NEED C&B DANGEROUS GAME BACKUP!

[user 7142]

I am new to Cap and Ball and was wanting any information on dangerous game backup guns. This means bear and other ugly things of the like. I read the ROA .50 and .58 post. Those seem like they fit the bill good but I really want to know my options before dropping $1500. :hatsoff:

 

[Blizzard of '93]

A big-bore single shot would be good, my .50 CVA Hawken sure packs a wallop, a slug in there would be hard-hitting. With quik-load tubes you can get a couple shots off fairly fast.

 

[crockett]

The Walker Dragoon pistol was our most powerful pistol until the development of the 357 magnum. That Walker has a much longer cylinder than the Second and Third Dragoons and you can cram a ton of powder in it, plus the multiple shots.

 

[JackAubrey]

Mr Crockett is quite right,the walker has quite a bit of poke for a revolver.The problem w/ the walker is the loading lever drops b/c of the recoil,effectively locking up the cylinder.not good in a dangerous sitch.I would submit a 1st,2nd or 3rd model dragoon.I has very similar ballistics but a superior lock mechenism for the load lever.If I were going after bear, I don't know that a blackpowder revolver would be my first choice as a backup weapon.Best regards,J.A.

 

[Slamfire]

The Ruger New Model Army may not be PC, but it sure is a heck of a lot more powerful, than any Dragoon model, and more reliable than the Walker's. Remington made a revolving cylinder rifle, with, I believe, an 8 shot cylinder. The drawback being having your hand out in front of the cylinder when a chain fire occurs.
English big game hunters relyed on 4 and 8 bore rifles and a quick trade off with a gun bearer. Although a second shot with Sir Samuel Baker's "Baby" might take too much time to get off, he stated the rifle's recoil spun him around.
Shoot 'em with whatever you want, but your backup ought to be a guide with a modern, stopper rifle. :winking:

 

[user 7142]

So the ROA conversion to .50 has a lot more umph than a Dragoon series pistol? If I am reading everything correct, the ROA w/.50 is like having a potent .44, minimal but nice against bear.

 

[jdixon]

Pedersoli makes something they call a Kentucky Bounty pistol. It is a Moose of a handgun. .50 cal. w/ a 16.5" barrel. Overall length is over 22" It is a real shooter, the long sight radius gets you out past 50 yrds dancing pop cans. I have run loads as high as 65 grains of Fffg Swiss in mine - getting around 1470 fps at the muzzle with that load (flintlock - the cap lock version of the same gun will probably run a little higher) - that calculates somewhere in the area of 850 fpe - not bad for a handgun. No loose of accuracy with that high of a load either. To carry this thing hunting you will need to get a shoulder holster. They are not real expensive - kit form - around $300.00, finished, about $400.00. Cheers!!

 

[renovato]

For dangerous game, I'd talk to Big Iron Barrels about their .58 caliber conversions. It's done on the Dragoon and Walker both. I don't know if one is preferable to the other. The gun gives you a 440 grain slug at about 1200 fps. That's gonna penetrate well and make a BIG hole in whatever gets shot with it.

 

[user 7142]

Excellent advice! Thanks! Hey JR I am in KY too!

 

[Eric N.]

I think the Walker would work best. At 4 1/2 lbs it makes a right handy club. If it comes to that.

 

[user 7142]

Anyone have big irons number? I emailed them twice and havent got a response.

 

[Bob Riegl]

:v I like to use my Walker Colt---but it's a darn lump of steel---as for dangerous game I personally would carry my Ruger .44 Mag, which I trust more implicitly than my Walker. I was a died in the wool traditionalist, BP or nothing, one pi$$-d-off black bear convinced me to change. :hmm: :hatsoff:

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

the walker has quite a bit of poke for a revolver.The problem w/ the walker is the loading lever drops b/c of the recoil,effectively locking up the cylinder.not good in a dangerous sitch.

I had that problem with the Walker also and someone on here (I think it was?) told me to take a piece of leather and make a loop that fits rather snugly around the barrel and loading lever and then take it and twist it over into a figure eight to take up the slack and tighten up the loading lever.

