Moose juice

[tjohnson56]

OK, I have not shot my ML'ers in about 5 or 6 years. Tomorrow I'm going to the range! I got some pillow ticking and cut it to 1 1/2 inch strips, put T/C bore butter on one strip. Got some Hoppe's #9 plus to try and will be starting with PRB.

I have all the stuff to make Moose Juice, here's my plan. I'll mix it up in a half gal jug but how do I apply it to the patches? Do I just put the strips in a bowl, shake the jug and pour some on and stir the strips around then pull them out and let them dry on wax paper? Then repete? I plan on patching at the barrel for all the shots.

Is this how you use Moose juice or am I missing something? And how long will it keep in the jug?

And BTW I'll be using Pyrodex, but I have some black on the way.

Any words of wisdom would be welcome and thanks for all the help so far, I've learned a lot reading here on the forum.

Please fill me in on the Moose juice

 

[jtmattison]

My preferred method for for making moose juice patches is to cut in strips, soak, dry, soak again, dry, use.
On low humidity days you can use patching damp with juice to keep fouling manageable.
I keep a small spray bottle of it handy to spritz patches on dry days when fouling seems to be building up.

HD

 

[tjohnson56]

So I need to let it soak? For how long? And do I need to stir it while it's soaking?

I'm thinking of putting it in a zip lock to take to the range, good, bad?

 

[jtmattison]

I shake it up and just dip the patching in to soak it. Let it dry and repeat. After it is dry again I roll it up and store in a tin. You can put it in a zipper bag, film canister, or whatever suits your needs.
Having a small spray bottle of juice is very handy on the range too.

HD

 

[tjohnson56]

How do I know if I need more juice at the range? And how much is too much to add?

 

[jtmattison]

If fouling seems to be building in the barrel or if loading is too hard after a shot or two you most likely need to use a damper patch. You should be able to shoot several shots without having to clean between shots and each shot should load as easy as the first.
It comes with practice and experience I guess. You'll get the feel for it.
Go have fun. That's the key.
We're always here to help if you have questions.

HD

 

[tjohnson56]

Thanks Bud, I'll give it a try tomorrow. All I'm trying to do is come up with a hunting load for this coming deer season and thanks to all of the guys on the forum I've saved a ton of round balls already.

I really want to get a load I feel I can trust to put the lead in the boiler house.

The thing that worries me is where I hunt it can be very cold, sometimes -20 or colder and I don't know how Bore Butter or the other lubes will act when it's cold.

The temp is why I want to know if black is better than Pyrodex, I've had a few miss-firers with Pyrodex in the past and lube seams to be the next most important thing.

I'm thinking I'll go with Black, corn meal and a ball-ette just to stay away from the lube coming into contact with the black.

Does this sound way out there or is there some logic in what I'm trying to do.

 

[MercerLake]

:v In my experience Bore-Butter and other similar grease concoctions do not work well as a patch lube at low temperatures. Have had patches freeze to the ball and travel with the ball to the target at 100 yards. A patch lubed with a lube that does not contain water or a dry patch will work fine at temperatures below freezing.
I use bear oil or mink oil with no problem. An OverPowder wad will prevent any excess lube from contaminating the powder. Tablet backers or milkcarton material and an Arch Punch and you have lots of wads cheap.
Ignition failure problems with Pyrodex at low temps are common, use Black Powder.
Good hunting! :v

 

[shmrck1]

apache,
I personally use Moose Snot as a patch lube rather than the Moose(Juice)Milk,but to each his own.
snake-eyes :hmm:

 

[BrownBear]

For pure hunting loads, I'd sure dispense with the corn meal if possible. Dandy range medicine, but an extra step that really fiddly for fast reloads on a hunt. Lots of smoke and mirrors out there about burnt patches, when more often it's a lube failure in my experience. I've never had a paste type lube or a dry lube like the Moose versions foul a load on long days in the field. If you need to put something between the powder and PRB, look into lubed felt wads. They're sure easier to manage in the field. Save the corn meal for muffins.

