Need Help, German Jaeger Rifle

[German Jäger]

Hello Friends,
Today i buy this beautyful old Percusion Jäger Rifle with Peepsight in . 50. Caliber! It is in best Condition. Please help ist this a Hunting or Target Rifle?! How old and what kind of Bullet ist best Roundball with Patch oder other?! I was very Happy with!

 

[Grenadier1758]

Target rifle. The tang peep sight is best for target use.

What is the bore (land to land) diameter? Yes, you identified the rife as 50 caliber.

What is the groove to groove diameter?

What is the rate of twist?

What is the barrel length?

What is the shape of the butt plate?

Is the stock shape better for off hand holds or does it feel better for bench?

Did the seller provide any usage recommendations?

A little short of information to start speculating.

 

[BruceHH]

I can't speak to the age as these rifles are not my area of experience. You will need to know the rifling twist rate for a start on determining whether it was built for round ball or some other type.

 

[TFoley]

Target rifle. The tang peep sight is best for target use.

What is the bore (land to land) diameter? Yes, you identified the rife as 50 caliber.

What is the groove to groove diameter?

What is the rate of twist?

What is the barrel length?

What is the shape of the butt plate?

Is the stock shape better for off hand holds or does it feel better for bench?

Did the seller provide any usage recommendations?

A little short of information to start speculating.

I'm betting that Herr German Jaeger is actually IN Germany, as seen from his English/German - oder/or.

This is undoubtedly a target Stutzen rifle, dating from around 1845-60 with that back-action lock and will be a patched round ball shooter. It was the British who pioneered the use of elongated bullets.

Used for standing shooting at 50,75, 100 and 200m - this kind of rifle became the Schuetzen rifle so beloved of the German immigrants to the USA, who brought their beer-making skills along with their shooting skills with them - the famous Anheuser-Busch, Coors, Schlitz and many other Germanic brands spawned shooters and gunmakers like Pope in the latter part of the 19thC.

The addition of sling mounts is interesting though - so perhaps it might have served in the field - we'll never know.

 

[waksupi]

I've seen those sights sell for over $600.

 

[German Jäger]

Yes and hello from Germany!


The Bore Lenght is 75cm and bore dismeter 12,5mm. I pay 1250€ for the beauty i cant say no.
I dont know any other dates at the end of the barrel to brechplug ist ELG stamped little mark.
Tomorow i see another one its a hunting model it is a flintlock transition to percusion Rifle in the same Caliber 35km from my hometown a man found it 50 year before under the rooffloor

 

[Dale Allen Raby]

Wilkommen! Ich glaube es ist ein Zielgewehr, aber Sie kann jagen mit es. Es tut mir leid... mein Deutsch is nicht gut.

(Welcome! I believe it is a target rifle, but you can hunt with it. I'm sorry, my German is not good.)

 

[German Jäger]

Hallo zurück, the german is not so bad! Please give more information

 

[Dale Allen Raby]

Ich weiss nicht wie alt es ist. Diese Gewheren sind jetzt hergestellt so vielleicht alt oder neues.

Sie mussen der Verdrehrate gelernen. Es ist 1:66, dan Kugeln, es ist 1:48 order 1:24, dan "conical bullet" (es tut mir leid, ich weis nicht die Deutsch word).

Nur schwarzpulver! Saubermachen es nacht schießen.

(I know not how old it is. These rifles are still made today so it could be old or new. You must learn the twist rate. If it is 1:66, then ball, 1:48 or 1:24, conical bullet. Sorry I don't know the German word. Only blackpowder! Clean after shooting.)

 

[German Jäger]

I thank you i shooting and hunting with glintlocks like the colonial rifle in .58 from jim kibler or the rocky mountsin hawken with maple dtock in .54 i have a kibler southern mountain in 40 csliber snd a lancadter from garner. I have an original german jäger from thurnau in .60 csliber.
But this art of rifle are new for me its an other ära of time i dont know the twistrate sorry.

 

[Dale Allen Raby]

I thank you i shooting and hunting with glintlocks like the colonial rifle in .58 from jim kibler or the rocky mountsin hawken with maple dtock in .54 i have a kibler southern mountain in 40 csliber snd a lancadter from garner. I have an original german jäger from thurnau in .60 csliber.
But this art of rifle are new for me its an other ära of time i dont know the twistrate sorry.

There are ways to learn the twist rate, but probably the simplest is to just shoot it first with a patched round ball. Try a .490 round ball with a .010" thick patch. Shoot it at a target and see how it groups. If you have a good group, i.e.: all the holes are close together, then your gun has a twist rate close to 1:66, generally the correct twist rate for round balls. You can try different weights of conical bullets and see how they perform.

If memory serves (and it may not), those guns were generally designed to shoot a hollow-base bullet with light charges of powder.

Jager rifles are uncommon here the the US, so you might find more expertise locally or in Switzerland or maybe Austria. I have only seen pictures, never an actual rifle. Most of them are very accurate from what I have heard.

 

[TFoley]

Yes and hello from Germany!


The Bore Lenght is 75cm and bore dismeter 12,5mm. I pay 1250€ for the beauty i cant say no.
I dont know any other dates at the end of the barrel to brechplug ist ELG stamped little mark.
Tomorow i see another one its a hunting model it is a flintlock transition to percusion Rifle in the same Caliber 35km from my hometown a man found it 50 year before under the rooffloor

The barrel was made in Liége, Belgium. ELG = Épreuve Liége = Liege Proofhouse. There must be more stamps on it, including the calibre in mm and inspector's initials. They are usually underneath the breech and can only be seen if you take the barrel out of the stock.

 

[SDSmlf]

From your photograph of the bore it appears to have deep rifling and most likely made for shooting a patched roundball. I would try starting with .015” to .020” (0.38mm to 0.50mm) thick patch material and the appropriate sized roundball. The thicker patch material will fill or seal the deeper rifling better that thinner material.
https://cdn2.imagearchive.com/muzzl...105-54C18708-8CF8-4BD1-961E-5329CCFD77D9.jpeg

 

[Grenadier1758]

I think @TFoley did the bulk of speculation in the direction I was thinking. I agree that it is likely to be a round ball shooter. I would start with a ball that is 0.005 inches under the land to land diameter and a cotton patch of the groove depth + 0.005 inches. With a decent patch lubricant, the patch will compress and grab the pure lead ball. This is a target, Scheutzen, rifle and not a hunting, Jaeger, rifle. Probably made after 1850.

 

[German Jäger]

Ok that sounds interesting so i use Schweizer 3 Pulver do what a charge i us gor starting?

 

[SDSmlf]

Ok that sounds interesting so i use Schweizer 3 Pulver do what a charge i us gor starting?

With your 50 caliber gun and a patched roundball I would suggest starting with about 50 grains of powder. Work up and down from there in 5 grain increments until you find your most accurate load.

 

[German Jäger]

Ok so i think! I hope that it have good accurary the seller send it to me tomorow so i wait 3-4 day the have it in my hands

 

[SDSmlf]

One item to check when the gun is in your hands is to make sure it’s not loaded. Unlikely, but it happens.

 

[Relic shooter]

Nice find !! Shooting original Jaegers was my cup of tea before my body aged faster than the guns

When you get the rifle & measure bore & rifling depth & rate of twist in the barrel I'll try to help you with a patch & ball & load combination,, if you or your gunsmith feel condition of the barrel & bore is safe to shoot.
relic shooter

 

[GREENSWLDE]

My 9.6mm Schutzen loved 40grns of Swiss 3 and was sonic at 100mtrs so possibly 50/55grns would suit. It was Was also Belgian.