• Friends, our 2nd Amendment rights are always under attack and the NRA has been a constant for decades in helping fight that fight.

    We have partnered with the NRA to offer you a discount on membership and Muzzleloading Forum gets a small percentage too of each membership, so you are supporting both the NRA and us.

    Use this link to sign up please; https://membership.nra.org/recruiters/join/XR045103

Misinformation on GB

Muzzleloading Forum

Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Over the past 12 years I've sold over 2000 muzzleloaders on Gunbroker with over 600 positive feedback (about 1 out of 3 bother to post one). I try to list all defects that I can find and most people comment that the item was better than they expected. I try to answer all questions sent to me and offer to take additional pictures requested of a specific part of the gun. I try to ship within 2 days of receiving payment. If I have honesty missed something (and I have) I will offer a refund or discount the price accordingly. I can not speak for any dealer but myself but hate to have someone say that the entire platform it some way crooked or out to deceive their customers.
 
Yep i
I sell on gunbroker. I'm not a scammer and back up everything I sell. I know what I'm selling. My descriptions are accurate. You will receive a muzzleloader as good or better than the description. So, there's at least one honest seller there.
See your stuff all the time. Usually have one or two in my watch list. If I ever get over being broke I'm probably gonna buy something from you.
 
Over the past 12 years I've sold over 2000 muzzleloaders on Gunbroker with over 600 positive feedback (about 1 out of 3 bother to post one). I try to list all defects that I can find and most people comment that the item was better than they expected. I try to answer all questions sent to me and offer to take additional pictures requested of a specific part of the gun. I try to ship within 2 days of receiving payment. If I have honesty missed something (and I have) I will offer a refund or discount the price accordingly. I can not speak for any dealer but myself but hate to have someone say that the entire platform it some way crooked or out to deceive their customers.
I'm watching two of yours right now. You always have cool stuff.
 
Actually my last "bargain" was off Gun Broker. There was a very rusty used Bess. I wasn't sure but I thought the side plate had been after market replaced, and was now rounded, and as I had scrounged a Bess Barrel IF the barrel was bad I could deal with that. It was priced as I thought a rusty (I mean it was orange) Bess should be priced at. So I bid and won.

What I got was a defarbed, Pedersoli Bess, with round side plate, re-engraved lock which now read "Grice 1757" instead of the incorrect "Grice 1762" of a factory gun, and an older style butt plate. The rust was all surface rust. It came with a bayonet and so I saved about half of what it was probably worth.

LD
 
I've bought and sold many guns on there. I'm still OK with buying. You just have to know what you're looking at and ask questions. I've had hundreds of transactions on there and only burned by sellers a couple times. I've learned that many sellers on there don't really know black powder. Hence all the cap guns labeled as flintlocks. And the other day I saw an Ultra Hi, or one of those types, listed as a Thompson Hawken. The two burns were a flintlock smoothie the hammer wouldn't stay back on (not mentioned in the listing), and a .36 squirrel rifle the seller said was new and unfired. That guy was a total liar. The .36 had alot of problems. Including a severely fouled "unfired" barrel and a mushroomed nipple. I knew that guy was full of it when I looked at the pictures but got it cheap enough that, after some serious cleaning, it is one of my favorite rifles. I think by unfired he really meant uncleaned.On that flintlock, I got it for about a hundred bucks and, other than the lock issue, the thing looks close to unfired so I didn't complain about either. Many others I've bought were not quite as nice as described but, then again, I practically stoled them they were so cheap, so I never sweated it. Lots of folks are gonna fluff their stuff trying to make a sale but there are many great sellers on there. I've had more trouble with buyers that won't pay or communicate. I will continue to buy there as long as I do my homework before clicking the button. I just won't sell on there anymore. When you do have a problem customer service from GunBroker sucks and I don't like the way they randomly pull fees from my account at odd and random times. As for buying I've been at least 95% satisfied there.
 
