Lee Improved Minnie .54

[jtmattison]

Anybody shoot these regularly with any accuracy? I have the oversize mold, .540 and have shot them from my GPH but just can't get groups out of them. I have not tried filling the base with lube or using a wad. Any suggestions?

HD

 

[Dphar]

Anybody shoot these regularly with any accuracy? I have the oversize mold, .540 and have shot them from my GPH but just can't get groups out of them. I have not tried filling the base with lube or using a wad. Any suggestions?

HD

Minie bullets are generally a poor choice unless you are fighting the Crimean or American Civil War then they are "high tech". They have "problems" as do all unpatched bullets in MLs.
If it has a thin skirt loads over about 60 grains will blow the skirt and unbalance the bullet.

Dan

 

[E Poffinbarger]

Huntin Dawg:

Man I wish we lived closer, I have a new bullet that I think you would be thrilled with the results. At the outset I too started with the Lee Improved Minie with roughly the same results, so I sold that mold and bought the Lee R.E.A.L. which produced considerably better accuracy.

After continued pestering by a Missouri friend, this summer I bought a Lyman 542622, 425gr mold, which is very pointed and thick skirted. Heck, it even looks accurate unlike the Lee "chunk-of-lead" improved minie.

Even though I'm still working on the exact amount of powder for optimum results, thus far the accuracy is very impressive. However there is one little nagging drawback, the recoil is also impressive.

Osage

 

[E Poffinbarger]

Huntin Dawg:

OBTW, starting with a super clean, dry and highly polished bore; I don't do anything special during loading, I just pour in "at this point" 90grs of PyrodexRS, lube the minie and stuff it in, cap it with a CCI#11 mag cap.

Yes, I swab between each shot; for target or load development shooting, a folded beach towel over the shoulder is strongly suggested as a good thing.

Osage

 

[gmww]

I had similar results with all the Lee molds except the RB. Hard to mess that up I suppose.

 

[Bearbait2]

Mr. Huntin Dawg,
(Will try this again. Had post completed and when hit the "Add Post", Forum shut down. It wasn't my fault,HONEST!)

Hesitated to reply to this post because we do not have any experience with the .54 caliber Improved Minnie.
However, we have shot the .58 caliber version quite extensively. We do not fill the base with lube or use a wad.
Using 80 to 90 grains of 2F we have found the accuracy to be quite good for our purposes. But like a lot of things, accuracy is a relative thing, imho. We are hunters, not paper punchers (said with respect as how else will we learn what works best if it were not for measurable groups on paper). What we find acceptable for hunting Moose, Caribou and Grizz, others might find unacceptable for their purposes.
I don't know how well the skirt will hold together above 90 grains. Have not felt the need to use more due to the awesome penetration of said projectiles. Even powder charges as low as 70 grains have a reputation for excellent performance on large game (ie: .50-70govt), as demonstrated by all the Buffalo killed in days of yore.

Anyway, both pure lead and those cast from wheel weights have serves us well. Interestingly, not so with REALs. In our firearms, the REALs must be cast from pure lead for best accuracy. Something to do with upsetting and filling the bore (obturation (sp?)), no doubt.
Good luck in your quest.
Best Wishes

 

[jtmattison]

Windwalker,
What is the twist rate in the rifles you are using the minie in? I shot them from a 1:32 using 3f goex. I think I was using 90 grains but it's been a while and I lost my load data I had on an old computer that crashed :cursing:
I think I had them coated with Lee Liquid Alox also. I am going to try them lubed the old fashion way with beeswax/olive oil in the grooves.
I should try them in a couple of my 1:48 rifles. Even though the are "oversize" they fall right down the bore of my GPH.

HD

 

[E Poffinbarger]

Huntin Dawg:

Even though the are "oversize" they fall right down the bore of my GPH

By golly fella, you have your accuracy problem right there, for a shallow rifled, fast twist barrel, the projectile must be a snug fit. No, I didn't say "tight" as in beat it down the bore, but snug.

I've some say that the Minie is designed to be simply dropped down the barrel after the powder and when the rifle fired the skirt flares out to engage the rifling producing 1000 yard accuracy,"right".

However in the real world, when I was testing the Lee projectiles one of their techs finally said that I might have to ream out the mold a little, which promptly send me shopping for another brand of mold.

As you will note the Lyman mold that I referenced in an earlier post produces a .542 diameter projectile which fits snugly in the bore.

Osage

 

[jtmattison]

Osage,
Thanks for the info. If I had an extra fifty bucks I'd order that Lyman mold but due to the season I'm broke. I already have several .54 conical molds. I was just hoping to make this one shoot better. I think I'll give them a try in my rifles with deeper and slower rifling. I just like to experiment with different projectiles. Nobody needs more than one good shooting projectile for their rifle, at least that's what my wife would say :wink:

HD

 

[Bearbait2]

Mr. Huntin Dawg,
One rifle has a gain twist and I do not know what that works out to (will try to find our old paperwork). The other is 1 in 48 as I recall.
For many years we have been using that yellow stuff in a tube for lube and it has served us well. Just switched to Mink tallow (TOW) for this winter's hunting.

