Load development

[Sandpounder3/7]

Traded last Saturday for a Cabelas Sporter Hawken (Investarms) in .54 caliber, and finally went and swapped projectiles. I mean to take this rifle hunting this year, and which ever of these is most accurate is what’s gonna go, though if the maxi hunters are decent enough their my number one. In a .54 with 1-48, using triple 7 2ff substitute, about where would y’all start grain wise in your load development? By volume, I don’t have a scale for by weight.

 

[kyron4]

What will you be hunting ?

 

[ETipp]

I suggest you try all of them and see what your particular rifle likes best. Accuracy is key.

Second, what are you going to be hunting and what distances do you plan on shooting?

For deer size critters at 100 yards or so, either of those will be fine. Especially out of a .54 caliber.

If you plan on hunting elk or other large game I would stick with one of the conical you have.

Hunting either one and for shots out past 100 yards I would be using a conical.

 

[Sandpounder3/7]

I’m in East Texas so I’ll be after deer primarily, but hog is a possibility too. The woods are thick so mostly shots Will be 50 yards or less, with some wider areas maybe going to 100.

 

[Patocazador]

In my .54 New Englander I started with 70 gr. of 2F black powder then 75 gr. and then 80 gr. I settled on 80 because the recoil was getting to be uncomfortable. It shot the best pattern (3 shots) with 75 gr. but I moved up to 80 for shooting a bit longer distance.
I used T/C Maxiballs not MaxiHunters.

777 is more powerful so I would start with 65 gr. and go up with 5 gr. increments. If the recoil doesn't bother you, go higher. You might get a better pattern.

Load development with conicals means spending a bit of $$ since so many are shot but a good group is what you want not just one shot.

 

[Sandpounder3/7]

In my .54 New Englander I started with 70 gr. of 2F black powder then 75 gr. and then 80 gr. I settled on 80 because the recoil was getting to be uncomfortable. It shot the best pattern (3 shots) with 75 gr. but I moved up to 80 for shooting a bit longer distance.
I used T/C Maxiballs not MaxiHunters.

777 is more powerful so I would start with 65 gr. and go up with 5 gr. increments. If the recoil doesn't bother you, go higher. You might get a better pattern.

Load development with conicals means spending a bit of $$ since so many are shot but a good group is what you want not just one

How many rounds do you fire per group? In the marines we'd sight in with 3 shot groups until zeroed at 25 yards then confirm and true at 100, though I understand from 9 hole reviews that, well, 9 shots gives a better picture of your rifles cone of fire. That's a lot of loading and cleaning for a muzzleloader though.

 

[64Springer]

No two barrels are the same.

Burn through powder, patch, bullet and ball until you find the recipe that YOUR rifle likes.

There are no shortcuts in load development.


P.S. My groups always consist of seven shots. Be they Black Powder or Smokeless. Seven shots give a good picture of performance/accuracy while allowing for two flyers. Five total is not enough. Nine total is excessive. And never ever ever ever adjust your sights while doing your testing. Aim for the same small spot every single time. You're looking for load/recipe accuracy. Not bullseye accuracy. If the load development group is 4 inches high, low, left, or right it does not matter. Once you find the tightest load/recipe group, THEN adjust your sights to that specific load/recipe.

Try 60, 65, 70 and 75 grains. 28 projectiles for one type of powder. Switch to another powder.....another 28 projectiles.

Document everything you do in a log book.

 

[HSmithTX]

I have a similar Investarms 54, the roundball is plenty for anything in the woods of eastex, even really big hogs, as you know they will run regardless of what they are hit with if you don't get brain or spine. Patch it tight and it will shoot tight. No idea on the 777, I use black powder in mine, 90 grains according to my measure of 2F Schuetzen and swaged .530 balls patched tight with .020" patches, patches lubed with mink oil. It will shoot with most any open sight centerfire rifle for groups at 100 yards. I shot an 8pt buck last season with it at 94 yards, complete pass through just below the cinch ring and maybe a thumb width from where I intended to hit.

The conicals might knock the dribbles in your britches when you get them going fast enough to shoot 100 with no hold over/under from 20 yards out to 100, I want to see no more than 3 inches below or above the light of sight out to 100 and 2 inches is even better, pretty easy to get under 3" above/below with roundballs. The buttplate on these rifles isn't great for 'bear loads' and likely the stock will punch you in the cheekbone at those levels too if you're a fairly average size human. I stopped load development on mine at 90 grains because it was stacking balls on top of each other and the point of aim matched the point of impact. It actually shot great from 65 to 90, when I got POA=POI I called it finished. I don't find the recoil at this level to be an issue at all, but others have commented on it otherwise. I have the same selection of conicals that came with my rifle when I bought it but I haven't bothered to try them, accuracy is far more important to me and I know the roundball will give it to me with enough penetration to kill elk or massive hogs easily.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Traded last Saturday for a Cabelas Sporter Hawken (Investarms) in .54 caliber, and finally went and swapped projectiles. I mean to take this rifle hunting this year, and which ever of these is most accurate is what’s gonna go, though if the maxi hunters are decent enough their my number one. In a .54 with 1-48, using triple 7 2ff substitute, about where would y’all start grain wise in your load development? By volume, I don’t have a scale for by weight.