 

[paulvallandigham]

If there is going to be a " Second Shot"-- and I consider that a freak incident for most hunts, based on my experiences--- go ahead and skip the fillers. Run a PRB that is lubed with whatever- even spit works-- down and shoot. Second shots are usually closer than first shots, although not always. However, if you missed with the first shot, and the animal is going away from you, you are less likely to hit him with that second shot, regardless of how you load the gun for that second shot.

Because I think of ML hunting as a " One shot, One Kill " kind of sport, I take great care in loading my rifle for that one and only shot. I do use an OP Wad or filler over the powder to protect the powder from oil or water infiltration during the hunt. And, taking my flask with extra corn meal in it, for a second load is not big burden. It is bulkier than a few OP wads in my pouch, and that is why I am experimenting with OP wads.
I do a " quick " ( I use that term guardedly, because I really don't feel that 20 seconds meets most people's understanding of the word " quick " )reload after knocking down a deer, simply to be able to finish the animal off to relieve suffering, if the first shot hit somewhere other than where I aimed it. But, such shots are taken from a few feet away from the animal, so that fine accuracy is not needed. If the animal expires while I am loading that second shot, I empty the gun by firing the load off into the ground or a tree.

 

[Stumpkiller]

I mix mine up in two-liter soda bottles and then shake it well and pour it into a pie tin. I then run 1-1/2" x 6 ft strips or patching through the pan to soake them well and DRY THEM LAYING FLAT ON SHEET OF WAXED PAPER. I have found this to be VERY important to make sure the Milk doesn't run down before the alcohol evaporates leaving an inconsistant saturation. I let these dry overnight and roll them and then store in Baggies.

In my pouch I have a deerskin bag that has had melted beewax spread inside. I carry the roll in this to keep it clean and protect the other stuff in my pouch from the oils.

 

[paulvallandigham]

YOu might consider using an ink roller- buy them at either office supply, hobby shops, and at some hardware stores-- to roll out and flatten the patching strips on the wax paper. This presses the liquid through the fabric, making better distribution of the oil and alcohol, while pushing excess off to the edges where it will evaporate faster. The roller makes fast work of laying out the strips to dry, and getting the wet fabric to lay flat. :thumbsup:

 

[Don B]

Apache,

Are you planning to hunt with a fouled bore? If not, since you're working up a hunting load, I would think you'd want to be wiping between shots so that you're shooting out of a clean bore, as you would be with your first shot in the field.

Don

 

[paulvallandigham]

YOu can thin bore butter, with alcohol, and then apply it to your patches in cold weather. The alcohol evaporates, but the patch remains lubed. Use an OP wad- they are faster to use than fillers-- on top of the powder to protect the powder charge from being weakened by the infiltration of water from the air, or from a water based patch lube. This works particularly well in freezing temperatures.

I hve only hunted a couple of days when it was below freezing, and not ever when it was below zero degrees F, out, at least not with a gun. I did hunt in that kind of cold temperatures as a kid with a rabbit stick, and/or bow and arrow. If you wear the right clothing, it can be quite enjoyable. The air is extremely dry, the snow squeaks at a higher pitch the colder it gets, under your boots, and even the birds don't " sing " to save evergy. Ground winds, even as light as 10 MPH will cause a white out from your waist down, blowing snow over the surface of the snow and lifting it up into that lower level of airspace. It can be bright, clear, skies above, and you still can't see your buddy's legs if he's 20 yards away from you!

Oh, I have shot targets at the club range in Below Freezing temperature with my Mlers, and for years I personally sponsored a New Year's Day Shoot at the club in order to encourage members to find out how to make their guns work properly in below freezing temperatures. A lot of members got to laugh at themselves as their Hoppe's Black Solve froze in the patch before they could get their ball started down the muzzle. I had a bottle of isopropyl alcohol in my range box to loan to the guys to clean their guns, and to " lube " their patches for the shoot. Together, we did a lot of experimenting on cold weather lubes.

