It was always my understanding that when using the boiling water method to clean that the boiling water was the final rinse. I use this method when I am going to put a gun up for an extended period of time. I keep pouring the boiling water down the barrel until the barrel gets so hot as to evaporate all moisture as soon as the water is dumped, kinda of a flash dry, then I apply the Nature Lube, Wonder Lube or whatever your favorite lube may be. :m2c: :redthumb:
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More Natural Lube 1000 = 40shots 2F with no wiping
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Huntinfool
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Also when you clean a longrifle that doesn't have a barrel made for easy removal it's not as easy to just swoosh it out in a bucket.
I never take my barrel out to clean it I have a rack to hold my guns in while cleaning them.
Chuck
I never take my barrel out to clean it I have a rack to hold my guns in while cleaning them.
Chuck
I'm not trying to "convert" anybody from anything...I just post what I do, answer posts about it when they come up etc...by all means you should do what you prefer to protect your barrels...do not want you ill with me if you have problems :: as there definitely seems to be something different going on with your results compared to mine...you may want to just go back to what works for you.
I bought a used TC barrel a few years ago and went through a number of cleaning / shooting / cleaning sessions over several weeks before it finally settled down and no longer oozed anything out. I'd get it looking so clean with a bore mirror it would blind you...2-3 days later, run a lubede patch down and up the bore and the patch would come out nasty...gradually got less and less over time until it no longer did that.
So if you no longer think it's rust, maybe it's just that simple...maybe it's just years of old bore treatments still being dissolved and leaching out onto the patches. And yes, the accuracy would still be fine during this process.
(PS: are you sure you're holding your mouth right while doing this?)
:redthumb:
Maybe the point everyone is missing it that it is important to get the barrel completely dry. After using the hot water, rinse water, patches, I also take an old hairdryer and hold it at the muzzle of r5 mins and blow hot air down the barrel.
After five minutes, I hold the dryer at the touch hole bushing hole (with it removed) and blow hot air into that hole for 5 minutes also.
After five minutes, I hold the dryer at the touch hole bushing hole (with it removed) and blow hot air into that hole for 5 minutes also.
I think that brown stuff on the patches is either a chemical reaction or the seasoning factor in the bore butter or wonderlube.
Back in the day all we used was crisco and I never had this brown stuff. The only times I've seen it was on the rifles I used Wonder Lube on. It's not rust. At least mine isn't. I know what rust looks like and this is a little different.
After seeing it a couple of times I checked a bore with a bore light, no rust.
And it doesn't seem to matter whether the rifle is cleaned with hot water or cold, the brown stuff is still there. And this shows up after the gun is clean.
Part of my process now includes WD 40 to help displace any remaining water, this also helps clean out the brown stuff prior to final oiling.
I like the Wonder lube and will continue using it, even if it leaves a little brown stuff on a patch.
Back in the day all we used was crisco and I never had this brown stuff. The only times I've seen it was on the rifles I used Wonder Lube on. It's not rust. At least mine isn't. I know what rust looks like and this is a little different.
After seeing it a couple of times I checked a bore with a bore light, no rust.
And it doesn't seem to matter whether the rifle is cleaned with hot water or cold, the brown stuff is still there. And this shows up after the gun is clean.
Part of my process now includes WD 40 to help displace any remaining water, this also helps clean out the brown stuff prior to final oiling.
I like the Wonder lube and will continue using it, even if it leaves a little brown stuff on a patch.
Actually this has been an interesting test with the barrel. I stopped using bore butter many years ago after the accuracy of a favorite hunting rifle just disappeared (and real quick too).
After a lot of head scratching as to the cause of this, I finally used strong solvent and bore brushes, and scrubbed all the old bore butter and goodness knows what else out of the barrel. Accuracy was back.
That was the last time I ever put bore butter down the barrel. This is the same rifle again, getting treatments described by a lot of bore butter users. I am waiting to see if the accuracy falls off. I think maybe the leaching of chemicals might be what I am seeing. I am not alarmed by it, just wondered.