View attachment 230330

I'd say get a box of Hornady .530 round ball as well, and work up an accurate load with that, THEN test the much more expensive conicals. They will "drop" more because they will have less velocity due to having more mass. So you will need to up the powder from the round ball load.

I'd start with 70 grains with the round balls and make sure the sights are good, then try 80 and 90 grains.

Following that I'd go back down to 70 and try the Buffalo Ball-ets, with that load followed by the Maxi-Hunters. Truth be told the Maxi-Hunters in that weight are more like moose bullets and the Buffalo Bullet Ball-ets are more like Elk bullets. For deer and feral hogs, the round ball would work fine, but if you have a really large feral hog, then you might want to use the Ball-ets.

The animals rarely know the difference as there isn't such a thing as "dead and dead-er". The heavier bullets give you more penetration on a much larger animal, but deer and hogs don't fall into that category.

So to be clear, if they are this size hogs..., round ball no worries...,

When they are getting huge, then yeah you might want to go with something that isn't going to shed velocity as fast due to having more mass.... like one of these monsters...

LD

 

[64Springer]

That's a lot of bacon.

 

[Sandpounder3/7]

That's a lot of bacon.

My thoughts exactly

 

[Sandpounder3/7]

I’ll try that! Thanks Dave and all who’ve replied!

 

[jefair1]

I’m in East Texas so I’ll be after deer primarily, but hog is a possibility too. The woods are thick so mostly shots Will be 50 yards or less, with some wider areas maybe going to 100.

From my 20+ years hunting in Texas, hogs are not a possibility but a probability.

 

[Sandpounder3/7]

From my 20+ years hunting in Texas, hogs are not a possibility but a probability.

I’ve only been here for a few years. Dad was born and raised here then spent 20 years in the navy, thus I was born out of state and raised elsewhere. Came here after I got out of the military myself to be closer to the family here. Loving it!

 

[Vintage Gunsmith]

Years ago, I saw a formula for load development that may be appropriate for this situation. The method involved starting with 200 grains of 3fg and backing off on the load until the bleeding stopped.

Rather than focus on power at first, it would be helpful to know which load is the most accurate. I have used 3 shot groups at 25 yards, starting at a very low volume load--say 50 grains in the .54. Fire the three shots from a good rest and take a look at the group--chances are it isn't going to be what you want. Increase it by 5 grains and repeat the process. At some point, the group will pull together but don't stop there. Increase by a couple more repetitions to the point where the group starts to pull apart. At this point, increase the range to 50 yards, and using the load which produced the best group, fire 3 more shots to see if the group will hold together at the longer range. You can go on either side of this load by increasing or decreasing by 2 grains and at some point arrive at the best group for your gun. You may even want to switch powder granulations during the testing, if not totally exhausted from posting targets and loading the rifle.

Of course, you may want to sacrifice some accuracy for power in hunting but, chances are even though you are not using the most accurate load, you know where the gun shoots.

 

[TKhuntsman]

I will say nothing wrong with 777 in that 54 but remember it burns hot like hot enough with a big charge to melt a soft lead bullet base. I use felt wads over powder and make sure to load 15% down from what would be a maximum black powder charge. I actually prefer the 3F 777 and a magnum #11 cap never had a hangfire while hunting. My charge weight is usually 80-85 gr. I've shot lee REAL, Hornady GP, No Excuses, and bull shop conicals best groups have been with No Excuses 485 grn conicals it kills everything. Like stated before every gun is different this is just what mine likes good luck to you on your way down the rabbit hole.

 

[morehops52]

I shoot 54 and i'm a maxi guy all the way. i've settled on 90g 3f for my general load. For them hogs or elk i'd bump it up to 110. Yeah it rattles your teeth but how many shots are you gonna take in the field? For bench work I use a Lead Sled. You're gonna like this rifle!

 

[PastorB]

For deer and normal sized hogs, you cannot go wrong with a round ball. I use a 60 grain charge (volume) of 3f or equivalent sub, and it just smokes deer sized critters. I do like those Buffalo Ballets, but it has been about 20 years since they have been produced, so once your out, your done. I do not like heavy conicals in my muzzleloaders, expensive and heavy recoiling, and kill no better (if as well) than a PRB.

 

[longcruise]

. I do like those Buffalo Ballets, but it has been about 20 years since they have been produced,....

The Hornaday 240 grain PA conical are very much the same as the Ballets. I've only done limited testing with them but so far the accuracy is pretty good. I've only shot them over 70 grains of 3f though.

I probably won't be hunting with them but I want them for an option in 50 cals to be elk legal for family members who have only 50s which need a minimum 210 grain projectile to be Colorado legal.

 

[ETipp]

I’m in East Texas so I’ll be after deer primarily, but hog is a possibility too. The woods are thick so mostly shots Will be 50 yards or less, with some wider areas maybe going to 100.

If the woods are thick I would definitely be using a concial. They simply retain much more energy than a RB. On average, critters fall must faster with a conical than a RB.

Accuracy is my first concern.

Terrain is second on my list.

Less tracking in thick woods, especially in steep, rough terrain is one of my main concerns.