 

[tjohnson56]

No, it should be a clean bore, the reason I was thinking about filler was to keep the powder as dry as I can. Keeping the lube away from the powder. And I have been wiping between shots, but from the way I shot yesterday off hand I'm thinking i'll have to work up a load off of a bench. I was kind of a spray hitter, but i'll get it tightened up.

Where I deer hunt for the most part is a half hour to an hour south of lake Superior, the winds off the lake can be bitter cold and it's in the lake effect snow belt. And yes as Paul was saying snow conditions can be pretty wild, from almost white out to quiet days with no wind where it still might dump 1 to 2 feet in an afternoon.

My sons first hunt up there when he turned 12 it was so cold ( -20 ) or colder even in the day time and it snowed so much that the snow was like little bits of styrofoam. When we pulled into the yard at the cabin it rolled right up on the hood of my f-150 truck. We got out and it was about shirt pocket deep on me ( I'm about 5-10 ) and up to his neck or chin, but you could walk right through it, it was easier walking than it is to walk in water that deep. The bad part was you had no idea what was under the snow to trip on. So the snow can be pretty wild anything from that to frozen so hard it will almost carry you weight to crunchy like walking on glass.

As for a second shot, this is really thick stuff, lots of spruce, cedar, swamps and tag alders. I'll have time to reload then check for blood or hair. If you have blood it's almost better not to track right away, almost like bow hunting. This for the most part is public land with very few hunters if any per sq. mile. So you have time to let them lay down with little chance of them being found by a hunter not in your crew.

 

[tjohnson56]

Paul any info on whats the best lube in really cold weather would be a big help.

Are you saying you just used alcohol for lube? That will not work on a hunt where it could be hours from the time you load till you shoot, will it? I would think it would dry out and you would have no lube.

 

[paulvallandigham]

I took a lesson from some Alaskan hunters, using modern guns, when hunting Bear, to wipe the entire action free of oils, and let them work " BARE!" I did that for years, figuring I was not going to take many shots on any hunt anyway. More recently, I have simply used Alcohol to clean the barrel when shooting at the range. I have some Teflon oil that seems to work at below freezing, but I have not had it out in that below 20 degree level of temperature. And, I also have Jojoba Oil, made from the bean of the Jojoba plant, which grows in the high deserts out west. It also seems to be as good a lube, as the old Sperm Whale Oil lubes that so many MLers hoarded when the ban went into effect. It also does not seem to congeal in cold temperatures.

So, Those are my recommendations: 1.Shoot the metal BARE; 2. Use alcohol to " lube the parts, knowing that it will evaporate, quickly; 3. Use a synthetic lube like Teflon oil; and 4. Use Jojoba Oil.

There is a synthetic oil made for Aircraft engines, which have to operate in HUGE TEMPERATURE extremes, down to - 60 degrees, and more, and still function, obviously. I am not sure where you can buy it, but there is a MOBILE ONE JET ENGINE OIL, and some shooters are cutting that 50/50 with WD40 to use to lube patches. I don't think, however, that they are shooting in those sub-zero temperatures, and I would NOT use WD40 to cut it. You might try cutting that Jet Engine Oil with the teflon OIL, or with Jojoba, or just thin it with alcohol, and give it a try. YOu can try these things by soaking a cleaning patch, and leaving them outdoors overnight in those cold temps. Here, about as cold as I can get is in the freezer compartment of my refrigerator, which barely gets down to zero degrees. We have mild temperatures, compared to Northern Wisconsin, or Minnesota. :hmm: :thumbsup:

 

[tjohnson56]

In another thread in shooting accessories Mink oil is called a great cold weather lube and thats easy to find around here. Who knows what will happen this season some years we barely have snow or it's wet and foggy.

Next time I go to the range I'll stick with the bore butter and Hoppe's #9 plus over corn meal filler and see if I like that. If I can see a difference maybe I'll work from there for a while.

I finally got some real black, 2f and 3f so I'm kinda starting from scratch, don't know what my .54's will like best. But thanks to all the replies at least I have some ideas.

From what I could tell yesterday at the range the iron sights, small bulls-eyes and my eyes the biggest problem might not be patch lube.

Thanks to all.