Need help on my first choice.

[Little Wattsy]

You are going to have a ball... All puns intended :grin: Lots to lean and more to tinker with... Welcome aboard!

 

[Lonegun1894]

First of, congrats on choosing a fine caliber and welcome to the addiction. I have one suggestion that no one has mentioned yet. If possible, shoulder your choices before buying. While I have 3 GPRs and prefer the feel of them and the way they shoot over my CVA St. Louis Hawken and my TC Hawken, the GPR does feel different. To me, the main difference isn't in the lenght of the barrel, but rather the extra drop in the stock that the GPR has when compared to the CVA or TC, which also have very similar if not identical drop to the Trade rifle. Sorry to throw one more variable into the equation for you, but just wanted to make sure you knew before spending your hard earned cash. And while I prefer the GPR with its 1:60 ROT, my TC and CVA "hawkens" shoot the same size groups and both of them have the 1:48" ROT, so dont let the twist scare you away from the Trade Rifle or Dixie Hawken should they fit you better than the GPR. But I chose the GPR, several times already. They're a great production rifle.

 

[cynthialee]

I have never had the chance to fire a GPR, but I have shouldered one and I can't argue with the feel of it at all. There is a certain aspect that is almost magic with these rifles.

 

[splinter84]

First of, congrats on choosing a fine caliber and welcome to the addiction. I have one suggestion that no one has mentioned yet. If possible, shoulder your choices before buying. While I have 3 GPRs and prefer the feel of them and the way they shoot over my CVA St. Louis Hawken and my TC Hawken, the GPR does feel different. To me, the main difference isn't in the lenght of the barrel, but rather the extra drop in the stock that the GPR has when compared to the CVA or TC, which also have very similar if not identical drop to the Trade rifle. Sorry to throw one more variable into the equation for you, but just wanted to make sure you knew before spending your hard earned cash. And while I prefer the GPR with its 1:60 ROT, my TC and CVA "hawkens" shoot the same size groups and both of them have the 1:48" ROT, so dont let the twist scare you away from the Trade Rifle or Dixie Hawken should they fit you better than the GPR. But I chose the GPR, several times already. They're a great production rifle.

I have shot a CVA Hawken several times and hunted with one last fall. I have also shoulder a Traditions Kentuckyrifle at Cabelas. It felt very comfortable to me. The dropped stock seemed to bring the sights up to a more natural position. Not sure if the GPR is similar or not. They both look close though.

 

[Billnpatti]

No question in my mind that the Lyman GPR is the best of the ones that you listed. It is an excellent rifle and the closest in appearance to the original plains rifles.

 

[Zonie]

No doubt that the GPR is a nice gun but whether it is the best one for you depends on your strength.

The two other rifles you listed weigh less so they are easier to carry long distances.
They also are less muzzle heavy than the GPR.

If having the "closest thing to a Hawken" look alike isn't a big driver, the shorter, lighter rifles may be the best choice.

As Clint said, "A man has to know his limitations." so this is something only you can decide.

 

[George T.]

I have a GPR a 50 that I just love! It shoots very well and looks great also. It shoots better than I can. Geo. T.

 

[kruzer1]

I was going through the same dilemma recently. I just went with the dixie hawken- I liked its lighter profile for the miles of walking I do while hunting and I guess the brasswork caught my eye, even if it is less authentic for the common guy to have in the 19th century.

If I like this kit, I see myself eventually doing one of the expensive authentic flintlock kits, but for a 1st kit project might as well start with something easier. I don't think you can go wrong with any of the choices however!

 

[crockett]

I would go with the Lyman GPR. It is not an exact copy of an original Hawken rifle but at first glance- it looks very close. The iron hardware is good and a lot of original Hawken rifles didn't have a cap box. The 32" barrel certainly makes it look more like an original and if you ever lifted one, you would instantly notice the greater heft to the rifle. Besides, it is very well made. If it were my own GPR I would probably replace the adjustable rear sight with a plain type.
The most important is that it has earned a reputation as an accurate and quality firearm. I have never heard of anyone complain about one.
The $20 price difference- you'll gain far more than that on resale value.

