Muzzle Cap.........

[anchorsawy]

I'm looking for anybody's input on going "sans" muzzle cap on and Early Lancaster Pecatonica River build. I like the look of a wood muzzle end with a swamped barrel but am concerned about durability. I intend to use this gun a lot. Plus the muzzle cap supplied doesn't fit my "C" weight Rice barrel and I would have to purchase another one anyway. Also, is it even close to being historically correct?

 

Make one out of sheet brass. The cast caps are not HC for a Lancaster rifle. Lancasters had brass nose caps on them. Sometimes the cap had a rod groove and some didn't. I use 18 or 20 ga. brass and wrap it around a hard wood form that you can also make. Solder the end peice on and file to fit. I think you'll be glad you put one on in the long run. Use a copper rivet to attach the cap to the stock. They are easier to make than one would think.

 

[paulvallandigham]

If you are going to make this a true copy of the Lancaster School, make the cap from sheet brass. However, if that is not that important to you, I saw a southern rifle made many years ago where the maker used a piece of antler to make an end cap. Probably was Elk, considering the width.

 

[Goldhunter]

That would be interesting. Especially if you could still see some of the rough lines of the antler (the color difference between the white underneath and the darker outside. Did that even make sense? no coffee yet) :grin:

I've seen antler used for toe plates before, but never a muzzle cap.

 

[paulvallandigham]

This gun was made with a end cap made of antler, and the sides of the end cap actually flared out a bit. It was not belled out through the entire arc, but looked more like an oval, or football shaped end cap when viewed from the muzzle. Yes, he left enough of the texture of the antler for you to recognize what it was. This one I saw was in the white. You can stain or color them, too. It added a little weight to the muzzle of the gun, in the oval configuration, added a kind of racy look to the muzzle of the gun, although nothing like the Weatherby end caps with the severe tapered joining, and made it easy to feel your hand getting to the muzzle of the barrel when you dropped the gun to the grown for a fast reload. I was impressed, and considered trying to use the ide in a gun, until I worked with antler to make some knife handles. I don't know if I have the patience to make an end cap out of the stuff! The smell will drive me out of the shop, too.

 

[Richard Hare.]

Hi Moose.
As far as durability goes, I made a Virginia style probably 8 or 9 years ago, maybe longer, and didn't add a muzzle cap, Never been any trouble at all. (It's a .58 cal and I've hunted with nothing else for most of that time as well as used at shoots)
Also British fowling pieces were usually made with no muzzle cap, and no problem, so your only concern appears to be what is correct for Lancaster.
Have made a few chevron poured pewter muzzle caps, but these appear more on southern guns also.

I'm sure guns made in Lancaster would be made to all price ranges, and lots of folk could only afford a good plain rifle, and not a high art piece, so go with whatever you want, is my way of thinking!

 

[anchorsawy]

Thank you all. I still have some time before I get to that point so I haven't decided yet. I've also debated about one with a ramrod groove or a lower profile without the groove. The lower one will require a pretty thin piece of wood under it and that worries me some. I'm also wondering where to get small brass nails or brads to attach it and inlays with. Any suggestions on that?

 

For the nose cap attachment I use copper rivets and turn them down in a drill press using a file. For inlays use brass or silver wire for the pins. As you drive them in they mushroom on the head end and fit right down into the chamfered hole. The wire can be purchased at Rio Grande or Thunderbird supply. Both are jewelry supply houses and you can also buy your sheet brass and silver from them too.

 

[Vaino]

I would think that on an early Lancaster style LR the web between the bbl and RR groove should be less than 3/16" and therefore very fragile. The MC that came w/ the kit is too small or too big for the barrel? If too large somtimes the cast MC can be squeezed in the vise {just did that on the present build} or if too small, it can be filed to fit. Making A MC is a fairly easy job and would give you exactly what you want. A MC w/o the RR groove is a little easier to make and probably more PC. The MC should be attached w/ a peened copper rivet, either a purchased harness rivet or a piece of copper wire....Fred

 

[Zonie]

I read somewhere that the muzzlecaps with an integral ramrod groove was not used until the mid 1800s.

