Leman buttplate matter

[Davemuzz]

I realize at this point, you may be doing the :shake: concerning my questions. But this buttplate thing is making me a bit nutz.

BTW, I did purchase the book "The Gunsmith of Greenville County" and I believe at this point, it's one of the best investments I could make. Even if you don't build a M\L it's a treasure of information.

So, my "issue" is with the Leman buttstock I now have.....but haven't touched yet. The one I ordered is this:

The "problems" I have with it are #1...when I hold this up to my shoulder, the heel of it seems to be somewhat "speer like" and jabs into my shoulder. I'm not Mr. Hulk or anything, but I can just see this being a recoil "issue" with my shoulder. The #2 issue is the plates width. The width is 1-7/32" (Length = 4-11/32). Now, that is somewhat slim, and my concern is with the recoil of a 54 caliber, I think I would be better off with a wider buttplate.

So, I'm considering using this early Hawken buttplate:

This buttplate has the "deep" style curve, and measures 1-7/16" wide....4-3/4" long. It's not all that much wider, but IMHO, every little bit helps. Plus....and most important, it won't stab me if I'm slightly off on the shoulder hold.

I know this is moving away from historically correct, but I'm looking at the practical side of it. At 62, I don't need to be "tough" anymore. :v

 

[JBird]

I may be wrong but I believe those deep crescent buttplates are meant to wrap around your upper arm, not on your actual shoulder?

 

[Davemuzz]

You may be right......however I've been shouldering a rifle for (Let's see....62 minus 9 = 53) 53 years. It's tough to change!! :grin:

 

[jrmflintlock]

Those rifles are heald/shouldered very different than other rifles. The crescent actually goes at the joint of the shoulder, more like at your arm pit/top of your bicep. Your shoulder will actually pivot with the recoil. It takes getting used to but it’s not terribly unpleasant. I too prefer a wide flat butt plate.

Build what you want. Some may tell you not to mix parts. Unless you want to be historically accurate, don’t worry about it.

Just be aware when you get questions about your rifle you are clear it is not exact. We need to be careful when educating folks. The 1970’s set a lot of wrong truths that we are still arguing about today.

Good luck with your build!

 

[stubshaft]

Just one shot with that buttplate mounted normally and you'll find it real easy to change :rotf:

 

[Stophel]

The "spike" at the top of the buttplate is basically a shoulder rest, that sits on top of your arm. I simply cannot hold my arm out "chicken wing" enough to hold the gun up this way... it slides down my arm. One of the many reasons that 19th century rifles just don't suit me at all.

On the buttplate you have, it would be a simple matter to cut and grind off the heel spike, and make the profile essentially identical to the Hawken buttplate. I don't think the minimal width difference would matter. :wink:

 

[Davemuzz]

Well, I've thought about this on and off all day. And frankly, I think what I'm trying to do is hammer a square peg into a round hole. In other words, what I want is a nice looking and accurate rifle, .54 caliber, that pretty much "fits" into my longstanding style of shooting. I'm thinking the Leman style would perhaps be more suited to a smaller caliber rifle that has little or less recoil. (Like .40 or less.)

I purchased the stock from TOtW in 2014 with full "intentions" of making the build. So, here I am thinking "I'm not real sure" if I want a 4.5" drop at comb.....so what do or can I do to make it work?

I think I'll give some serious thought to just buying a more "traditional" stock....such as a full stock Hawken or even a Plains rifle stock. A 2.5" drop at comb, and a bit beefier stock should be more suited to my current "wants."

Less "mental" struggle.....plus I will have full confidence the new rifle will be what I want now.

I appreciate all of your input. And...I'm sure I'll have questions in the future. :shocked2:

 

[Davemuzz]

Well......I ran the cost numbers on getting a new stock and then considered what would I lose by taking the Leman buttstock:

And after outlining what I could grind off of it, I would have a better idea of how it would "fit" into my shoulder and arm.

So, I ground that "sticker point" down and did somewhat of a reshape.....held it to my shoulder with my existing Leman stock and found it to fit better than I had imagined. (I'll post a pic when I can)

Accordingly, after all of THAT......the Leman build is on. Well.....to really begin after I get back from a two week trip. :grin:

 

[Davemuzz]

The beginning of the shaping and prep:

 

[Davemuzz]

I don't believe many Leman's had wedding bands.....or maybe mine is a half-a-band, but I cut one on my buttplate today. Small mistake on the one side which I'm considering making the cut wider all the way around. Hmmmmm.

No comment on the green not quite centered line thing .

 

[Davemuzz]

One matter I notice is the Heel extension rails are not parallel to the top of the top of the heal extension. The rails run at a slight angle (if memory serves me there's a 40-thousands or so more distance at the corner than at the front face.)

So, I am wondering if I should file down the rails so they are parallel to the Heel extension top, or during the inletting, "account" for this slant via leaving more wood at the front face.?

I've taken my rule to many pictures of many different butt plates and the majority have the top of the heel extension right in line with the top of the stock. However, I've measured a few where the stock inletting was parallel with the top of the stock, and the butt plate top would then be at a slight rise from the front face to the heel.

Then again, we are only speaking of 40-thousands or so.....but still, the lines of the stock will look different if I chose to keep the stock inlet parallel with the top of the stock.

I think I will make the adjustment during the inletting of the butt plate, and thus the rails will have a slight fall to them.

Thoughts on this matter?

 

[Stophel]

Ok, you've lost me....are you trying to put octagon flats on the buttplate tang?

Make the top of the buttplate in a straight line with your comb. If you see buttplates that look like they're out of line with the top of the comb, that's most likely wear (or just a poor inletting job).

It is normal for the buttplate tang to be tapered towards the front.

 

[Davemuzz]

It is normal for the buttplate tang to be tapered towards the front.

Thank you! :hatsoff: That's what I wanted to know.

 

[Davemuzz]

Inletting for the BP now. Done for the day. I still need to carve out about 40-thousands more of the stock to get the top of the BP inletted in the stock. Then more rasping to get the curve right.

I gave it some thought that I need to get the top rail extensions properly insetted and to "depth" before I get the curve rasp out. If I don't then I'll need to do the curve twice. Anyway, here's some pics.