 

[Prairieofthedog]

splinter84,at 6'1" that .54 GPR will fit you well.I have the .50 and the .54,the .54 is a better handling gun than the .50.If you haven't popped for a new one yet there are used ones that come up for sale frequently.Just make sure the bore is in excellent shape.Also there are 2 Great Plains Rifles the GP rifle with slow twist rifling and the GP hunter that has a fast twist for conicals.You will enjoy this rifle and you can do the Rondys with it if you want too.Good Luck.

 

[William O.]

I would go with the Lyman Trade Rifle because it's simple, reliable and built like a tank. Neither of the two TR's I've owned needed their single triggers tuned or adjusted while all three of my GPR's required work to get then working smoothly. Plus you only have to worry about pulling the hammer to fullcock, aiming and firing when out hunting. The shorter barrel is easier to handle if the conditions in your area are choked with heavy brush or timber and the .54 will put down just about any critter here in North America with a properly placed ball. While the stock is rather chunky that leaves room for sanding and refinishing down the road if you want to slim it down. It's the best bang for your buck out there IMHO.

 

[splinter84]

Hey guys,

I crossed the Dixie off the list. Being it isn't much less than the GPR and the trade rifle being the best bargain out there for that style/dimension of a rifle I figured I would narrow it down to two now.

I had a chance to visit my neighbor who loaned me his .50 cal CVA Hawken over the weekend. The Vikes were stinking up Lambeau (sorry if the spelling is off) so we had plenty of time to talk guns. I shoulder both his Hawken guns and got a good feel from them. His .50 cal is close to 9 lbs while his .54 is around 8. A noticeable difference for sure and something I am keeping in the back of my head for the final decision.

I was planning to put an order in for a GPR tomorrow but my wife mentioned making another trip to Cabelas to check out a few rifles there. I am going to try and find a rifle similar
to the GPR to get a feel of the butt stock. Maybe their Kentucky rifle would be a close comparison. It won't be like holding an actual GPR but close.

I found a picture on google images of a Trade and GPR sitting next to each other and I was pleasantly surprised that the GPR wasn't that much longer than the Trade rifle.

Been reading that the GPR trigger assembly needs a little work out of the box. Is this a big issue or more of a personal preference and taste?

Any way. I have another week to think about it. Decisions....decisions.

I am starting to put a list of accessories together as well. Here is what I have so far. Been noticing the accessories add up quick!

T-handle ball starter
Cleaning jig
Patch retrieving jig
Bronze bore brush
Ball pull jig
Powder measurer
Capper
Cleaning patches
Barricade lubricant for storing
Olive oil for patch lubricant. Or maybe a Ballistol and water mixture.

For powder I am going to try 2F black powder first. Unless there are better alternatives. Not sure on ball and patch combos yet. Maybe a .530 ball and .018 patch or a .535 ball? Not sure on that.

Thanks for the help so far. I'm sure I will be returning with more questions as time goes.

 

[cynthialee]

pretty good list



personaly I don't use brushes in my rifles, a cotton swab of the apropriate caliber works well enough to clean things up
I almost got a wire brush stuck in a bore then the next day a member posted his horror story of how he got a brush stuck and it took him a few days to get it fixed. It was a pretty long thread with some serious brain storming. Since then I haven't had one near one of my bores.

 

[Lonegun1894]

As to what ball size and patch thickness, you will have to try several combos and see which shoots best, as each gun is slightly different in terms of what it prefers. You will have plenty of time to figure it out once you get your gun, so I wouldn't lose any sleep over it just yet if I were you.

 

[Rat Trapper]

Watch the adds here and look for a TC Hawken. You can pick up a real nice used one within your price range very easy. Just make sure the barrel does not have the QLA on it.

 

[crockett]

Splinter84: maybe a few other odds and ends: I think you ought to start with the .530 ball and then worry about a .535 (harder to load) or a special .528 ("thumb" load). The choice of real black powder 2f is good, the .018 patch is good. You really don't need a capper or you can make one out of scrap leather- punch holes along one side of the leather and split to the edge and stick in the caps. One thing you ought to buy is a breech plug scrapper to scrape residue from the face of the breech plug. Most breech plugs are flat however a couple are concave so you need a scrapper to match the type breech plug you have. I would also get a powder horn or flask and a nipple wrench to remove the nipple for cleaning. I use q-tips to clean out the drum area after the nipple is removed. A ball puller is good but you might also want to consider a co2 powered ball remover.

