Maximum charge for a 3rd model dragoon ?

[Luis hernandez]

Hello, I am really learning alot from your wonderful,intelligent and friendly forums ! Thank you, I just want to know the maximum charge for a 3rd model dragoon before I purchase one,Thanks-Luis- :bow:

 

[Wes/Tex]

The max charge is all you can squeeze in there and still seat the ball. Accuracy will probably be around 30-35 grains or less. Those big guns were actually used to hunt buffalo from horseback with shots down and into the chest. Did a good job on yankee horsemen too! :rotf:

 

[Zonie]

One of the neat things about the Dixie Gunworks catalog is all of the information that is in the back of the book.

In this pile of information is a listing of the powder charges that were used in the original guns.

For a Colt's Dragoon, which includes the 1st, 2nd and 3rd model it shows a 40 grain charge of 3Fg powder. In another area it says you should load that gun with a .451 diameter ball (although a .453 diameter ball will also work fine).

If you decide to use a felt wad between the powder and the ball, you may have to reduce the load 5-10 grains.
zonie

 

[TFoley]

35gr of FFFg, a wad then the ball works fine in my old ASM 3rd Model. I must have gotten one of the good ones - in over 20 years nothing has broken nor have the wheels fallen off this oft-maligned make of revolver.

tac

 

[mykeal]

I have a Uberti 2nd Model and a Colt Signature 3rd Model. I regularly shoot 40 gr Goex fffg under a felt wad and a .451 rb with very good results. Accuracy is the same with 35 or 40 gr, falls off above that. The gun will hold more, probably just a bit under 50 gr with a wad, but it's inconsistent with respect to accuracy - groups are +6".

I also shoot 40 gr fffg 777 in the 2nd Model with good results. Haven't chrono'd it, though. Less smoke, more boom (I think), same accuracy, even though it's equivalent to about 45 gr Goex. Could be that accuracy is really limited more by me than the load increasing, as the only side by side comparison was done shooting duelist, and I'm no great pistol shooter. Great fun, though.

 

[oldwolf]

I have a new Whitneyville Dragoon coming my way, hope to get it this week. I will begin with 25 grains Pyrodex and work up until I get the accuracy I need. For fun, I will load some max loads to see how she bucks but likely I will go for accuracy, which will be somewhere around 30-35 grains, or so I hear.

I have a Ruger Old Army that also likes reduced loads with balls. Some say as low as 25 grains gives max accuracy but to do that you will need to load powder, then corn meal filler, then wad and ball, so that the powder will be properly compacted. Accuracy is reduced somewhat if the ball is set deeper in the cylinder, hence the need for corn meal filler.

Have fun with yours, I plan to with mine.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

Greetings Louis & Welcome to the Forum! I own and shoot a lot of C&B revolvers, one of them being the 3rd Model Colt Dragoon. I'm using 45 grains of 3Fg Goex, a wonder-wad, and a .454 Hornady ball.

I use a custom built loading stand so as to enable me to pour the powder into the chambers of the cylinder without spilling any. This loading stand also gives me the chance to make sure that I have an equal seating depth of all of the loaded balls. It does take some force to get all of that powder in there with the wad and the ball on top. What I sometimes do to make it a little easier is to first use the ram to push only the powder down further into the cylinder. This leaves plenty of room for the wonder-wad and the ball! I would recommend 40 grains, the wad and a .454 ball for best over-all accuracy, without ramming the powder first. But you did ask for a MAX charge, so I gave it to you!

My Walker will hold 55 grains of powder without the need to use the ram on the powder, but it is most accurate with a 50 grain charge! Accurate enough to win the entire competition at times, even going up against very accurate single-shot pistols with adjustable sights.

The big Dragoons are natural pointers, and I score better with them and the Walker than I do the 1858 Remmy NMA. The rear sight in the notch of the hammer does take some getting used to, but after you learn where to hold it on the target, you will have tight groups! The best advice that I can give you is to pre-measure all of your charges, do EVERYTHING the SAME, and remember not to flinch! Just let the hammer fall on the cap while the gun is still!

One moe thing...most of these horse pistols were sighted-in for 50 or 75 yards, so you have to aim LOW on the target! My Walker is exactly 6.5 inches high at 25 yards. That would be a good place to start for you!

Let us know how you do. We'll be here if you need any more advice.

Dave

 

[Luis hernandez]

Thank you very much Zonie,fellas ! This is exactly what I mean ,your information is really helpful,I will be moving to El Paso Texas from the very expensive San Francisco Bay area, :v and will look for blackpowder clubs in the vicinity! Thank you much ,-Luis-

 

[Runner]

Mine would hold just a hair over 60 grains of 3f with a ball compressed on top. Around 45 was the accuracy spot with a .457 roundball shaved in. 45 grains under a 250 REAL is slightly compressed. That was the load my gun liked. 40 or 45 under a 250 REAL. Recoil isn't as bad as it sounds because of the size. The Kentucky with 60 grains under a 385 is starting to kick a little! :grin:

 

[oldwolf]

You found that a .457 RB will load easily? I have a ROA so I also have .457RB's, not he .454 recommended for the Dragoon's.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

He just gets a little wider ring of shaved-off lead than I do! Either size will work in most revolvers. Every once in a while (a blue moon) a ball will jump in one chamber due to the chamber being over-bored. This doesn't happen with my guns (all Uberti's) but I heard that it does happen. Using the larger diameter balls in .457 solves the problem! In fact, the use of .457 balls would cause this potential problem to go away before you would notice it! :wink:

Dave

 

[oldwolf]

Well, that is good to know. Maybe I will not have to buy another RB mold.

 

[Runner]

The third models loading bar is heavy enough that cutting in the bigger balls is no problem. On some of the smaller framed guns it can be a pain. The wider contact area of the bigger ball to the rifling can make some guns into tack drivers, and others don't like it at all. The wider contact area also makes flash overs between cylinders less likely.
My favorite bullet in mine was a 250 REAL bullet.

 

[oldwolf]

The funny thing is that Uberti recommends 30 grains as the load to use in their Dragoons. At least, that is what my set of instructions indicate.

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

All of the manufacturers recommend a smaller charge! Sometimes I think that they do it just in case somebody is crazy enough to try 4F in the revolver. Sort of a margin of safety against a lawsuit! Basicly, you can load-up a chamber with as much 3F as it will hold and you won't blow-up the gun :wink: . Just be sure to leave enough room for the cylinder to rotate!

Dave

 

[Dphar]

Hello, I am really learning alot from your wonderful,intelligent and friendly forums ! Thank you, I just want to know the maximum charge for a 3rd model dragoon before I purchase one,Thanks-Luis- :bow:

It will likely shoot best with a powder charge that fills the chamber to the point that seating the ball mildly compresses the powder.
Too much compression will likely blow groups, too little may not shoot well either or may not give consistent ignition.
The best charge will likely be over 40 grains in a Dragoon.
FFFG or maybe FFG will work best.

Dan

 

[Blackpowdercarl]

I just bought an Uberti 3rd model Dragoon. I went shooting and it shot nice but my .451 balls seemed too small. .451 is what I have been using on my Pietta 1860 Army. I love the Dragoons. That is for the powder charge info.