modern bullets for hunting

[86marine]

I have a .36 cal shenandoah long rifle i can only find round balls for it, But i want to hunt more than squirell with it. Such as hog and coyote size critters.

I believe I could use a .348 or .351 modern bullet in hollowpoint from speer or hornady each one you can find from 180 grain and up or you can cast them at a lower weight.

Who has any ideas how well this would work or if it would exceed the pressures the barrel could withstand.

 

[FPDoc]

It will depend on the twist rate of your barrel, if it is 1-48" or so it should stabilize the bullet, if a slower twist, like 1-66" it wouldn't and would be for RB only. It seems that 1-48" and 1-66" or so are pretty much industry standards. I think that here are variables related to bore diameter as well with larger bores needing less twist at some point as in .58 needing a bit less twist than .54 etc. I'm pretty sure that someone who does know will have their coffee soon and can give you a much better answer.

 

modern bullet in hollowpoint

:shake:

 

[R.M.]

Why would you want to take something that's old and make it modern?
If you want more killing power, get a larger caliber.
That's my take on it. Welcome. There's a great wealth of info here, both in the archives and by asking questions.

 

[BrownBear]

I'd get some 36 cal Maxis from Track of the Wolf, maybe even track down a used mold if you decide you like them. You can order the maxis here.

I'm betting anything longer and heavier isn't going to stabilize in your Shenandoah, especially as the range stretches and the velocity drops.

 

[Supercracker]

a .36 in the vitals will bring down all but the biggest hogs.

SF!

 

[John Wasmuth]

As was said, your barrel has to be twisted properly to shoot modern projectiles. You may be able to find some buffalo ballets for that caliber. I hunt meat hogs, in the 65 pound class, coyotes, squirrel, rabbit, turkey, whitetail doe deer and a few others with my .32, 40 grains of FFg and a hornady .310 patched roundball. Keep your shots realistic and pick your shots well.

 

[FPDoc]

This actually sounds like the perfect opportunity to .. get a bigger rifle.. I once ordered a blanket rifle case and it was just too long .. so.. I bought a longer rifle, it was just the excuse I needed. If it would help I'm sure we could come up with a good post you could copy to show the family about how in the interest of humane harvesting of game that your only reasonable option would be an additional caliber.

 

[86marine]

Thanks for the replies I had been trying to find .36 maxis, andthats why I got curious about the modern bullets.

My Rifle has the 1:48 twist so I think I will get some maxis and try those for serious use, and try the modern Hp's just to see what happens.

I am in Pa and our muzzleloading rules say for a rifle it needs to be atleast .44 cal for deer even though I am sure and comfortable that the .36 will do the job reliably.

But thats why I have my Pennsylvania in .50 is for deer. I just like how much of a tack driver the .36 is and would like to make it more widely used on game than target.

 

[BrownBear]

...and try the modern Hp's just to see what happens.

Let us know how it turns out. I'm lots more interested in first hand accounts than pet theories. I've got such an overworked curiosity gland, I'd have been dead long ago if I was a cat. :grin:

 

[86marine]

I,ll make sure to post the results of both maxi and modern once i get them in and get them chronoed.

I love the tradition of these rifles but am always curious of other possibilties.

Just like at my sportsmens club everyone said a .270 win couldnt be a competitive 1000 yard rifle but it does better than the .308 and 06's

I am a Marine three time award expert so putting a properly placed shot is no problem for me whatsoever, and I like to prove people just because it isnt the norm doesnt make it impossible

 

[86marine]

Hell just on monday i shot a 10 pt with my mosin open sight at three fifty just because my cousin said he didnt think i could put a round in the vitals at that range open sight.

But thats the Army for you thinking that a 500m capable rifle is only good at 300m. Just a bit of branch competition between us just a bit.

 

[Josh Smith]

Hello,

Why not just cast up some hard balls?

I have some really hard ones in .440" and .490" that are 90% lead and 10% Linotype. They feel like steel ball bearings. I'm not certain they'd flatten at all.

The others I use are made from 10:1 lead/tin, no antimony. I prefer these for general shooting and while they should expand in game, they won't flatten as much as pure lead, and should still punch through-and-through pretty much anything.

If I were going hog hunting, I'd use the Linotype hardened ones. I'm sure they'd punch through the gristle shield.

Coyotes don't take much killin'. I use a .22LR and take them cleanly - or used to. I have trouble on the trigger now. I had a wolfdog (mostly wolf) for a year or so, currently have a very low content wolfdog who is my best friend, and have come to know a coydog very well. He resides at the local gunshop. Very intelligent creature and, while shy, he comes running to me before anyone else when I walk in.

I'm one of those folks who knows how to communicate with these animals. One of my other hobbies.

But last time I went coyote hunting, I had trouble on the trigger. Tika, Nikki, and Bear all kept flashing through my mind.

But I digress.

You hit a hog with a .36, especially if it's a harder cast, and it will punch through to the vitals. Might keep a Navy on hand (don't try to load this with anything but dead soft lead) for backup, but I see no problems.

I am actually looking forward to this. Hogs have penetrated into Southern Indiana; I know some folks who have take 'em. They're moving north, and I have some prime deer habitat here that hogs will root up. All arms will come to bear in that case. I'll be trying to cull them out faster than they can breed.

Josh

 

[86marine]

Yeah hogs are a rising problem here in Pa as well, and i will try out your casting formula I usually cast my balls all lead for this gun since i use it more for hitting gongs on a walk through course at my local club

Thanks

 

[Zonie]

IMO, the jacketed bullets aren't an answer.
Even patched for the .36 caliber their jacket will have no give at all when your loading.

This 'give' includes not only the bullet deforming slightly to match the grooves but the exterior deforming to match the weave of the fabric.
Without this the patch will slip badly while the bullet is being fired.

Like you, I note that Dixie and TOTW don't carry any lead bullets for a .36 but in Lymans BLACK POWDER HANDBOOK & LOADING MANUAL they tested a Buffalo HP Conical 125 grain bullet in their .36.

They did not use powder loads over 70 grains and at a 70 grain loading they were finding breech pressures of 19,600 psi.
These small bored guns rapidly develop high breech pressures with heavy powder loads or with heavy projectiles. Keep in mind, the typical .350 roundball commonly used in a .36 only weighs about 65 grains.

If I really wanted to try using a modern bullet in a .36 I would try a pure lead bullet cast using a 9mm or .380, 125 grain bullet mold like this one: http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=994155

Even with this bullet cast from pure lead I would expect to have patching and accuracy problems.

 

[86marine]

Thanks for the link to that mold but with a .356 diameter i think that is close enough to just use lube like on a maxi ball. Once I get inthe maxi balls i did find im going to mic them out to see if that idea will work or if i need bigger like .358 or .359.

Because if i can cast them the easier i will be able to tweak it for what I want i different situations

 

[Stubert]

I tried .451 lead swc's in a 45 cal muzzleloader with less than stellar results. I would stick to what its made for, then get another rifle, you have a reason now.

 

[Josh Smith]

Yeah hogs are a rising problem here in Pa as well, and i will try out your casting formula I usually cast my balls all lead for this gun since i use it more for hitting gongs on a walk through course at my local club

Thanks

One thing, you try this, water drop 'em. I found it shrinks them back to where they're supposed to be rather than casting large.

Josh

 

[Dphar]

I have a .36 cal shenandoah long rifle i can only find round balls for it, But i want to hunt more than squirell with it. Such as hog and coyote size critters.

I believe I could use a .348 or .351 modern bullet in hollowpoint from speer or hornady each one you can find from 180 grain and up or you can cast them at a lower weight.

Who has any ideas how well this would work or if it would exceed the pressures the barrel could withstand.

Its the RIFLING twist. Check the twist is a 35 Remington or a 357 mag revolver.

Get a 50 or 54 caliber round ball rifle.

At BP velocities its going to be difficult to get a 180 grain slug from a 36 kill as well as a 180 grain RB. This was all hashed out before the American Civil War. But the people that invented the modern ML bullet don't care to here is. After all newer has to be better (even if its not) or its not going to sell well.

At 50yards a 36 RB will make a coyote pretty sick. Hogs? You need a bigger bore size.

Dan

 

[CoyoteJoe]

Your .36 most likely neasures .360" land to land. If the grooves are at least .005" deep then you'd need .370" to fill the grooves and your grooves may well be deeper. A naked .38 pistol bullet (.358") will slip down the bore without engraving but with even a very thin patch you'd never be able to force it down. While a 48" twist may shoot a T/C maxi OK those are very short bullets and expressly designed for muzzleloaders with a smaller base to start down bore and a larger top band to engage the rifling. I too enjoy experimenting but I very much doubt you'll find any bullet, other than perhaps the maxi, that gives useful accuracy.