Know any good custom Flintlock Rifle makers

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While tg isn't wrong, one must look to ones budget. The so-called semi-custom builders contribute greatly to keeping the traditional muzzle loading game alive. And they do it at prices within the reach of many. If your budget allows less than $2,000.00 the "semi" is the way to go. If you are in the "price is not a consideration" category then you can get the most detailed and exact styled rifle possible. Up to, or exceeding, $10,000.00 is not unheard of.
It is what you want that is important. Keep in mind, the semi-custom builders do make fine rifles of quality components and they will make fine shooters and heirlooms for your family. Also, keep in mind, in days of old, not all rifles were presentation pieces. Most were working guns with little or no finery. They just worked.
 
50-60K is not unheard of.
3-4K will buy a very nice rifle that will not depreciate.
Remember factory Colt 1911s run 900 1300+ and the semi-custom/custom versions WELL over that. They have less hand work than a good stocked from blank Kentucky.
Here is one at over $5K http://wilsoncombat.com/new/handgun-classic-supergrade.asp

Most rifles of the 18th C were probably relief or incised carved. Its how things were done at the time.
Search the WWW for "Haymaker Rifle" then read the story of its owner. http://americanhistoricservices.com/html/adam_haymaker.html

I consider this to be a working rifle of the Rev-War era. It has all the necessary parts and a little decoration. The lock is a recent replacement.

$1000 will hardly buy anything in the world of custom gun making $2000 will not buy much more. But many BP shooters think a $2000 Kentucky is over priced.
:confused:

Dan
 
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Dan,

Well said. It's sad that as a builder, the average person thinks that they should be able to get a custom longrifle for $500 to $800. Especially when the parts are more than that, then add 100+ hours of your time.
You strive to build an historically accurate gun, but that get's compared to a TC Hawken.
Can be very frustrating at times.
I live in AZ, and find that I sell most of my guns to customers on the East coast. It seems they know a little more about what goes into building a quality rifle.

Again, thanks for putting it out there.
 
The "Haymaker" is not a lot different than my Rev. period longrifle estimated at about $5,000.00 value. My Jaeger is estimated at about $3,000.00. Both of which I acquired by unconventional means. Legal, BTW. :grin:
Yes, I know about the customized modern stuff. I also know a lot of folks need to put shoes on baby before buying Rolex class guns.
 
I posted this to try to explain to people that a 2000 dollar Kentucky, one thats done right, patch box carving, some engraving, properly assembled and shaped is TOO CHEAP. But many see them as the opposite because they cannot tell one from a TC or Browning Mtn Rifle.
Yes, I KNOW some people cannot afford them. I could not afford a bells and whistles Kentucky if I did not make them.

I built a rifle from a blank, lock and triggers only needed polishing, I was cramped for time. Wanted it to shoot a match with my son who would be on leave or I would have made the triggers.
Buttplate and TG as castings. Did pean the BP wider to reshape.
Made all the sheet metal parts. Pipes, patchbox forend cap.
In a month I got it shooting, no patchbox, no forend cap, no finish since the carving was not even started. But we shot the match and between he and I we cleaned up. Rifle has won something over 100 bucks in 2 matches.
He will get to shoot it again at the June match on post deployment leave if the USMC keeps to the current schedule.
The point is that I cut the barrel channel and rod groove on the mill, used an electric drill for the rod hole. Not by hand as some do. Made the breech plug on the lathe and mill (its a 1 1/4" barrel 18 pound match rifle, the barrel cost $425) made the vent liner as well.
What is a months work worth? And the rifle was not done. I spent more time carving and engraving, final wood smoothing and stain and finish.
I am a little slower than some. There are people that would likely get the rifle done in far less time. But the large barrel meant I had to make a scratch stock to shape the forend and this took time. Making the sheet metal parts adds time. If I bought EVERYTHING and left the lock unpolished I could shave a week probably. It takes about a day to polish a lock to 600 grit. Which I do since I will have it color casehardened sometime this month.
How many 5000+ Wilson 1911s do you think an assembler makes in 1-2 months?
The first post and this one are simply for reference. Many seem to think that 2000-5000 flintlocks are over priced. For the work involved in stocking one from a blank they are cheaper than they should be IF done right.
I built this rifle for 2 reasons, first we do "turkey" and "chunk" matches. Second I got tired of all the iron mounted guns used for chunk guns that are frankly ugly in too many cases and do not represent the match rifles of the 18th and early 19th century made in most of the Colonies/States but those used in areas of Appalachia.
There ARE heavy brass mounted, carved and engraved match rifles out there but most people do not note what they are. There are two in Kindig's book.