Our's is a "snug" fit in the bore and remains seated when firing the other barrel in the Cape Gun. We prefer the Minnie during winter hunts as it is a lot easier to handle/load (compared to PRB) when the temperature drops to -35 degrees below zero. OK.....I'm getting lazy in my old age. :v
Such is life but we are content.
Best Wishes

 

[jtmattison]

Thanks for the info Windwalker. I know what it's like to hunt in -35. I'm a transplanted Alaskan myself. I hunted in Cantwell one year on a subsistence caribou hunt. It was -25 with wind chill of about -45. I wasn't using muzzleloaders back then but I know how hard it is to function in weather like that.

:hatsoff:

HD

 

[longcruise]

I once had a mold for the Lee improved minie in .50 cal. It shot accurately with 50 or 55 grains of ff. Bigger charges = bigger groups.

Same thing with the .58 caliber Lee Target minie It's a flying trash can with a hollow base and lube grooves like their modern tumble lube bullets. At 60 grains the accuracy was great but they spread out as the powder charge went up. My wife killed several mulie bucks with the .58 and 60 grains of ffg. Both less than 50 yards. Absolutely deadly.

We quit hunting with conicals though and have stuck to round balls for many years now. We experienced a bullet sliding in the bore with the .58 :shocked2: Friend of mine had the same exp with his .54 renegade and a maxi ball. He switched too!

If i hunt with conicals again it will be something with a paper or even teflon patch to keep it from moving around.

 

[windwalker_au]

Anybody shoot these regularly with any accuracy? I have the oversize mold, .540 and have shot them from my GPH but just can't get groups out of them. I have not tried filling the base with lube or using a wad. Any suggestions?

HD

i use the .533 one sized to .529 as my bore is .530 it is supper accurate in my tryon plains riffle i have two base plugs for it one std and one that gives a thicker skirt,i use a wad for heavy charges of powder but since i have bin useing lanotec laolin grese in the hollow base i find there is no need for a wad,heres a pic of two cast mini's one with std skirt and one with thick skirt.my twist rate is 1 in 47 but a pal of mine shoots the same mini in his uberti .53 hawken that has a 1 in 66 twist and shoots plenty accurate for hunting wild boars.i find the more powder the better the accuracy.
bernie :thumbsup:

 

[jtmattison]

As you will note the Lyman mold that I referenced in an earlier post produces a .542 diameter projectile which fits snugly in the bore.

Osage

I broke down and ordered the mould today. Hopefully I'll get it this week and be shooting them this weekend. Not like I need another mould for the .54 but I do like to experiment.

HD

 

[rebel727]

I've no experience with a .54 or a Lee Improved for that matter. I do have a Lee improved mold I bought used for ten bucks shipped but never used it as my Lyman 460 gr. traditional works very well even with 100 gr. powder charges out of a .58. I have gotten to where my normal loads are 70 grs. but it wasn't because of accuracy problems, more of a financial problem. :grin:
I keep intending to try the Lee minies just never have.

 

[jtmattison]

Here's the Lyman minie.

I made a mistake and didn't clean the mould good enough before casting so it took a while to get a descent bullet. I still need to clean it better because I have lead sticking in the mould between the blocks. I should have known better. :redface:
I cleaned it with alcohol but I should have given it a good hot soapy water scrub like I usually do with new moulds.
I'm a bit concerned with the core pin also. It seems a bit loose and my bullets skirts are not even.
Oh well, I'll get it up to speed. I should get out this weekend to shoot some of these. I hope they shoot good.

HD

 

[paulvallandigham]

WW: You need to use a OP wad under that hollow base bullet to protect the skirt, as thick as it is, from being melted, or burned, or cut away by hot gases. The bullet may be good enough to hunt boar, but My experience tells me that boar hunting is a pistol range event, and you aren't telling much about the accuracy of a particular bullet with that metaphor. It will shoot much more accurately if you use the wad under the bullet.

HD: The hollow base much be concentric, if you want any accuracy. Until your mold is cleaned so you close it properly, its impossible to say if the problem your HB bullet picture shows is from failure of the mold to close all the way, a loose base pin, or what. Usually, those pins slide in and out like a fine Swiss watch. They are made from similar steel to that used in the mold blocks, so that they expand and contract the same as the mold does when its heated. If the pin is " Loose" I would contact the manufacturer for a replacement.

 

[jtmattison]

The core pin is loose. I gave the mould a VERY good cleaning last night and the pin is still sloppy when installed. I am 100% positive the mould is free of all dirt/lead and is closing tightly. I will contact Lyman.

 

[jtmattison]

Lyman's reply was:

"Normally the base plugs have a few thousandths of play. They should cast a
fairly even base, although it would really not matter in a muzzleloader. It
would have to be extremely uneven to cause any kind of inaccuracy."

:shake:

I guess I'll see at the range. I'll work up a load with the best possible bullets and then shoot a group with the not so good bullets to see where they print.

HD