Muzzleloading accuracy

[Dithsoer]

I just getting into muzzleloading and something that I was wondering is, how accurate can I expect a good quality long arm to be? I'm talking percussion-lock, small to medium caliber rifle. I used to target shoot cartridge guns competitively so accuracy is very important to me. I would like to eventually get into target competition with black powder guns. What styles of muzzleloader are considered the most accurate?

 

[paulvallandigham]

Wow, what a series of questions. Underhammers are considered the most accurate form of target rifle, for many subtle reasons. As for accuracy, you can expect the gun to shoot was well as you can aim iron sights, within the range limitations of the ball, or bullet. For open sights, that is generally 2.5-4 inches at 100 yards. With aperature, or peep, sights, that is 1-3 inches, for a 5 shot group at 100 yards. With a scope you can put 5 shots in one hole on good days.

Chunk gun shooters are among the most demanding of BP rifle shooters, because they shoot one shot each at 10 targets, and the winner is the guy who shoots the shortest string. The range of the matches is traditionally 60 yards. This year's Sgt. York Memorial Chunk Gun Match winner had a string of about 3.3 inches for the 10 shots. That would mean his average shot was no more than .33" from the center of his target.

Depending on the ranges being fired, target shooters like the .40, and .45 caliber rifles, because they are a good compromise between recoil and velocity, weight of ball and wind drift problems. If you stick strictly to conicals, then a .40 caliber rifle with a fast twist designed to shoot conicals will give you extraordinary accuracy out to 100 yards and a bit beyond, provided that you don't have too strong a cross wind.

My recommendation to you is to buy a " first rifle " in percussion, .45 caliber, and whatever style appeals to you. There are Hawken, or " mountain style " rifles out there at reasonable prices. The barrel lengths are about 32 inches, which makes for good off-hand shooting. Stick with the barrels that have a 1:48 ROT for rifling, and shoot round balls with patches. They are cheap, and until you get accustomed to shooting black powder, and climb the learning curve more, this will be a good rifle to get you started, and will retain its resale value if you decide to sell it for something different.

Find a local BP club and attend the matches, and look over the guns. Talk to the shooters during breaks. Accept their invitations to shoot the rifles. Watch what they do to clean and load the guns. Ask Questions like a 3rd grader. Don't be embarrassed to ask " stupid questions ". The only really stupid question is the one NOT asked! You might find someone at such a club who has a good used rifle to sell, and will make you a good deal, saving you more money. Better, he will be able to tell what load the gun likes, and save you lots of time and money getting the gun to shoot. If something doesn't work right, you have someone who is intimately familiar with the rifle to call for help.

Welcome to the forums, and best wishes on your journey of discovery. Enjoy! :grin: :thumbsup:

 

[deanscamaro]

Paul, I have to second a piece of your recommendation. Being a newbie, I went out to a local range where the club was having a state shoot and got to know some of the guys attending. As I stood there watching, two of them would call me over to show me something they were doing. ML'ers are in most cases a friendly bunch and are very willing to share knowledge. I learned more in those two days of attending that shoot than I ever thought I would. You see those practices being used and in a lot of cases the results of those practices.
:wink:

 

[Swampman]

If you could find a nice used Thompson Center Hawken and install a .50 caliber Green Mountain barrel on it, I think you'd be able to shoot with the best of them. It's a really good way to get started without spending a ton of money.

 

[Rancocas]

I just getting into muzzleloading and something that I was wondering is, how accurate can I expect a good quality long arm to be? I'm talking percussion-lock, small to medium caliber rifle. I used to target shoot cartridge guns competitively so accuracy is very important to me. I would like to eventually get into target competition with black powder guns. What styles of muzzleloader are considered the most accurate?

Within their inherent limitations, muzzleloaders can be just as accurate as a modern cartridge gun.
As Paul mentioned, "chunkguns" are very accurate and are most often used in 60 yard matches. .45 chunkguns are still popular, but lately the trend seems to be going to larger calibers such as the .50 or .54 in order to get a heavier roundball to buck the wind better.
There are also "bench" target muzzleloaders, and the Whitworth rifles, and others, were once commonly used for 1000 yard matches.
Just as with cartridge guns, you must be particular concerning bullet weight, powder charge, and all other components in order to get the best accuracy.
You mentioned "small to medium caliber", but keep in mind that what is small to medium in a muzzleloader is not the same as small to medium in a modern caliber. .32 and .36 and possibly even .40 muzzleloaders are small and are probably used mostly just for small game hunting, although you occassionally see a .40 in competition shooting. I would call the .45 and .50 a "medium", and the .54 and up as big bores. But, that's just my opinion.

