not more than a curve, i can get a nice little sharp edge on my flint.

I'm sure there are better ways, but this is the way that works best for me. Like I said, I know nothing at all about shaping a flint, but as long as I knap it to a nice edge every now and then when I'm getting too few sparks, i've been getting many more shots from each flint. :thumbsup:

 

[Bullmoose]

As to flint, I live in Texas and have 1000s of flint on hand, including 100's of broken arrowheads that I have found throughout the years. My fire starter flint is a large tip of an original Indian spear point. It is "BLACK FLINT" and it seems to be the best flint for strong and many sparks. I haven't thought about using this in my flintlock. :hmm: I think I will:, as to knapping? the other posts are correct, and I have also but large pieces of flint in boiling water, pull them out and they flint off easier. Hold the flint with a piece of leather or you'll get burned.

 

[Bob J]

I also have a "nick" out of one edge of my pouch screwdriver and I set that on the flint and tap it smartly to knap off little chips to sharpen the edge.

I purchased a little "flint-knapping" tool with the little ledge that sets on the edge (put the ledge on the edge :haha: ). Instructions state to wrap thumb or finger under the jaws to take stress off the lock when using it. It works great, but its kinda hard to wrap finger underneath jaws when holding tool with one hand and tapping with other.

 

[paulvallandigham]

While you can knapp the flint by pressing the bottom edge of the frizzen down on the edge while the flint is in the cock, its a good way to split the flint or break it off at the wrong place. Using the same idea in reverse tends to work better, and eliminates that danger.

Raise the frizzen up until the forward edge of the flint is hitting the bottom 1/8" of the frizzen. support the frizzen in that position with your index finger or thumb, while cradling the gun in your bent elbow. Pull the cock back and pull the trigger, the steep angle that is created by the flint falling so much farther then when it normally will strike the frizzen higher, will shear off the edge evenly across the entire width of the flint, giving you a new edge free of metal chips. And, the amount of the flint lost to this method is miniscule.

If you have to knapp a flint frequently this is a good clue that the angle of the cock to the frizzen is not correct, and you are hitting the frizzen at such a square angle that you are actually digging a groove into the face of the frizzen.

First, check that you are wrapping your flint with lead, and not leather. See my article on Flintlocks, at[url] www.chuckhawks.com/flintlock.html.[/url]
Then, use a plastic protractor to measure the angle that the bottom edge of the flint has to the face of the frizzen. Put the center hole of the protractor at the junction of the flint edge and the frizzen and set the base line even with the bottom edge of the flint. The angle should be 55-60 degrees, depending on the lock, and the style of the frizzen. I have Cockrane locks, and a Chambers lock, and they both have the proper angle to them. The Siler locks I have examined are also correct. I cannot speak for imports. And, I have not examined an L&R lock with my protractor to tell you about them. Sorry. I have not heard complaints about the L& R locks, so I suspect they are also constructed with the proper angle.

The whole point of having a properly angled flint is so that the flint actually scrapes metal from the face of the frizzen, and does not dig it out. The lead wrap adds extra weight to the cock so that there is more pressure in cutting steel when the flint drives into the frizzen. You get hotter sparks, and more of them using a lead wrap, over the leather ones. Leather acts as a shock absorber, and the rebound of the flint when the leather gives occurs just when the edge has sunk into the steel surface, pulling the edge out ,and tearing our steel fragments that then clog the edge. After a few shots, you get misfires because you can't get a spark. Then you knapp, and then you begin worrying about whether the gun will go off, rather than concentrating on the front site, so your accuracy goes to H..., and then you develope a flinch when the gun does go off, and finally, you stop shooting flint guns all together. The cure is that lead wrap around the flint, and a proper angle to the frizzen.

If you do have a washboard for a frizzen face, stop right now and throw away the leather wrap, smash a ball on a hard surface with a hammer, trim it to length and width, and wrap your flint with lead. Make a couple of extra wraps, and put them in your flint wrap in your possibles bag. It will more than 10 years before you will have to spend more time smashing lead balls into flat pieces, if you don't lose any of your half hour's work in the meanwhile.

Then, use a grinding wheel, at slow speed, or a dremel tool, or even a sanding belt, again at slow speed to smooth out and polish the surface of the frizzen. ( Yes, you have to remove it from your lock.) Just for good measure, put the new frizzen on a cookie sheet and put it in your oven at 450 degrees for 2 hours, and then let it cool over night. This will re-temper the frizzen and get rid of any problems that may arise out of work hardening the surface. If you have a good lock made in this country recently, it is made of a harded steel as a casting, and does not need to be hardened, and, in most cases, will not show much if any improvement in sparks by tempering it in your oven. But, you won't know until you try. When you put the frizzen back in the lock, you should get lots of sparks that are white hot. They should bounce up and down in the pan at least twice before going out. Turn the lights out, give your eyes time to dilate your pupils, and then drop the cock on the frizzen with no prime or load in the gun. Hold the gun in front of you so that you are looking at the lock at 90 degrees, so you can see the sparks land, and bounce. If I am right, just for the heck of it, take the flint out of the cock, and put a leather wrap back around it and do the same test. I suspect that you will get orange sparks, and they will bounce in the pan and burn out on the upstroke. They will not come back down as live coals or embers again.