I can not say I have noticed a difference in ease of loading or anything. Cleaning is easier because it is not so intense as with the solvents. But this is interesting.
After a lot of head scratching as to the cause of this, I finally used strong solvent and bore brushes, and scrubbed all the old bore butter and goodness knows what else out of the barrel. Accuracy was back.
That was the last time I ever put bore butter down the barrel. This is the same rifle again, getting treatments described by a lot of bore butter users. I am waiting to see if the accuracy falls off. I think maybe the leaching of chemicals might be what I am seeing. I am not alarmed by it, just wondered.
I can not say I have noticed a difference in ease of loading or anything. Cleaning is easier because it is not so intense as with the solvents. But this is interesting.
Tahquamenon
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Cayugad, really interesting what you reference regarding accuracy issues and bore butter for long term lubes.
I've detail cleaned more than several natural lubed ML's over the years that ceased to shoot well or ended up with rust.
In the natural lubed barrels that I've worked on, using a quality bore solvent, I would always remove a fair amount of brown residue. I would speculate that this is the "seasoning" which I would also characterize as more of a varnish over the bore's finish. After detail cleaning with a quality solvent by first using a brush for 20-30 strokes and then the same with solvent soaked patches, in every case accuracy improved.
Bore butter is excellent for a patch and conical shooting lube unless the ambient temperature is above 85-90 degrees. Then it's Rooster Labs lubes for me. I use the natural lubes for field.
However, I've never bought into the "seasoning" of the bore thing. My cast iron skillets and Dutch ovens, you bet but seasoned with a mix of olive oil, sausage grease and lard.
I don't use my ML's for cooking foods, so I find little value trying to "season" them. Plus I don't feel that the natural lubes displace moisture and penetrate the pores in the metal nearly as well as synthetic lubes.
I've been using synthetic lubes (Otis Ultra-Bore & Clenzoil) and bore solvent cleaners (Butch's bore shine) to keep my barrels squeaky clean and rust free for decades. I use the same lube's on all of my weapons (ML's & center fire rifles, shotguns and pistols).
For cleaning ML's, really hot soapy water, brush then pump flush, then really hot rinse/pump flush followed by dry patches and then alcohol patches to evaporate moisture. The barrel is too hot to hold without a glove at this point.
Then lube the interior parts of the barrel with Otis Ultra-Bore and the exterior with Clenzoil while the barrel is hot so that the pore's will absorb the lube.
I'll also toss another lubed patch down the bore after the barrel cools.
To go shooting, remove the interior synthetic lube with a couple of alcohol patches followed by a dry patch and an alcohol Q-Tip & pipe cleaner for the flash channel.
Then I'll run a natural lube patch followed by a dry patch to prevent flash rust.
:m2c: :imo:
I've detail cleaned more than several natural lubed ML's over the years that ceased to shoot well or ended up with rust.
In the natural lubed barrels that I've worked on, using a quality bore solvent, I would always remove a fair amount of brown residue. I would speculate that this is the "seasoning" which I would also characterize as more of a varnish over the bore's finish. After detail cleaning with a quality solvent by first using a brush for 20-30 strokes and then the same with solvent soaked patches, in every case accuracy improved.
Bore butter is excellent for a patch and conical shooting lube unless the ambient temperature is above 85-90 degrees. Then it's Rooster Labs lubes for me. I use the natural lubes for field.
However, I've never bought into the "seasoning" of the bore thing. My cast iron skillets and Dutch ovens, you bet but seasoned with a mix of olive oil, sausage grease and lard.
I don't use my ML's for cooking foods, so I find little value trying to "season" them. Plus I don't feel that the natural lubes displace moisture and penetrate the pores in the metal nearly as well as synthetic lubes.
I've been using synthetic lubes (Otis Ultra-Bore & Clenzoil) and bore solvent cleaners (Butch's bore shine) to keep my barrels squeaky clean and rust free for decades. I use the same lube's on all of my weapons (ML's & center fire rifles, shotguns and pistols).
