My Renegade flinter needs help

[Muddly]

There's a gap between the barrel and pan. Not terrible, but bad enough. As a quick fix I cut a piece of manilla folder to fit and slathered it up with bore butter. Lasts about 5 shots.
I'm thinking of shaping a piece of steel to fit the plate and attaching it with JB Weld. But is there a better way?
I'd rather not deepen the in letting as the stock finish is near 100% and I don't want the wood proud around the plate.
Also. The touch hole is poorly positioned. Currently its about 3/32nds off the bottom of the pan and left of center. Would it be practical to permanently plug the original and re d&t for a proper placement?
I'll most likely be having this barrel rebored or lined next year as the current bore is riddled with tight and loose spots so it might be better to have it rebreached at that time.
Thoughts appreciated.

 

[FatBack]

Brazing?

 

[Muddly]

I think that amount of heat would warp the plate. If not done with extreme care

 

[FatBack]

I'm the proud new owner of a CVA .50 Hawken with a stuck ball and a terrible bore.

Sounds like we might come out ahead to hang them over the mantle and invest in a new gun. When I soaked the bore with PB blaster and dumped it out, looked like straight rust water.

I guess what i mean to say is, weigh the cost of refurbishing VS a new gun. If it's worth salvaging, go for it.

 

[Muddly]

More than worth it. This is the first rock lock I shoot well. Not trying to reinvent the wheel. Just trying to make it a little rounder.

 

[bubba.50]

Why not just use a thin layer of JB Weld? Put it on slightly thicker than you need then sand/file ‘til you get the fit you want.

 

[SDSmlf]

I'd rather not deepen the in letting as the stock finish is near 100% and I don't want the wood proud around the plate.

You presented a number of opportunities for improvement. Let’s discuss the pan to barrel fit. This something you should correct, as a loose fit will allow powder and fouling to get to the back side of the lock. Not wanting ‘wood proud around around the plate’ is cosmetic and not, in my opinion, a big issue with this gun. And if a ‘a piece of manilla folder’ (maybe.010” thick) is enough to fill the gap, doubt you would notice the lock plate being that little bit deeper into the stock.

Do you know what is holding the lock away from the barrel? If you disassemble the lock does the lock plate itself (with the other components removed from it) still sit away from the barrel? If so, would suggest applying some inletting black, Prussian blue, or even chalk to the back of the lock plate to see where you would have to remove some wood.

If the lock plate by itself sits tight and flush to the barrel, you know one or more of the components on the lock are interfering with wood. Then just a process of elimination to identify where the wood needs relieved.

 

[Muddly]

Thanks all.
Bubba .50, I don't know how JB Weld would hold up by itself. Interesting thought though.
SD
Its a matter of inletting holding it out. The barrel channel is, rather generously inletted, so I will glass bed it and the gang before any work on the lock issue. Fully stabilizing the barrel can't hurt.
I was looking at the stock today, and there is some really subtle, really nice grain under the factory finish.
I do love the smell of linseed oil...
Decisions decisions...

 

[Sidney Smith]

You're attacking the mountain before you climb the mole hill. Do as above and put some inletting black on the back of the lock and reinsert it into the mortice. Remove then see exactly how much wood needs to be relieved. I'll bet it isn't much at all, and most likely will be underneath the lock in a spot that won't even be seen.

5 minutes work now will save you a lot of aggravation later.

It could also be something as simple as tightening the lock screw a tad more. Sometimes you think you have the lock fully seated when in reality it's not, especially in a tight mortice.

 

[Zonie]

A piece of Manila folder is only about .010" thick.
I'm betting the coating the factory put on the stock when they finished it is about that thick and usually, they do this finishing without the lock installed.
That results in about that much finish ending up on the small, flat surfaces that control the depth of the lock when it is installed.

Remove the lock and look for all of the surfaces that control the depth. Usually, there is one large one under the front of the lock along with several smaller areas like right behind the area where the cutout is made to allow the lock to contact the side of the barrel. There is usually also a narrow ledge at the bottom of the lock and at the rear of the lock.

Use a sharp scraper and scrape off all of the finish on these surfaces and try your lock again. I'm betting that just removing the finish will solve the problem. If it doesn't, some additional scraping on those surfaces can be done to remove just a little bit of the wood.

In any case, the slightly deeper installed lock will not be far enough below the adjacent surface on the lock panel to notice, even if you run your finger across the joint around the lock.

 

[Kansas Jake]

On the touch hole misalignment, if you are getting reliable ignition I would not mess with it. Trying to fix it is possible, but fraught with many opportunities to create worse issues.

 

[oscarlovel]

I know this may sound silly, but are you sure you have a Renegade barrel, and not a TC Hawkin barrel? The Renegade has a 1" barrel, and the Hawkin has a 15/16" barrel. You say the barrel inletting is generous and the touchole alignment is off. I'm thinking you may have a Renegade stock that someone put a Hawkin barrel into, maybe to convert it to flint. I'd measure the barrel width and at least eliminate that possibility.

 

[bubba.50]

I know this may sound silly, but are you sure you have a Renegade barrel, and not a TC Hawkin barrel? The Renegade has a 1" barrel, and the Hawkin has a 15/16" barrel. You say the barrel inletting is generous and the touchole alignment is off. I'm thinking you may have a Renegade stock that someone put a Hawkin barrel into, maybe to convert it to flint. I'd measure the barrel width and at least eliminate that possibility.

The 15/16ths Hawken barrel in a 1 inch Renegade stock would cause a whole ‘nother set of problems.

For the touchhole bein’ too low, a bit of bedding compound in the tang inlet to raise it a bit may help.

 

[45man]

I have built up the lock to get rid of the gap with shim stock soldered on. Store bought guns since I fit mine tight. You can fix it but forget paper or grease and plastics. Use metal even brass.

 

[Muddly]

She's an inch barrel. Just generous inletting. I believe she's an earlier production. Barrel isn't marked Renegade, no warning and serial number 7489x.
I'm grateful for all the tips. I might just deepen the lock ( if necessary) to correct the gap.
I had my best flintlock day to date today. I went to .010 patches and at 50 yards my smallest group was 1 5/16ths and the largest 1 5/8ths.
I'm feeling much better about December now. We still need to work on things, but this is a great start!

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Shim? Copper? Brass?
SM

 

[Pete G]

I would set the lock in a little deeper.

 

[Muddly]

Most likely will. Sometimes the simplest fixes are best.
On a side note. The factory stock finish is filling up some very nice, but very subtle grain. I love linseed oil, but I wonder, is there a better finish to bring out he grain?
The stock appears to be rather close grained with a vet nice reddish tinge to it. The nice stuff is a little flame grain and some fiddleback. The light has to hit it right to see it. I'd love to bring it out.

 

[Britsmoothy]

The 15/16ths Hawken barrel in a 1 inch Renegade stock would cause a whole ‘nother set of problems.

For the touchhole bein’ too low, a bit of bedding compound in the tang inlet to raise it a bit may help.

Just bedding under the tang can cause accuracy issues. I don't recommend this.
The whole barrel needs to be jointed to the whole stock, compound, shims or just sitting there properly fitted.

 

[Eric Krewson]

I bought 3 TC flintlocks, all had a misplaced touch holes. One was in the lower back corner of the pan, I sent this one back to TC and they said they couldn't see anything wrong with it.

I put another Renegade together with random parts that had a terrible touch hole alignment. I move the barrel back and down on this one to get everything where it was supposed to be.