My Zoli Zouave is very sick

[rdlowe]

Bobby Hoyt's recommended twist for a mini is 1 in 60" and the original Zouaves, .58 Mississipies and '61 and later Springfields were even slower than that.

Did those original rifles have progressive depth rifling?

 

[bang]

As stated try a PRB at 25-30 yards. See just how it shoots. Figure just what front sight change is needed. You can make a new front sight that fits but is offset to straighten aim.
Before you start filing on rear sight try different colors of tape and see if you can find one that satisfies contrast. May not need it to be solid but maybe just a line down center so you can better judge the front sight.
I use a sniper sight on mine. Lot easier for my eyesight. Won't mount straight if your front sight is off center but if you make a new one the base above the groove can be shaped to center then the sniper sight would line up properly.

 

[hawkeye2]

Did those original rifles have progressive depth rifling?

The Springfields did, I'm not sure about the Zouave and Mississippi.

 

[rdlowe]

I appreciate the good ideas I’ve been given here. Putting tape on the rear sight is worth trying and not permanent in any way. The front has definitely got to go. I mean if you could look down the top of the barrel from the tang you’d see what I mean. It’s probably about 1/8” off to the right. The gun predictably hits left, and the further the target the further left the gun hits. It’s about a foot high and left at 100 to the center of the “pumpkin”. I’m going to fire some groups with prb at 30 yards from a bench in a couple of days. I’ll report back and take some pics of the muzzle end while I’m at it.

 

[bang]

I appreciate the good ideas I’ve been given here. Putting tape on the rear sight is worth trying and not permanent in any way. The front has definitely got to go. I mean if you could look down the top of the barrel from the tang you’d see what I mean. It’s probably about 1/8” off to the right. The gun predictably hits left, and the further the target the further left the gun hits. It’s about a foot high and left at 100 to the center of the “pumpkin”. I’m going to fire some groups with prb at 30 yards from a bench in a couple of days. I’ll report back and take some pics of the muzzle end while I’m at it.

If you make new front sight make it at least 4x height of original then trim it to POI of range choice.

 

[TNGhost]

I'll have to second the JB weld option. It is a great way to "form" new sights on the gun and experiment in a non permanent and easy to change fashion. It is often used by competition shooters.

As far as the Zoli Zuoave, I have one as well and read some info that they were sensitive to diameter on the Minies, many of them liking larger diameter projectiles. I went from Lee molds .575-500 M and 575-474M (target Minie) to a .578-478M and my groups got smaller.

You also have to consider in load development, getting a load stout enough to bump the skirt out to engage the rifling properly, but not overly so to "blow" it out or damage it as it leaves the barrel. Skirt thickness, powder charge and bullet alloy all play a role here.

I'll look and see if I can find the article I read that led me to the larger diameter projectiles to post it up. It was really good and in depth

 

[Tasbay]

Another thing to look at: is the muzzle/barrel square. Mine was cut off at an angle and needed squaring up though that didn`t help with the point of aim. Going from your above notes my one was similar in Point of aim, about a foot high at 50yds and off to the left about 8-10 inches. Nothing that can`t be fixed if it groups well.

 

[Snooterpup]

If I remember right, the Zoli Zouave is only held into the stock with the tang screw and barrel bands. If BOTH sights are off in the same direction, it could possibly have been un-breached at some time and never tightened properly. Check the witness mark on the barrel bottom and the tang. They should line up. If not, the breech plug will need to be tightened and the witness marks aligned.

 

[rdlowe]

If I remember right, the Zoli Zouave is only held into the stock with the tang screw and barrel bands. If BOTH sights are off in the same direction, it could possibly have been un-breached at some time and never tightened properly. Check the witness mark on the barrel bottom and the tang. They should line up. If not, the breech plug will need to be tightened and the witness marks aligned.

Your memory is correct. The witness marks on mine line up. The rear sight is centered in line with the tang. It’s just the front that’s canted.