Paul vallandigham: [email protected]

 

[roundball]

Seems extreme to me as an across the board recommendation...probably a lock or flint dependent problem...or maybe I've just been lucky.

I haven't been shooting anywhere near as long a lot of folks but I'm at the 4000 shot mark now and have never had the problems you speak of using leather to hold flints...I just use good Tom Fuller black English flints, held tightly in place with flint leathers made from craft store scraps, etc.

In my weekend range trips it's not all that uncommon to shoot an entire 40-shot session without touching the flint other than to clean it periodically with an alcohol rag if the humidity is high, etc...usually I just flip the flint over part way through the range session when I'm cleaning it, only takes a few seconds.

From what I understand, settlers used flint "leather"...never read that the common practice was to use "lead" in place of flint "leathers"
:shocked2:

 

[paulvallandigham]

I have seen guns in museums all over the east coast that have the flint wrapped in lead. Those using leather don't show the age of the older guns using lead. Leather works when you have a large musket lock that has impossible heavy springs. Then, that shock absorber helps save the flint for a few more shots. You get 40 shots from a flint; I get twice that number. To each his own.

 

[roundball]

I have seen guns in museums all over the east coast that have the flint wrapped in lead. Those using leather don't show the age of the older guns using lead. Leather works when you have a large musket lock that has impossible heavy springs. Then, that shock absorber helps save the flint for a few more shots. You get 40 shots from a flint; I get twice that number. To each his own.

No need to get defensive...use your lead wrapper if you like, makes no difference to me...I just gave some balance to your across the board dictate that lead was[url] best...in[/url] my opinion lead is not best...indeed, the newer rifles you referenced with leather should tell the story.

You also drew a conclusion that was not there to draw...I've played with flints and run them up into the 80's - 90's until I get tired of fiddling with them...not worth wasting my time nursing them...blow through a 40-50 shot range session on a flint and usually toss them in a jar when I clean the rifle...
:v

 

[arrowheadtax]

Flint knapping....I use a pointed deer antler and pressure flake removal system. Hold your flint in a scrap of leather and use the deer antler to force flakes of flint off.You will need to angle the antler and use a fair amount of force to remove material from the flint. It takes quite a bit of force! The antler is soft enough to grab the flint yet hard enough to remove material. Learn to do this correctly and you will be well rewarded.

 

I started out with the thought to use lead but then read that the extra mass created alot of undue stess on the lock parts as opposed to leather. My experience with flints is along the lines of the quality of the lock. In GENERAL I get about 40 shots from my T.C. lock, a little better with an L&R and it's not unusual to get 80+ shots with my Chambers. In fact the Chambers gives such excellent flint life that I don't bother to knapp. By the time they quit sparking they're round enough to use for marbles. :haha: Just my experience

 

At the cost of flint these days,
! is there any other material that will do the job?
2is there a way to re shape a flint that has been rounded , out of the lock.?
3 how about Pyrites? Just wondering.

 

[roundball]

At the cost of flint these days,
! is there any other material that will do the job?
2is there a way to re shape a flint that has been rounded , out of the lock.?
3 how about Pyrites? Just wondering.

FWIW, if you shoot a lot, I'm coordinating a bulk purchase of black English flints directly with Mr. Tom Fuller for wholesale prices...sent you a PM...

 

[arrowheadtax]

At the cost of flint these days,
! is there any other material that will do the job?

Find someone in your area that hunts arrowheads. They can tell you where there are native american campsites. You will find flint there in quantity. Look for the higher quality chunks and learn to knap an edge on it. If you get lucky you might even find some arrowheads. Just another way to enjoy the great outdoors.

 

[Mad Irish Jack]

:thumbsup: I made a simple, small knapping tool. Take a 2 inch length of 1/4" OD copper tubing, and an antler tine. Tap one end together until the opposite sides touch. Use a punch to put a dent on the center of the flat edge. Fold it over until the opposite edges touch forming a small "V" shape where the open ends of the "V" touch. Drill a hole in the tine to accept the copper tube rounded end. Put it into the tine using epoxy or some adhesive. :v
To use it: Press the center of the "V", applying pressure, against the front of your flint. Push in and down. This causes small chipping flakes. Walk it across the front of the flint and shoot away. :applause:

 

[Old Ironsights]

I'm not sure a whole 140gr of lead makes all that much difference, mass wise, to the lock. All I know is my TC (coil main) works much better with lead than leather