 

[BrownBear]

I was planning to put an order in for a GPR tomorrow but my wife mentioned making another trip to Cabelas to check out a few rifles there. I am going to try and find a rifle similar
to the GPR to get a feel of the butt stock. Maybe their Kentucky rifle would be a close comparison. It won't be like holding an actual GPR but close.

I found a picture on google images of a Trade and GPR sitting next to each other and I was pleasantly surprised that the GPR wasn't that much longer than the Trade rifle.

Been reading that the GPR trigger assembly needs a little work out of the box. Is this a big issue or more of a personal preference and taste?

You'll probably find the Cabellas Hawken rather than the Kentucky more like the feel of a GPR, and especially the Lyman Trade Rifle. Good to feel and compare though, because each of us is built a little different and has a little different tastes.

As for the Lyman triggers and fiddling, it all depends on your expectations in a trigger. I have pretty high expectations and change out the triggers in all my GPRs. Best answer once again, is to try it first before fiddling. If you like it, carry on. If you don't, fiddle.

 

[splinter84]

Splinter84: maybe a few other odds and ends: I think you ought to start with the .530 ball and then worry about a .535 (harder to load) or a special .528 ("thumb" load). The choice of real black powder 2f is good, the .018 patch is good. You really don't need a capper or you can make one out of scrap leather- punch holes along one side of the leather and split to the edge and stick in the caps. One thing you ought to buy is a breech plug scrapper to scrape residue from the face of the breech plug. Most breech plugs are flat however a couple are concave so you need a scrapper to match the type breech plug you have. I would also get a powder horn or flask and a nipple wrench to remove the nipple for cleaning. I use q-tips to clean out the drum area after the nipple is removed. A ball puller is good but you might also want to consider a co2 powered ball remover.

If I were to go with a Lyman, I don't think the breech plug is flat so probably a concave scraper? I will save my $ on the capper. I could probably put caps in an air tight container for now. I will put a nipple wrench on the list. I was thinking of picking up a plastic powder flask but wasn't sure on it. I don't need nothing fancy for hunting. I don't think I need anything big either. I can always refill my flask back at camp. Not sure if funds allow to spring for the CO2 ball remover right off the bat.

Thanks for the tip on the ball/patch combo. Going to stick with 2F powder, .530 ball, .018 patch, and olive oil or ballistol/water for patch lube. I will be doing some research on patch lubes though, and try a few "homemade" recipes.

I am hunting around for a little leather bag/pouch to carry some of these items as well, but I have time for that.

I'll keep you guys posted on what I pick up. It's probably going to be a few weeks before the gun gets here, but that gives me time putting together a list of accessories.

 

[splinter84]

I was planning to put an order in for a GPR tomorrow but my wife mentioned making another trip to Cabelas to check out a few rifles there. I am going to try and find a rifle similar
to the GPR to get a feel of the butt stock. Maybe their Kentucky rifle would be a close comparison. It won't be like holding an actual GPR but close.

I found a picture on google images of a Trade and GPR sitting next to each other and I was pleasantly surprised that the GPR wasn't that much longer than the Trade rifle.

Been reading that the GPR trigger assembly needs a little work out of the box. Is this a big issue or more of a personal preference and taste?

You'll probably find the Cabellas Hawken rather than the Kentucky more like the feel of a GPR, and especially the Lyman Trade Rifle. Good to feel and compare though, because each of us is built a little different and has a little different tastes.

As for the Lyman triggers and fiddling, it all depends on your expectations in a trigger. I have pretty high expectations and change out the triggers in all my GPRs. Best answer once again, is to try it first before fiddling. If you like it, carry on. If you don't, fiddle.

I will keep that in mind. Like I mentioned, I did shoulder my neighbors CVA Hawken quite a bit this fall and over the weekend. I have a pretty good idea on its feel now, and it closely resembles the look of the Trade rifle. I will keep your post in mind when I make it to Cabelas this weekend.

I probably will worry more about trigger feel as I get more familiar with my chosen rifle. Your right, that process will take a little time and experience.

 

[BrownBear]

If I were to go with a Lyman, I don't think the breech plug is flat so probably a concave scraper?

Scrapers don't work for poot in the Lyman breech unless you shape your own. Too much trouble for me, so I just go with the 35 cal bristle brush that Lyman recommends. Same for Cabela Hawken, which is made by the same folks that make Lyman (Investarms).