Latest addition to the herd

[Eterry]

I picked what I thought to be 20 bore cap smoothbore last week. It has Birmingham proofs, I believe, 32' bbl, and measures 16 bore. I cleaned some grime from the stock; has plenty of figure and curl.
Covered in a good coat of rust and patina, the muzzle is thick and in good condition. Lock holds at half and full.
Fills a void: I have a 10, 12, 14, 20 and 26 (in parts) gun. The 16 will fit in nicely.

 

[Eterry]

A very lively gun, I bet she don't weigh over 6lb.

 

[Eterry]

Has what my mentor called a Hex Sign, a wedding band on 5 flats, and a patten breech. Is the bottom flat at the breech engraved like the others? I see lots of faint engraving on the barrel. Maybe I'm just tired. I hope @Feltwad , @TFoley, @Britsmoothy and others chime in. The crown jewels she isn't, but some info will help.
I'll work on removal century and half of grime.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Can't help sorry. Looks in good condition though. Especially the bore.
What letters on the lock plate do you see?

 

[Feltwad]

Gun is a typical Birmingham made gun of the late percussion period say 1845-1855 period The barrel is also standard with a baluster turn and 32 inch's in length I could not make out the name on the lock for which I may have given the approximately date also it could have been a traditional maker or even a ironmongers gun To clean the gun first relay the ramrod pipe and ramrod thimble {2number} clean of the barrel rust using a fine wet and try and polish bright for the bore this is best to remove the rust or pitting by lapping with this done next prepare the barrel for browning
I have found that the best load for this 16 bore gun considering its weight is 2.1/4drms of FFg to 1oz of shot
Feltwad

 

[Thingamajiggy]

Looks like she should come around nicely.

 

[Eterry]

Can't help sorry. Looks in good condition though. Especially the bore.
What letters on the lock plate do you see?

Mind, i don't have my spectacles on, but for the world it looks like
S. NOCK....

 

[Eterry]

"I have found that the best load for this 16 bore gun considering its weight is 2.1/4drms of FFg to 1oz of shot"
@Feltwad.

I recall the book I read regarding Double rifles and Game Guns. They had a bespoke cased single barrel rifle in 16 bore percussion made for a member of royalty.
The suggested load from, I believe, WR was 60grs powder for a round ball.

I thought 2 things; either the powder of the day was much more powerful or we load our guns much heavier than 200 years ago.
I'm a ways from shooting her, but that sounds like a good load for such a lively gun.
Thanks.

 

[oldwood]

In the early 1970's , these shotguns were still to be found . I owned a nice 20 ga. just like it. Paid $100 for it , just to study it. Sold it at a m/l shoot for a little profit , but I got from it what I wanted.

 

[Eterry]

In the early 1970's , these shotguns were still to be found . I owned a nice 20 ga. just like it. Paid $100 for it , just to study it. Sold it at a m/l shoot for a little profit , but I got from it what I wanted.

I have a basket of LC Smith barrels I bought years ago. 16 and 28 bore, and 28" bbls. This one would serve well as a pattern for the wood. With a back action lock.

 

[Brokennock]

Nice find @Eterry I'd like to find similar in a small bore, like .410 or .45...
May we please see the inside of the lock amd details of the hooked breach?

Also, what do you look for as a "go or no go" indicator/s for whether or not one of these will be serviceable?
I might have looked at that breach/nipple area and passed on this, but I'm not experienced in this aspect.

 

[Eterry]

Nice find @Eterry I'd like to find similar in a small bore, like .410 or .45...
May we please see the inside of the lock amd details of the hooked breach?

Also, what do you look for as a "go or no go" indicator/s for whether or not one of these will be serviceable?
I might have looked at that breach/nipple area and passed on this, but I'm not experienced in this aspect.

Sorry I've been busy. The Gun is in the shop, but the reason I chose this gun was the price.

I've paid more for a good lock than the entire cost of this gun so I got lucky. The nipple, although worn, has a clear channel and will bust a cap with the hammer easily. The hammer holds on half and full cock, didn't push off, and hammer is in good shape. Another big plus.

The hooked breach has a small gap, but I think upsetting the metal or adding a small amount will make it hook together tight. As is, I've shot guns with more gap, so it's not a concern of mine. It'll push back mostly upon recoil, the wedge pin holds it down near the middle.

If I decide to change the nipple I'll drill out the old one and tap a thread for a new one. I haven't had a chance to clean it up more, but the wood will need some repairs, but nothing too serious from what I've seen. But if it needs replacing, I have the wood to make a great pattern.

Imho, it's hard to make an informed decision based on pics posted on most sites, and the owner knew almost nothing about muzzleloaders. So, I felt sure I could recover most if not all my money selling the gun for parts.
Otherwise, it's just a roll of the dice when you buy online from a site like this, unless you ask for lots of pics and lots of questions. And while doing so, someone may jump in with I'll take it, so I relied on the word of the seller, the few pics I had, and caught a break. I don't always get that lucky.

I hope that helps.

 

[Feltwad]

That gun is in far to good a condition to break up for spares it is a straight forward restoration, removing the nipple is a easy job if the barrel is free off a load apply some heat to the nipple housing and a good nipple key will dislodge the nipple you will find that the thread is 1/4 BSF.
The gun is a bog standard Birmingham gun a cheap made gun of which thousands were made for the export trade and to survive in that conidiation ,it is part of our heritage and must be preserved I have restored many in a worse condition than your gun , my advice think again before reducing it to a box of parts ,
Feltwad

 

[bpd303]

my advice think again before reducing it to a box of parts ,

I agree with this it appears to be in restore able shape.

 

[Eterry]

@bpd303 @Feltwad , I have no plans of parting it out. I just mentioned it as a last resort. But if it was rotted out or badly pitted I may have.