Late last summer I bought three muzzleloaders on GB. One was a .54 New Englander, one was a .54 Investarms trade rifle, and the other was a CVA .50 Trapper pistol (not the Traditions Trapper). The two rifles came from gun shops and the pistol was from an individual. The TC rifle cost me a whopping $145.00 plus shipping. It showed up fast and looks almost brand new. Other than a small blemish on the outside of the barrel it would have passed for new. The trade rifle looks new on the outside but there was some funk in the bore. No big deal. It was $155.00. and the pistol was $150. Well used but the seller had taken care of it and it was super clean inside and out. All arrived fast with good communication from each seller. That's what I usually get when buying on GunBroker. Just never expect it to be as good as you were told and sometimes you get a nice surprise when the box gets opened.
 
I've bought and sold many guns on there. I'm still OK with buying. You just have to know what you're looking at and ask questions. I've had hundreds of transactions on there and only burned by sellers a couple times. I've learned that many sellers on there don't really know black powder. Hence all the cap guns labeled as flintlocks. And the other day I saw an Ultra Hi, or one of those types, listed as a Thompson Hawken. The two burns were a flintlock smoothie the hammer wouldn't stay back on (not mentioned in the listing), and a .36 squirrel rifle the seller said was new and unfired. That guy was a total liar. The .36 had alot of problems. Including a severely fouled "unfired" barrel and a mushroomed nipple. I knew that guy was full of it when I looked at the pictures but got it cheap enough that, after some serious cleaning, it is one of my favorite rifles. I think by unfired he really meant uncleaned.On that flintlock, I got it for about a hundred bucks and, other than the lock issue, the thing looks close to unfired so I didn't complain about either. Many others I've bought were not quite as nice as described but, then again, I practically stoled them they were so cheap, so I never sweated it. Lots of folks are gonna fluff their stuff trying to make a sale but there are many great sellers on there. I've had more trouble with buyers that won't pay or communicate. I will continue to buy there as long as I do my homework before clicking the button. I just won't sell on there anymore. When you do have a problem customer service from GunBroker sucks and I don't like the way they randomly pull fees from my account at odd and random times. As for buying I've been at least 95% satisfied there.
Fully agree that the customer service is terrible. I've really slowed down on selling there since they started forcing us to collect sales tax (which I just don't think should be my job) and those user fees drive me nuts! They never explain what it is we are paying for...just got to pay it. No, they are not perfect but they can be a useful tool but as you say, you have to pay attention and be careful.
 
Your conclusion is premature. Yes, do your research, and I think you need do more. Don't make a general conclusion based on a few instances.

I think the main problem with black powder sellers is they sometimes don't know their black powder guns. Those sellers are pretty easily filtered out of your search criteria. If their descriptions seem vague or inaccurate you simply don't bid on their auctions. It's really not that hard to avoid getting bit.
Premature? At what point should I consider the number of inaccurate or misleading listings to be just the right number to be timely? Because I certainly don't want to arrive late to the conclusion.
 
Premature? At what point should I consider the number of inaccurate or misleading listings to be just the right number to be timely? Because I certainly don't want to arrive late to the conclusion.
If you haven't been personally burned you have no empirical data to arrive at a definitive conclusion. And even then it would be a one-instance single-seller conclusion, not generally inclusive of the entire platform and all sellers by any stretch of your statistical imagination.
 
If you haven't been personally burned you have no empirical data to arrive at a definitive conclusion. And even then it would be a one-instance single-seller conclusion, not generally inclusive of the entire platform by any stretch of your statistical imagination.
Pardon me, maybe I wrote something I didn't mean to, but what did I write that made you believe that I was referring to the entire GB platform?
 