 

[MikeChapin]

I would echo most of what Paul said. The only thing I would differ with him on is the twist of the rifle. If you plan on shooting a .40 or less a 1:48 twist is fine. If you plan on shooting a larger caliber, you would probably do better with a longer twist. The 1:48 twist in larger calibers shoots very well and can be very accurate. It is more picky as to what is the most accurate load. A slower twist is more forgiving as to load.

You also should check the rules of your local area. Many places require a sidelock and open iron sights for competition. In Wyoming underhammers and mule ear locks are illegal except for bench competion.

Most competion out here is offhand whether paper punching or primative shooting. Almost all rifles will shoot better than the shooter. The most accurate rifle is one that you can shoot all day without being beaten to death with recoil.

My choice would be a longer barreled rifle from .45 to .54 caliber with a pull that fits you. The longer barrel is for better sight radius. Mild target loads in the calibers above will not beat you to death towards the end of the day.

 

[bob308]

alot of what has been said here is good advice, some not so good. a m-l rifle will shoot with cf rifles it just takes longer between shots.

if you are thinking about bench guns i would read walter m. cline's the muzzle-loading rifle then and now.

my first m-l rifle was a layman great plains in .50 got it at a yard sale. then a friend got me into matches. a year later i got a hoyt .40 barrel for the layman. now that barrel is a real shooter. i was knocking down boweling pins at 100yds. off hand with it.

my next rifle is a h and a under hammer in .45. i feel the underhammer gives up nothing to the inlines and in some cases it is faster.

twist rates for round ball should be:

.40 or less 1-48

.45 1-52

.50 and up 1-66

 

[roundball]

And I think the ideal RB twist rates stretch out even a little more with larger calibers...ie: 58cal 1:70", .62cal 1:72", etc.

 

[jtmattison]

If you could find a nice used Thompson Center Hawken and install a .50 caliber Green Mountain barrel on it, I think you'd be able to shoot with the best of them. It's a really good way to get started without spending a ton of money.

I agree. I picked up a used complete stock w/lock on Ebay, refinished it, and put a .54 Green Mountain 1:70 twist barrel on it. It's not shot in yet but it will shoot single hole groups at 50 yards off the bench. I have a Lyman peep sight on it.

HD

 

[Dithsoer]

I'm not really new to black powder shooting per se as I have been shooting percussion revolvers for about 15 years, but I am a complete neophyte when it comes to long arms. They just seem so much more complicated, like they are from two different worlds. There are just so many more variables in rifle shooting, or maybe the variables are the same but they're just more significant. I've read that for best (long range) accuracy, I should have a faster-twist barrel shooting conicals. Several of the target-style guns that I have checked out have hooked breeches yet I've been told that hooked breeches, because of their inherit design, aren't as accurate as the solid type. I really liked the looks of the Rigby style target rifle that a few places have for sale but it comes with a hooked breech. Can I really expect such a setup to be less accurate than a solid breech?
Thanks for all of the advice. I think I'll check out some local competitions and see what I turn up. I live in Michigan where b.p. shooting is taken as religion by many people. This area was settled by flint and percussion users. Colt and Winchester may have won the West but it was the flintlock that help settle this area.

 

[paulvallandigham]

Some shooters epoxy together the tang and barrel of those hooked breech rifles, to get the maximum accuracy out of them, but we are talking about guns used to shoot at long range targets- 600 to 1,000 yards! Are you going to notice a difference in accuracy shooting off-hand? NO, I doubt it. Will the difference in accuracy of a hooked breech rifle make a difference for hunting? NO, since most hunting is done with game shot at well under 100 yards.

It is really going to come down to exactly what type of rifle shooting you want to get into. If you decided to become a benchrest shooter, shooting small groups at longer and longer ranges, then you will end up buying or making a rifle to do those things. If you are mainly a hunter, but want to enter local matches for fun, You don't need the level of accuracy those big bench guns are designed to deliver. :thumbsup: