Need Help first Shot Hunting Accurary

[German Jäger]

Hello my Friends?
Please help i have a Problem with 1. Shot Accurary when i hunting with Muzzleloader. Most of Shots are not bad at 50 Meters but the one ore other misses the Target..know i need your help with this.
A Friend of mine have an old Hunting Book for the late 19. Century they say you have just to burn a half Load of powder in the fresh clean barrel an the but the Hunting Load in so we test it and its works but i think if you not fire it the same day the barrel began to rust an rotti g?! In the moment i clean my barrel but the charge on the a wad of fur the the ball with wonderlube patch this works not bad but its not 100% first hit formula and i dont want to give the game pain or it get lost with bad hit
So please help!!
I use various Rifles some originals from the 18-19 century jäger rifles in 58-62 caliber and some new Kit rifle from kibler tow with Green mointain and other good barrels. Its flint and cap and ball types
Shooting distance mostly 35-60yards

Can you help with good advise and propper loads?! Thank you

 

[Nuthatch]

From the first shot until I'm done for the day (20+ shots), I notice no change in accuracy out to 100 yards. Smoothbores throw fliers more often for me but rifles not so much. None of it has ever had anything to do with the number of shots down the barrel though. About a week ago, my first shot split the ball on an axe head at about 15 yards. About the 5th shot was off-hand & hit a 10" gong at about 75 yards. The 22nd shot hit a 6" gong at about 90 yards (rested on a boulder). The 25th hit a 10" gong (seated) out at about 80 yards. There's no discernable difference in accuracy for me.

Like you, I'm more interested in that first shot accuracy. In the CF world, it's the "cold barrel" accuracy that is the most important to a hunter. So that's where your sights should be aligned if you're noticing a difference. Sounds like a drag though -- fire, then clean, then load. That would take way too long.

 

[HSmithTX]

How are you preparing your barrel for the first shot? I use petroleum oil to preserve my bore when my rifles are in storage, so before I load I clean the barrel with dry patches until I see no oil, then I use 90-100% alcohol and patches to wipe out the bore until they are clean, then dry patches again. When using the alcohol patches I really soak them, they are dripping wet when they go in the bore, maybe two of these and dry patches will get out any alcohol left in the bore. Then I load powder in the clean dry bore. I use animal fat lube for hunting, Mink oil currently, and my patches are fully saturated with it and this fat protects the bore while hunting. Patch and ball after powder, electrical tape over muzzle after that. I don't use anything between the powder and the patch, and 2F powder in hunting rifles. My patched ball is a tight fit also, maybe even a very tight fit, you cannot push the ball down the bore without gripping the ramrod 6-8 inches above the muzzle and push down, move hands up and do it again, all the way down the bore. If you tried to push the ball down in one stroke I am pretty confident you would break the ramrod. I have no problems with first shot accuracy to 100 yards doing this.

 

[German Jäger]

Ok, i do it near the same way but i have some times flyers with the 1. shot. This makes me crazy so tomorow i will make a test with the .62 Jäger Rifle with Colraine Barrel. On target shooting its not so a problem but if you hunt the first must be sure shot

 

[HSmithTX]

Shoot only first shots, clean completely between shots including the oil and clean oil out, do this at least 5 shots, see where the group is relative to point of aim. I zero my hunting rifles this way, so that the first clean shot is where I want it. I don't currently have any rifles that won't put the next 2-4 shots in the same group with or without cleaning, but I am confident knowing my first shot will go where I want it to.

 

[Britsmoothy]

You maybe assuming you need a fouled barrel.
May not be that.
It maybe the lack of lubricant or wrong lubricant. Lose the wonderlube for sure!

Obtain some beeswax and mix olive oil until you have a suitable grease for your climate.
Try to develop a load that allows you to add plenty of lubricant before the patched ball. Maybe a felt wad or thin leather wad.

The variation between first and subsequent shots may not be a clean verses fouled barrel but merely severely unlubricated verses lubricated...
Good luck.

 

[Sam squanch]

1. Weigh your round balls. 2. Use a buffer between the powder and patched round ball. 3. It’s a pain, but wipe between every shot. I shoot a new englander with a pitted bore. With wiping between shots, and cream of wheat between the powder and ball, I get the same bullet impact on the target, from the first shot to when I’m done.

 

[Britsmoothy]

Any one heard from him

 

[LME]

I have never seen a M.L. that didn't shoot high on the first shot from a clean barrel. I just see how high and allow for it on the first shot. It works for me?

 

[tenngun]

You watch folk with chronos. They get x speed on first shot, then generally velocity goes up. Consistency is the key.
There are little tricks, weigh the ball, pre weigh your charges, clean between shots, ect that produces the best consistency.
I do swab between shots, otherwise I inspect a ball but never weigh it, and use just a volume measure, that might be a little rounded one shot, little dished the second.
Learn your gun. See where it shoots first shot, swab the bore, let cool at least ten minutes, then shoot again.
Use what you use in the tall timber. Don’t sight your gun with spit and expect the same for your field lube.
Look at your shots and don’t sweat the small stuff. Do you clover leaf four and have a flyer two or three inch’s from POA? That will drive a ‘blood shooter’ crazy. However, three inches from point of aim on Bambi will put meat on your table

 

[bigstick6017555]

I have observed over the years that a lot of shooters of black powder rifles do not take the time for whatever reason, hours, money, or Patience, to really wring out the accuracy of their rifle. Some guns you may get lucky and from day one they just shoot, get an errant fire arm, get ready for some aggravation. There are so many variables, from the shooter, gun, and components that it can be a long road to hoe, if not overwhelming. I acquired such a gun from a fellow shooter a number of years back that gave up on it and wanted rid of it. It was a T/C .50 cap lock. Thinking back, it took me a good 14+ range days (almost full 5-6 hrs at a time) plus numerous shop hours and keeping records. It worked out to be the way it was held, rest or off hand, mechanical, pressure points on lock and barrel, barrel polishing, and components it was fed, (powder (type/make), patch, lube). It can be a trying experience, take your time, do not rush, and small changes, keep records. I found it fun, but I like to shoot, I love errant challenging guns

 

[Eric Krewson]

I have had rifles that seemed to throw an errant first shot, as I learned more about working up a load, I found that my load development wasn't as spot on as it should be. I really have them dialed in now, the first shot or 20the they all go in the same place now.

 

[Sparkitoff]

I have one flintlock that happens to be .54 caliber. After darn near $500 in components and days at the range I called "Uncle". It throws the first shot somewhere other than the group after that. I don't want to clean after every shot at the range to dial in that one shot. There's been several times in hunting that I use a second and rarely a third shot. Also, once settled in to shoot at the range, I want to see a nice group, not clean and clean and clean. So, I put a full charge of powder and a lubricated cotton ball in the barrel and fire it off the night before or morning of a hunt. At the range I do it first thing. If I'm alone, I've even shot it inside the house or cabin into the fireplace so avoid outside noise. One "blank" shot. After that it will keep all the subsequent shots in a very nice small group. I've fired up to 20 subsequent shots. No major trouble loading or keeping the group. I've never tried to shoot more than that at once. I've fired the blank, loaded a full charge and ball and left it that way to 1 to as many as 8 days. Some of those outings I got my shot at game and other times I unloaded with a CO2 discharger. Regardless, there's no rust in the barrel. Longer time loaded or a rainy day might cause different results. I really want to just load and know the first shot is on target, but that rifle won't allow it for any amount of time, combination or money. So, I live with it by doing what it wants. I'm glad many guys get first shot accuracy - and I do with several other rifles - but not this one. Too bad, it's my favorite and most used. I give - I fire the stupid blank and get on with my business. Frustrating as it is, I have empathy for the guys that start a post about this. You can get lucky, spend days and dollars or just shoot the blank and get it over with and move on to hunting or shooting. To me the frustration had to come to an end somehow.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I have one flintlock that happens to be .54 caliber. After darn near $500 in components and days at the range I called "Uncle". It throws the first shot somewhere other than the group after that. I don't want to clean after every shot at the range to dial in that one shot. There's been several times in hunting that I use a second and rarely a third shot. Also, once settled in to shoot at the range, I want to see a nice group, not clean and clean and clean. So, I put a full charge of powder and a lubricated cotton ball in the barrel and fire it off the night before or morning of a hunt. At the range I do it first thing. If I'm alone, I've even shot it inside the house or cabin into the fireplace so avoid outside noise. One "blank" shot. After that it will keep all the subsequent shots in a very nice small group. I've fired up to 20 subsequent shots. No major trouble loading or keeping the group. I've never tried to shoot more than that at once. I've fired the blank, loaded a full charge and ball and left it that way to 1 to as many as 8 days. Some of those outings I got my shot at game and other times I unloaded with a CO2 discharger. Regardless, there's no rust in the barrel. Longer time loaded or a rainy day might cause different results. I really want to just load and know the first shot is on target, but that rifle won't allow it for any amount of time, combination or money. So, I live with it by doing what it wants. I'm glad many guys get first shot accuracy - and I do with several other rifles - but not this one. Too bad, it's my favorite and most used. I give - I fire the stupid blank and get on with my business. Frustrating as it is, I have empathy for the guys that start a post about this. You can get lucky, spend days and dollars or just shoot the blank and get it over with and move on to hunting or shooting. To me the frustration had to come to an end somehow.

I remember you mentioning this rifle before.
Did you, I wonder, ever try the lubed cotton ball under the patched ball , it is a ball rifle yes?

 

[LME]

I have one flintlock that happens to be .54 caliber. After darn near $500 in components and days at the range I called "Uncle". It throws the first shot somewhere other than the group after that. I don't want to clean after every shot at the range to dial in that one shot. There's been several times in hunting that I use a second and rarely a third shot. Also, once settled in to shoot at the range, I want to see a nice group, not clean and clean and clean. So, I put a full charge of powder and a lubricated cotton ball in the barrel and fire it off the night before or morning of a hunt. At the range I do it first thing. If I'm alone, I've even shot it inside the house or cabin into the fireplace so avoid outside noise. One "blank" shot. After that it will keep all the subsequent shots in a very nice small group. I've fired up to 20 subsequent shots. No major trouble loading or keeping the group. I've never tried to shoot more than that at once. I've fired the blank, loaded a full charge and ball and left it that way to 1 to as many as 8 days. Some of those outings I got my shot at game and other times I unloaded with a CO2 discharger. Regardless, there's no rust in the barrel. Longer time loaded or a rainy day might cause different results. I really want to just load and know the first shot is on target, but that rifle won't allow it for any amount of time, combination or money. So, I live with it by doing what it wants. I'm glad many guys get first shot accuracy - and I do with several other rifles - but not this one. Too bad, it's my favorite and most used. I give - I fire the stupid blank and get on with my business. Frustrating as it is, I have empathy for the guys that start a post about this. You can get lucky, spend days and dollars or just shoot the blank and get it over with and move on to hunting or shooting. To me the frustration had to come to an end somehow.

I think a lot of shooters say their M.L.s shoots the same place with all shots first and last is because they accept a five inch group as good? I expect my groups at a 100 YD, to be a lot less than five inches. As I have mentioned before I have shot a lot of different M.L.s and they all had the first shot a little high. If one thinks logically they should realize that there is a lot less resistance on a ball coming out of a clean barrel than a dirty one and it has to effect the path of the ball to some degree.

 

[Sam squanch]

Some people are satisfied with deer hunting accuracy, some want the tightest group they can get.

 

[Eric Krewson]

I won't accept any group over a couple of inches out of my rifles at 50 yards, I keep polishing the bores and lately have coned a couple of the barrels to get the most out of them.

All my rifles will group in the 1" range if I do my part, if I am having a good day, they will all clover leaf.

I shot this group the other day off sandbags while I was dialing in a new build. It was shooting a 4" group before I coned the barrel. Before coning the barrel, I had to buy a .528 mold to have a ball I could get past the first inch or so of a very tight bore.

I was sighting in the rifle after coning it, it grouped well with a .530 ball and a .015 patch but was shooting low and left, I held higher for the first shot and hit higher than I wanted to. I bumped up the powder from 80gr to 85 gr and found what the rifle really wanted.

This is at 50 yards of sandbags. All of the other holes were while I was drifting the rear sight and filing the front sight. You can see the ball holes come up as I filed down the front sight.

 

[Sparkitoff]

I remember you mentioning this rifle before.
Did you, I wonder, ever try the lubed cotton ball under the patched ball , it is a ball rifle yes?

I tried what seems like a million things. It’s 1:70 GM barrel and the rifling is crisp and cone is smooth. Not an imperfection anywhere on a scope inspection. It wants to be dirty. The first shot is 5 to as much as 10 inches off. After a first shot, live or blank, a 5-shot group at 100 yards can be kept in a 3.5 inch bullseye.