Pardon me, maybe I wrote something I didn't mean to, but what did I write that made you believe that I was referring to the entire GB platform?
You said:
I've come to the conclusion that there are a lot of Black Powder sellers on GunBroker that spread misinformation regarding their auctions in the description. Especially about Colt 2nd Series, F Series, Signature Series, etc. Be careful what you read there and do some research.
I suppose you're going to dispute the imputation of your so-called "conclusion" about GB sellers because your original statement limited your "conclusion" to Black Powder sellers only? Sheesh. OK, I give that nit-pick to you. Your "conclusion" is still premature. I've purchased multiple black powder firearms on GB with absolutely no misrepresentations or any other kind of transaction problems whatsover. If you've had a personal negative experience, I'm sure it was unique to that single experience, and that's still too small of a brush with which to tar all black powder sellers, if that's the GB universe subset of sellers you're unhappy with.
 
Last edited:
You said:

I suppose you're going to dispute the imputation of your so-called "conclusion" about GB sellers because your original statement limited your "conclusion" to Black Powder sellers only? Sheesh. OK, I give that nit-pick to you. Your "conclusion" is still premature. I've purchased multiple black powder firearms on GB with absolutely no misrepresentations or any other kind of transaction problems whatsover. If you've had a personal negative experience, I'm sure it was unique to that single experience.
Well I feel that somehow I have offended some otherwise honest and knowledgeable sellers and perhaps buyers on GB. That was not at all my intention. Sure there are many, in fact the vast majority, are selling and/or buying successfully leaving a wake of many happy buyers/sellers. I personally have never been burned on GB, it was a conclusion drawn on a very small sample size, but none-the-less significant.

My original statement was driven by searching for a couple of BP models and I probably viewed a couple of dozen listings. Out of those two dozen I found 3 or 4 in which the Title, Description and photo's did not match or were simply incorrect. In my mind 12% to 16% erroneous/misleading listings constitutes "a lot". So the comment was directed to people that may not know that it may be possible to get the wrong impression by merely relying on some of the information presented. You can take that for what it's worth, but thats my "statistics".

Sorry I stepped on your toes. I'll try to come prepared with my statistical analysis a little more organized the next time I make a "generalized" statement.
 
The worst rip offs I have experienced over the years were from Ebay (more than ten years ago) and right here on this forum (last year). I have had differences of opinion regarding condition on GunBroker in the past, resolved and reimbursed. Against those, I have had numerous positive experiences on both GunBroker and the Muzzleloading Forum. The only right-out theft was from someone who hijacked a member's ID here on the Muzzleloading Forum and took me for $750. Blasting an entire forum (this or others) based on a small number of bad experiences is just ignorant. I just came home from a poor dining experience in a resort town; I would not even think of blaming the entire city for one bad experience. If I have multiple bad experiences from the same place, SHAME ON ME!

ADK Bigfoot
 
I figure eventually someone on this forum will "want" something I have in my cache of what "Management" (wife) considers Creek Trash and alas! the old man can, at last, prove to be semi-coherent for saving that one thing for 50 years. While I sold stuff on EBay when it first started, I got burned and Gunstroker is too complicated for me to start at age 75. A 25-mile one-way trip to a full service post office means I have to take a pee break going and coming to mail a package.

So, I say "nay-nay" to a second career as an internet merchant, but if I offer you something, it's the real deal. Too dumb to cheat, too old to do time.
 
I figure eventually someone on this forum will "want" something I have in my cache of what "Management" (wife) considers Creek Trash and alas! the old man can, at last, prove to be semi-coherent for saving that one thing for 50 years. While I sold stuff on EBay when it first started, I got burned and Gunstroker is too complicated for me to start at age 75. A 25-mile one-way trip to a full service post office means I have to take a pee break going and coming to mail a package.

So, I say "nay-nay" to a second career as an internet merchant, but if I offer you something, it's the real deal. Too dumb to cheat, too old to do time.
I don't think I'd have a problem buying from you when that time comes.
 