As you say it's a early Lancaster, I don't think it is a style that would be appropriate.

If your cap is a brass casting and it is undersize, place it in the swamped region of the barrel and drive it towards the muzzle with a hammer. By the time it slips off the end of the barrel, it will fit just right.
If it is oversize, locate it slightly aft of where it should be on the barrel. Place a wooden block on one side of the nosecap to support it. Place another block on the opposite side and give it a good stout whack with a 2 pound hammer.
Now, it will fit the barrel.

If it is a sheet metal cap, their cheap. Measure the barrel across the flats where the cap will be and buy a cap for that size barrel.

Just my 1 1/2 cents worth.
Zonie

 

Hold up a minute fellas, the nuzzle caps with a rod groove date back before the caps without the groove on Lancasters and related rifles. Christian Springs rifles almost always had rod grooves in the muzzle caps and so did the early Dickerts that exist. Look at the Lancaster rifles details in RCA Vol. I for evidence of what I am talking about. The caps with the rod groove would also make the fore nd stronger because your taking off less wood to inlet them. You may want to reconsider your opinions on this head. Check out the Christian springs rifles and the Lancaster rifles in that book.

 

[Zonie]

Cooner54: Yuup, some of those old Christian Springs and Dickerts do have a ramrod groove, of sorts.
I say of sorts because the grooves in the photos of these very old guns really isn't that pronounced. It looks to me like it was just trying to get out of the way of the ramrod rather than trying to guide the ramrod into a thick forestock.

When I made my comment about ramrod grooved caps, I was thinking of the ones with a very pronounced groove, as was used on the Hawken and similar later rifles.
I was also thinking of a comment made by Don Eads in his catalog:
"Grooved nosecaps are not for early style rifles. They are appropriate on very late percussion era full stock rifles..."
(This is carried forward by Susie in her MBS Catalog.)
Dixie Gunworks makes similar comments about the deeply grooved caps which do not have a gentle change of direction like the very old caps shown in RCA.

I was also thinking of my first Flintlock Rifle which was made in Italy. It's nosecap was deeply grooved and slab sided and was anything but the graceful style I've come to associate with Pennsylvania rifles.

 

I'll give the catalogs a little bit of room for stating it like it is but catalogs are hardly good research material. The difference in the early grooved caps and the later grooved caps is the early ones were formed out of one peice of brass and the face was folded over and the later ones were usually but not always formed from two peices with the face soldered on. That may be why the earlier rod groove caps are shallower in the rod trough. For a "early" Lancaster I would recommend the early one peice formed nose cap with the rod groove. No soldered on face, those were much later for "golden age" Lancasters.

 

Moose,

When you get to that point and if you consider the formed cap, go on over to the American Longrifles site and look at the tutorials section on their bulletin board. There's a really great posting on this with photos. Its not as bad as it sounds, and it's one of those really nice little details that you can make yourself. One of those little steps from gun assembler to gunsmith.

Sean

 

I appologize if I overstepped my bounds by mentioning another site with the post above. I did not intend to offend or route someone away from this one. There's a lot of great info on here.

Sean

 

[anchorsawy]

No problem Sean. I can use all the help I can get and yours is appreciated.

 

Hey Moose, how far are you from Claremore? Have you been to the J.M. Davis Gun Museum? It would be worth the trip, guaranteed! :thumbsup:

 

[anchorsawy]

Cooner. As a matter of fact I live in Owasso and have been to the Davis Museum a couple of times and am going to run over there again soon. I'm thinking about taking a camera and see if they will allow pictures to be taken. It is a great resource to have so close.

 

Yep, everytime I go home to see the folks I have to spend a day in the Davis Museum. They live about a mile from the museum. What a neat collection.