For cleaning ML's, really hot soapy water, brush then pump flush, then really hot rinse/pump flush followed by dry patches and then alcohol patches to evaporate moisture. The barrel is too hot to hold without a glove at this point.
Then lube the interior parts of the barrel with Otis Ultra-Bore and the exterior with Clenzoil while the barrel is hot so that the pore's will absorb the lube.
I'll also toss another lubed patch down the bore after the barrel cools.
To go shooting, remove the interior synthetic lube with a couple of alcohol patches followed by a dry patch and an alcohol Q-Tip & pipe cleaner for the flash channel.
Then I'll run a natural lube patch followed by a dry patch to prevent flash rust.
:m2c: :imo:
Johnny Tremain
Silversmith in training
This is the ONLY lube and cleaner I use. Ive used to for as long as I can remember.
After you hot water and soap every bit of oil and residue out of your barrel. you season it, and forget about it.
We have shot my 54 for over 100 shots per a two day shoot, and the last ball went in as easy as the first.
The last few years I shot at rondy I only soap and water clean my rifle barrel ONCE a year, at the end of the season.
After each event Id use their cleaner until the patches were clean. Then coat the barrel and parts with the lube. Next timeout, Id run a wet patch thru before I started shooting.
At the end of each days shooting Id clean the lock, and touch hole, run a few patches of cleaner though the barrel, then go at it the next day.
Rain, shine, wind, snow. Never ONE problem. My new Rice barrel will never see oil or any kind 1k lube and cleaner all the way form the time the barrel hits my front door.
40 shots aint squat. Next time go for 400!
After you hot water and soap every bit of oil and residue out of your barrel. you season it, and forget about it.
We have shot my 54 for over 100 shots per a two day shoot, and the last ball went in as easy as the first.
The last few years I shot at rondy I only soap and water clean my rifle barrel ONCE a year, at the end of the season.
After each event Id use their cleaner until the patches were clean. Then coat the barrel and parts with the lube. Next timeout, Id run a wet patch thru before I started shooting.
At the end of each days shooting Id clean the lock, and touch hole, run a few patches of cleaner though the barrel, then go at it the next day.
Rain, shine, wind, snow. Never ONE problem. My new Rice barrel will never see oil or any kind 1k lube and cleaner all the way form the time the barrel hits my front door.
40 shots aint squat. Next time go for 400!
You're preachin to the choir right up to the point about the seasoning and forgetting about it...I'm just a blue collar guy tryin to make ends meet so I take comfort in the peace of mind I have after I thoroughly clean and lube a rifle before putting it up...never been a big fan of the seasoning idea so I'll probably stick with my regimen, but if that works for you without any problems, I think that's great...maybe when I win the lottery I'll take that risk and experiment with a barrel, but right now, I have love affairs with all of them, like to put them to bed squeaky clean & freshly lubed
::
I'm with Roundball on this.
I season my cast iron pans, but I haven't found a suitable way to get my barrel up to 475
I season my cast iron pans, but I haven't found a suitable way to get my barrel up to 475
Tahquamenon
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:hmm:
Perhaps if I started "seasoning" all of my ML barrels I could get rid of my cast iron pans and such?
It might be tough to get the sausage and and eggs out of a seasoned barrel when they are done cooking?
Maybe just load a cap, take aim, shoot them onto the plate and enjoy!
::
Perhaps if I started "seasoning" all of my ML barrels I could get rid of my cast iron pans and such?
It might be tough to get the sausage and and eggs out of a seasoned barrel when they are done cooking?
Maybe just load a cap, take aim, shoot them onto the plate and enjoy!
::
Johnny Tremain
Silversmith in training
Let me clarify "seasoning"
I meant to rid your barrel of the demon petrolium base oils and use only 1000+ from that point on.
I meant to rid your barrel of the demon petrolium base oils and use only 1000+ from that point on.
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