 

[BJm]

My Zouave shoots a 630g 4 canalure mini with 38grain 2F at 50 yards & 42grain 2F at 100 yards. It has standard sights as issued & 50 yd offhand scores high 80's / low 90's (10 shots ). Lap the bore within 1'' from the muzzle & size the mould to match the bore. When loading line the join line of the mini with the front sight & that consistantly eliminates any inconsistancies of the mini. My barrel measures out at .5825. None of the barrels seem to be the same. .58 is just the nominal size & have seen them measure out as low as .575 . Equal mix of bee's wax,lard & alox for all year round lube.

 

[Treestalker]

BJm, I like your lube mix, but where do you live? Here in Arkansas it can get hot and cause lube to run. Are you farther north? Thanks Geo.

 

[Gun Tramp]

How about some pics? Getting close to a thousand words...

 

[Woodwright]

I was never able to get my Zouave to group until I joined the North South Skirmish Association and they told me to buy a swage and swage each bullet to a uniform diameter. That worked and I was shooting very tight groups after that.

 

[stevenjay1]

Ok, here is my .02 and I’ll make it simple. You need to do load development first. It doesn’t matter where on the target the group is, so long as it is a group. Load development is necessary to consistent accuracy. Some people find it a task and a royal P.I.T.A. and others enjoy the process. Once you find the load, bullet etc that is acceptable then you can work on you sights. There are some great suggestions so far on temporary sight fixes if you need to do that first. Using jb weld To fill in the rear sight and then file a smaller notch will take care of the rear sight. For a temporary front sight go to the British snider forum and look at the temporary front sights that people have come up with. Some are very interesting, they work. But again, in my opinion, the first step is load development.

 

[stevenjay1]

Here is the snider sight.
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/britishmilitariaforums/snider-alternate-sighting-systems-t800.html

 

[Snooterpup]

I'll have to second the JB weld option. It is a great way to "form" new sights on the gun and experiment in a non permanent and easy to change fashion. It is often used by competition shooters.

As far as the Zoli Zuoave, I have one as well and read some info that they were sensitive to diameter on the Minies, many of them liking larger diameter projectiles. I went from Lee molds .575-500 M and 575-474M (target Minie) to a .578-478M and my groups got smaller.

You also have to consider in load development, getting a load stout enough to bump the skirt out to engage the rifling properly, but not overly so to "blow" it out or damage it as it leaves the barrel. Skirt thickness, powder charge and bullet alloy all play a role here.

I'll look and see if I can find the article I read that led me to the larger diameter projectiles to post it up. It was really good and in depth

TN ghost is right! My brother had a Zouave that would not group well at all. He was fortunate to find as utter at the 18th century trade fair at Fort Frederick that had many different size for sale. He explained to my brother that the correct size should drop quite slowly down a clean barrel when held vertically. The Minnesota would be unlabeled for this test. The Minnesota should displace the air on its trip down and go down like an elevator as opposed to dropping fast. He ended up selecting on .002 larger and sail his groups went from poor to extremely accurate.

 

[Snooterpup]

TN ghost is right! My brother had a Zouave that would not group well at all. He was fortunate to find as utter at the 18th century trade fair at Fort Frederick that had many different size for sale. He explained to my brother that the correct size should drop quite slowly down a clean barrel when held vertically. The Minnesota would be unlabeled for this test. The Minnesota should displace the air on its trip down and go down like an elevator as opposed to dropping fast. He ended up selecting on .002 larger and sail his groups went from poor to extremely accurate.

Dang spell check! Should have been suttler in the above.

 

[rdlowe]

Dang spell check! Should have been suttler in the above.

I figured Minnesota meant minié too

 

[rdlowe]

How about some pics? Getting close to a thousand words...

The third pic is blurry looking, but if you zoom the front sight is in focus.

 

[bang]

Front sight looks more bent.