I only started collecting Colt 2nd gen percussion revolvers in earnest back around 2010. Prior to that I had purchased one of the first C series 1851 Navies when they came out in 1971. Later on in 1975, I got a C series 3rd model Dragoon and then in 1978 or 79 got one of the first F series 1860 Armies. Then I got married so life and family pretty much put my Colt 2nd gen collecting on a permanent halt. I missed the 3rd gens and didn't even know they existed until much later.

By 2010 I had been divorced for 5 years and retired for 3. I discovered Gunbroker and the Colt forum. Having picked up several of the Dennis Adler coffee table books and a copy of Dennis Russell's Collector's handbook and price guide for 2nd generation percussion Colt revolvers, which included all the history of how the line came to exist, how it was produced, and distributed plus all the items that were cataloged--including the 3rd gens. Armed with this info I was able to navigate Gunbroker and online live auctions to end up building a pretty good collection. I have maybe 30 or more 2nd gens including 2 or more of all the standard catalog items. I bought the majority on Gunbroker.com.

The fact that so many people including most sellers know very little about how these were produced was an advantage to me. Up until the pandemic, the prices were still quite reasonable compared to common Uberti's and Pietta's. Besides, I was buying these as collectables and not to shoot. I had less expensive Uberti's and PIetta's for that. Now, I couldn't afford any of the fancy engraved Ivory gripped models that came out of the Colt custom shop but I've got pretty much everything else I wanted and at prices that one can't touch these days. I didn't try to collect the 3 stainless steel models because they never existed as a 1st gen original. I did pick up two 3rd gens---a cased Walker and a Pocket 1849. The Walker because the case duplicated the famous Danish Sea captain Walker that sold for about 2 million several years ago and the 1849 because Colt sold more of those than any other pistol back in the 19th century--even the 51 Navy.

Still, I would routinely scour GunBroker every day for bargains that would pop up. I would actually look for items that were listed incorrectly because that was sometimes where the real gems were hidden. I never had an issue with any Gunbroker seller that wasn't resolved to my satisfaction in all that time. I knew that I had the proper written resources for all the 2nd gens and even 3 gens that I needed and that I didn't have to pay much attention to the constant misinformation that most sellers used to describe them. I have two or three of most of these along with seven 51 Navies out of either a Lee or a Grant set along with plenty of custom-cased sets

Every post deserves a little gun **** to look at so here ya go:

All eleven of the standard 2nd gen models with the exception of the F series 51 Navy and 3rd model Dragoon since I alread had those in the C series. Also none of the short runs (100 or less) that Colt produced to cover production errors and part overruns.

IMG_1684.resized for post.JPG
The cased Walker is a 3rd gen picked up on Gunbroker with all accessories and original Colt inner and out boxes for $700. Of course the long barrelled SAA to its right is not a Colt. It'a Uberti movie replica of the revolver that Kirk Russell used in the movie Tombstone
1719889886499.png

Here's a case that was one of 25 made to house and electroless nickle 1860 Army. I won the case minus revolver in a live auction out of Gettysburg about a year ago so I just stuck one of my regular 2nd gens in it. However, the shoulder stock attachment hook and knurled knob plus the sling ring are have the same nickle finish that the original revolver had. I doubt I'll ever find one of those long gone electroless nickel 2nd gen Armies.
1719890381207.png



Cheers
 
Last edited:
I only started collecting Colt 2nd gen percussion revolvers in earnest back around 2010. Prior to that I had purchased one of the first C series 1851 Navies when they came out in 1971. Later on in 1975, I got a C series 3rd model Dragoon and then in 1978 or 79 got one of the first F series 1860 Armies. Then I got married so life and family pretty much put my Colt 2nd gen collecting on a permanent halt. I missed the 3rd gens and didn't even know they existed until much later.