Dan

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I think that many have accepted the so called "semi custom" guns like TVM, Sitting Fox and similar shops turning out quite generic guns, which add nothing to a gun to really make a connection to the past or identify the guns as a particular type/school or builder as the "benchmark" of "custom" guns now. This is due to a lack of knowledge about the guns or a lack of interest in the history of the guns. put a nice stock on as gun and that fills the bill for manythis level of guns has pretty much replaced the level that TC and Lyman and such used to fill, it is a step up but still misrepresented at times for more than they are. They do make a quality gun at an affordable price, but many see much more than is there historical for whatever the reason., probably a cse of hearing what is wanted to be heard, as mentined when one pasy $700 for parts, which I have done it is hard to produce a gun for $1000-1300 and have any "defining character" in the maner of carving an engraving and furniture that would identify the gun as to beng from a particular place and time. This is fine for many people, it is just bestb if everyone understands thre whole situation before buying so they can make an informed choice, should their choice for a gun be historicaly inspired.
 
I know of several full time custom gumakers, including myself, that can get you into a HC gun for $2000. Ain't gonna have bells and whistles, but it's going to be right. :thumbsup:
 
To order my first custom I called and talked to about 6 builders whose guns made me coveteous. I then knew that I would at least be in the 2800-5000 dollar range. Like Dan said production 1911's are 1300 bucks. The last thing I wanted was 1200 dollars worth of parts that was worth less than 1200 when put together. I wanted a gun that would hold its value. So builder reputation and resale value was important to me.

I was also very concerned about gun fit and comfort. This made me hesitant to order a gun over the phone. So I went to Dixon's and handled a many guns as I could. I met a few builders that I had talked to and discussed their process in further detail. When I decided on a builder he spent time with me and fit me right there. I was actually suprised how short of a LOP he suggested and I probably would of ordered a gun a bit too long over the phone. Also some styles just fit me better. A gun with great quality components and architecture that doesent fit is useless to me. Making sure the gun fit was why I wanted to do the order in person. I know not everyone does this in person but I thought the 5 hour drive was worth it.

As far as cost one person said many have baby shoes to buy. Well thats true. But many buyers of custom rifles are probably like me. The kids are grown and gone raising their own kids now.
I just wanted ONE special rifle in my life so this is worth it to me.
 
"I know of several full time custom gumakers, including myself, that can get you into a HC gun for $2000. Ain't gonna have bells and whistles, but it's going to be right"

No doubt about it Mike, but when ever folks start talking prices they jump from the semi custom/production you know whos at $900-1000 right up to the 5k guns as though there was nothing in between, I don't know if it is to try and add merit to the first level of guns mentioned or what the deal is with this mindset. I don't know how many times I have heard someone say I got me a $950 gun or I'm lookin' at a gun from so and so 'cause I can not afford a $4500 from who da hell :idunno:
 
What I have noticed is that,

a full 95% of the individuals looking to purchase a new rifle look at only 3 things.

Lock, Stock, and Barrel.

Quality lock, barrel and pretty wood, gotta be a custom HC/PC gun for sure right? looks jus' like the ones in them thar fancy magazines right ? "The builder assured me it was right for the school I wanted" :rotf:

Nobody wants to hear about the fine details that make up a correct "for particular school" longrifle.

And don't even get me started on how we expect top quality parts and workmanship at import pricing, rediculous I tell ya. :slap:

And by the way Brooks, I will be getting on your list in about 18 months or so just so I can have and hold a true custom, correct, rifle/smoothie especially at the quoted price, simple and plain is attractive, kinda like a woman without make-up.
:bow:
 
And by the way Brooks, I will be getting on your list in about 18 months or so just so I can have and hold a true custom, correct, rifle/smoothie especially at the quoted price, simple and plain is attractive, kinda like a woman without make-up.

I'll give you 3 guesses as to who is on the top of his list right now.













:grin:
 
Well,

I'm gonna bet I wont need to guess, do want to see some pics of your complete kit though once its all assembled.
 
Swampy:
You may be surprised to know that your on the top of a lot of peoples "lists". :rotf:


Just funning with ye ! :grin:
 
:haha: I'm sure I am...

I don't know though, its been so long....begining to wonder if Mike lost my very expensive black walnut blank....misplaced my custom Charles Burton oct/rnd barrel....or used my lock for something else.... :idunno: :wink:
 
Swampy said:
:haha: I'm sure I am...

I don't know though, its been so long....begining to wonder if Mike lost my very expensive black walnut blank....misplaced my custom Charles Burton oct/rnd barrel....or used my lock for something else.... :idunno: :wink:

Hmmmmmm,

Thats kinda strange, I talked to Mike the other day and he was trying to peddal that gear off on me.
:rotf: :stir: :wink:
 
Swampy said:
:haha: I'm sure I am...

I don't know though, its been so long....begining to wonder if Mike lost my very expensive black walnut blank....misplaced my custom Charles Burton oct/rnd barrel....or used my lock for something else.... :idunno: :wink:
I'm just a chicken farmer..... :idunno:
What list? What gun?
 
"It seems no one has mentioned Jackie Brown?? I seldom see him mentioned.......'

Might want to check the topic of this thread again, I think it does not really deal with the more production/generic oriented types
 
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