Mystery flintlock - need some advice.

[Beaver Trapper]

When you look at the barrel/tang junction the join looks like doesn't quite match up The barrel is high on the left side and low on the right , The lock has never been cleaned up and polished inside or out , , it is still showing casting marks on the frizzen , which makes me wonder if the frizzen has been hardened properly . I'd say this definitely is a kit gun which has been put together by someone who did little or no work in it , The lack of work on the lock could be the cause of a poor spark . I doubt if the hammer has been replaced , it matches the rest of the lock in it's lack of finish and detailing

Some additional pics

 

[Cattywompuss]

Strange gun...

 

[Beaver Trapper]

If you don't mind, more pics? Of the whole gun. These few pics just touch the ears of the elephant as it were.

 

[Rawhide67]

I'd make it work especially if the price was right. But I like to tinker with things to get them going. It may take a little bit, but may be a decent shooter if you can get it going.

 

[Eddie Southgate]

Don't see anything that makes me think the hammer has been changed . Take that piece of driveway gravel out of the jaws , close the frizzen , lower the hammer. Take and post a picture .

 

[excess650]

Pedersoli Frontier Rifle
https://www.davide-pedersoli.com/en/product/frontier-rifle-flintlock-model

 

[DuncNZ]

Pedersoli Frontier Rifle
https://www.davide-pedersoli.com/en/product/frontier-rifle-flintlock-model

Close , except the lock, triggers and sights are completely different .

 

[Beaver Trapper]

Don't see anything that makes me think the hammer has been changed . Take that piece of driveway gravel out of the jaws , close the frizzen , lower the hammer. Take and post a picture .

 

[Beaver Trapper]

Close , except the lock, triggers and sights are completely different .

I contacted Pedersoli - its not one of theirs

 

[Beaver Trapper]

I'd make it work especially if the price was right. But I like to tinker with things to get them going. It may take a little bit, but may be a decent shooter if you can get it going.

The price was VERY right. I got the whole thing for less than the cost of the barrel.

 

[Notchy Bob]

I’m sorry I can’t identify your rifle. I was thinking Pedersoli, but that has been ruled out.

Respectfully, the “hammer” on a flintlock is what we now usually call the frizzen. Some of us still use the term “hammerstall” in reference to the leather frizzen covers that are required equipment at many events, so the old-time terminology survives to a limited extent. The device that holds the flint is the “****.” As far as I know, it has always been called that.

I would agree that the jaws of the **** don’t line up properly with the frizzen. You’ll want to make sure the inside corner of your flint doesn’t hit the side of your barrel as the **** falls.

I would be careful actually shooting that rifle. If the builder was that careless in setting up the lock, which is obvious, there’s no telling what else might be an issue. A barrel held to the stock with screws suggests the potential for a screwhole that is too deep, for example.

I would verify that it is unloaded, and find somebody to borescope it at the very least. Also check the depth of the breechplug.

Safety first, my friend.

Best regards,

Notchy Bob

 

[excess650]

follow the links
https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/2028/1146/hatfield-full-stock-flintlock-squirrel-rifle
same stock down to the comb, funky forend molding, lack of nose cap, and holes through the thimbles, same 39" barrel length

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...C&biw=1600&bih=789&dpr=1#imgrc=BlVoAaOcymkGoM
Pull the barrel and see if and how its marked under the stock and the inside of the lock of there are markings

 

[Notchy Bob]

follow the links
https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/2028/1146/hatfield-full-stock-flintlock-squirrel-rifle
same stock down to the comb, funky forend molding, lack of nose cap, and holes through the thimbles, same 39" barrel length

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...C&biw=1600&bih=789&dpr=1#imgrc=BlVoAaOcymkGoM
Pull the barrel and see if and how its marked under the stock and the inside of the lock of there are markings

If the rifle is a Hatfield, that’s good. L&R makes a replacement lock for that rifle.

Notchy Bob

 

[Y2GREY]

follow the links
https://www.rockislandauction.com/detail/2028/1146/hatfield-full-stock-flintlock-squirrel-rifle
same stock down to the comb, funky forend molding, lack of nose cap, and holes through the thimbles

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...C&biw=1600&bih=789&dpr=1#imgrc=BlVoAaOcymkGoM

That was my initial thought. While Hatfield mass produced the Squirrel Rifle there were at least two other styles including the Mountain Rifle and Hatfield “Kentucky” Rifle as some refer to it. The latter are earlier builds. The stocks have a different comb, drop and less curve at the toe than the Squirrel or Mountain. They are also thicker at the muzzle. The locks may or may not be case colored and may or may not say Hatfield. (Mine says Hatfield but not the later warranted) the barrel on mine is stamped .50 with a very faint (1) on the underside no other stamps or numbers. The thing that threw me on this was the trigger design, they seem short or maybe cut down.

 

[Y2GREY]

Here are 3 variations of Hatfield Rifles. Please excuse the Mountain. It’s #24 and is being rehabbed.

 

[bpd303]

It doesn't look like my 45 cal flintlock Hatfield to me. The top one is a 54 percussion Hatfield

 

[Y2GREY]

It doesn't look like my 45 cal flintlock Hatfield to me. The top one is a 54 percussion Hatfield
View attachment 106101

Your .45 and the bottom one in my photo are the Squirrel Rifle. His looks more like the Hatfield model in the center of my shot. If you have the chance do me a BIG favor and measure one of you barrel wedges. I’m looking to replace mine. Out of curiosity what is the # of your 54? Here is mine.

 

[DuncNZ]

I contacted Pedersoli - its not one of theirs

As I have said before that is a new lock that has not been finished or tuned ,Nothing has been polished, all that rough surface and the casting marks are a dead giveaway . I'd also have a wee guess that the frizzen face ( hammer face) has not been hardened . The frizzen spring , (feather spring ) is a bit different in shape and should be a help in identifying the maker .

 

[DuncNZ]

Pull the barrel and see if and how its marked under the stock and the inside of the lock of there are markings
[/QUOTE]
Two friends of mine decided to import a Hatfield squirrel rifle each into New Zealand , one .45 one .50 . They were lead to believe that they were buying custom made all American made rifles . The rifles arrived and beautiful they both were . Under NZ law any make of firearm which has not been approved by the police has to be sent to the National Police headquarters for inspection and photographic documentation . These rifles arrived with paperwork saying the barrel must never be removed from the stock , because the stock may warp . Well give a policeman a gun and say it must not be taken to pieces was just too much and the barrels were removed from the stocks . When the guys got the rifles back the barrels hadn't been put back properly , so they removed them , only to find the Pedersoli writing, so much for all American made , they contacted Hatfield about this , without a satisfactory result . The guys shot the rifles once and then sold them . They were not happy chaps . I must say the rifles shot well and there is nothing wrong with Pedersoli barrels !!

 

[Hatman/2nd line]

The way it looks to me is that the lock is the original one but the design of the **** is not right, it should be directing the sparks from the action of the flint towards the pan and it seems to short. Also the **** seems not to line up with the frizzen, as you pointed out, or you would be able to have it heated and bent to lengthen the throw. I agree with the other post that L.&R. makes a replacement.