By 2010 I had been divorced for 5 years and retired for 3. I discovered Gunbroker and the Colt forum. Having picked up several of the Dennis Adler coffee table books and a copy of Dennis Russell's Collector's handbook and price guide for 2nd generation percussion Colt revolvers, which included all the history of how the line came to exist, how it was produced, and distributed plus all the items that were cataloged--including the 3rd gens. Armed with this info I was able to navigate Gunbroker and online live auctions to end up building a pretty good collection. I have maybe 30 or more 2nd gens including 2 or more of all the standard catalog items. I bought the majority on Gunbroker.com.

The fact that so many people including most sellers know very little about how these were produced was an advantage to me. Up until the pandemic, the prices were still quite reasonable compared to common Uberti's and Pietta's. Besides, I was buying these as collectables and not to shoot. I had less expensive Uberti's and PIetta's for that. Now, I couldn't afford any of the fancy engraved Ivory gripped models that came out of the Colt custom shop but I've got pretty everything else I wanted. I didn't try to collect the 3 stainless steel models because they they never existed as a 1st gen original.

Still, I would routinely scour GunBroker every day for bargains that would pop up. I would actually look for items that were listed incorrectly because that was sometimes where the real gems were hidden. I never had an issue with any Gunbroker seller that wasn't resolved to my satisfaction in all that time. I knew that I had the proper written resources for all the 2nd gens and even 3 gens that I needed and that I didn't have to pay much attention to the constant misinformation that most sellers used to describe them. I have two or three of most of these along with seven 51 Navies out of either a Lee or a Grant set along with plenty of custom cased sets

Every post deserves a little gun **** to look at so here ya go:

All eleven of the standard 2nd gen models with the exception of the F series 51 Navy and 3rd model Dragoon since I alread had those in the C series. Also none of the short runs (100 or less) that Colt produced to cover production errors and part overruns.

View attachment 331380
The cased Walker is a 3rd gen picked up on Gunbroker with all accessories and original Colt inner and out boxes for $700. Of course the long barrelled SAA to its right is not a Colt. It'a Uberti movie replica of the revolver that Kirk Russell used in the movie Tombstone
View attachment 331381
Here's a case that was one of 25 made to house and electroless nickle 1860 Army. I won the case minus revolver in a live auction out of Gettysburg about a year ago so I just stuck one of my regular 2nd gens in it. However, the shoulder stock attachment hook and knurled knob plus the sling ring are have the same nickle finish that the original revolver had. I doubt I'll ever find one of those long gone electroless nickel 2nd gen Armies.
View attachment 331382


Cheers
Very much appreciate the ****! Nice collection
 
Over the past 12 years I've sold over 2000 muzzleloaders on Gunbroker with over 600 positive feedback (about 1 out of 3 bother to post one). I try to list all defects that I can find and most people comment that the item was better than they expected. I try to answer all questions sent to me and offer to take additional pictures requested of a specific part of the gun. I try to ship within 2 days of receiving payment. If I have honesty missed something (and I have) I will offer a refund or discount the price accordingly. I can not speak for any dealer but myself but hate to have someone say that the entire platform it some way crooked or out to deceive their customers.
I once bought a Pietta 12 gauge from you. Impulse buy, (of course) and I only patterned the gun before cleaning it and putting it up. My granddaughter saw it and had to have it so off it went. Hangs on her wall now… 🧐

Anyway… there are lots of great sellers on GB. If something seems sketchy avoid it. I’ve bought much more than I’ve sold an only been truly disappointed with one Ruger Old Army which had been worked over by a shade tree gunsmith. I didn’t overspend on it so I dropped in a pawl, trigger and hammer and she’s as good as new. Also once found a Pietta Shooters Model that nobody seemed to recognize by the silver plated trigger guard. I paid used Pietta price for it and it’s been a wonderful revolver.

@Frontstuffer as you point out, it’s not important that the seller knows what he has as long as the buyer does. Sometimes items can be ridiculously priced due to sellers ignorance but that’s par for the course no matter what the object of interest actually is…

(famous Craigslist quote, “Don’t try to lowball me, I know what I have!” Says the guy with a clapped out AMF Sportster…)
 
Back
Top