You can use just about anything to tie up that loading lever--rubber bands, duct tape, leather/suede, bungee cord, etc...--just make sure that it doesn't interfere with the sighting process. Also make sure that you can remove the device, so that you can use the loading lever to load. It's kind of hard to load without it.

I even saw a Walker that someone had added the latch and catch from a later Dragoon to keep the lever on the Walker in place. It may not be "PC", but it sure worked well.

I think if you use as full a charge of powder as possible and a good conical (might be a little hard to load if you use a hardened alloy) and 5 slugs from that--besides the first hit from whatever rifle you used first... well that ought to at least ruin a black bear's day.

Of course, if you have the money, the .50 or .58 caliber options are really tempting...

always use enough gun,
WV_Hillbilly

 

[user 7142]

Reply from big irons....

The .58s are monsters, more or less. We take Dragoons and Walkers, make them
solid frame like an overgrown 1858, new internals, new cylinder out of
top-quality steel, new barrel (made in house), etc. Recoil is stout, as you can
get up to 1200FPS out of a 440 grain bullet - the revolver itself can go much
higher than this, but the bullets pull out of the chambers with any more recoil
than that.

The conversion for either a Walker or Dragoon is $1,255.00, plus either a
revolver from you or the cost of a revolver from Taylor's.

Do note that we can do a similar conversion to ROAs, but it is much more
expensive as there is quite a bit more reworking to be done - $1,750.00 is the
base price for that.

If you're interested, we also do .50 conversions on ROAs for $995.00 and on
Walkers and Dragoons for $819.

 

[renovato]

Dang, I'm drooling all over again. I want one of their conversions bad, but it'll hafta wait.

 

[WV_Hillbilly]

I am new to Cap and Ball and was wanting any information on dangerous game backup guns. This means bear and other ugly things of the like. I read the ROA .50 and .58 post. Those seem like they fit the bill good but I really want to know my options before dropping $1500. :hatsoff:

Would one of the old "Howdah" double barrel pistols be an option...? I don't know what an original costs, but I would do this instead.... Buy a Pedersoli double barrel rifle and cut it down and restock to make your own pistol that no one else would have like it. I guess you could do the same with a Pedersoli double barrel shotgun in 10gauge as that would be accurate enough close up and hit like a freight train late for the station.

You realize now, you've got me thinkin' again and I'll probably find a used double barrel to try this on...

Regards, and good luck,
WV_Hillbilly

 

[szihn]

I wasthinking along similar lines.
A $1250 bill plus a Walker would have to be over $1600.
Fot that kind of money I can make one heck of a custom pistol
A single barrel could be loaded to a more powerful level because you don't have to worry about the recoil moving the ball in the other barrel. but a double 58 or 62 would be awsome.
I have made several double rifles, but never a double pistol. Might be fun
:grin:

 

[Blizzard of '93]

Steve I had the same thoughts, here's another. If stiff recoil moves the projectile in second barrel how about an 'overslug' card to prevent that. One good thing about a custom is one barrel could be smoothbore, other rifled if it would be beneficial. But since obviously this a short range -type handgun I'm thinking it would not be much if any advantage.
A 20 or 12 ga. double handgun, capper, 10" barrel, one barrel loaded with 000 buck other with a slug/prb, that would be a hard hitting back-up.

 

[TN.Frank]

The first thing that I'd do is make sure that I had enough first gun so that I'd not need a back up gun. Then if you feel you still need one I'd look at the Ruger Old Army in Stainless. You can push a conical with a good charge of powder in an OA and it'll easily equal a 45 Colt in effectiveness, not to shabby for a CnB revolver. If it's a matter of live and death then "PC" goes out the window IMHO, effectiveness and reliability are what you're looking for. Good luck on your search.

 

[crockett]

You guys have changed my mind. The Walker will take the most power so theoretically it would be the most powerful but I agreee- I never liked that ramrod dropping during the recoil. The 3rd Model Dragoon is really a beautiful revolver and I think that was the pistol that Hikock used to kill Dave Tutt(sic?)so it is pc for some other applications.
My thoughts with a revolver versus single shot is the revolver offers multiple shots.
Yet another option is a Bowie Knife- always works. Go to one of the knife forums- guys killing wild hogs, etc with knives all the time. The original "back up" weapon.