Need more patching eduction - please

[GriscomRun]

I plan to use my flintlock to hunt in this years Pa. flintlock season.
And I have to go "as is" so to speak. This is because I have only had this rifle out a few times to begin the process and was only using spit patch on the range. Sights we're slightly adjusted for 50 yd. range. Off the bench, 75 gr 3F, 490 ball, 4F (tiny bit) in the pan.
Shane Emig Yorktown flintlock, Colrain brl. 39".

Material used is blue pillow ticking, wetted with spit, seated a .50 ball into the muzzle, and cut off the excess material. Material sold as .018. I cut it into 2" strips and rolled it up; stored into the range box. I get that when I am able to find a patch the outer edges are frayed from the patch knife. I did find one that looks "blown" as I've heard discussed here.
Little to no smoke with load, just a sharp crack when fired. Group is not the best. Hoping that will change in time.

1- Just received some TOW mink oil tallow in the tin. My question is that since I've not used a patch lube before, how to apply it to the patch material. Sounds dumb I know. Should I rub it into one side only of the patching material ? Which I think ir correct. Will a light coating be sufficient ? Then I could cut the patching into shorter pieces, place in a tin I have and be ready to go.

2- Regarding the blown patching. I'm hoping the lube will help this. Also, I could switch to a .495 ball for next year. Would it still benefit my rifle to scotch brite the muzzle and barrel ?

3- As it stands I'm shooting a 5 in. group from a good rest. Not a newbie to rifles or the bench. Handloader for 45 years, high power cpometitor. Just FYI.

4- Yup, there is vision difficulties at my age. Likely will put on a wide front sight at some point. Also likely I would love to get a short barrel rifle kit. Like 32". In flint.

Thanks for your input. I appreciate the help I get and put it to good use. Only one change at a time here. Patching and lube first. I'll be able to read my targets and adjust the powder.
But first I must get Brad and Shane's Yorktown to group much tighter.

Thanks again for your help.

 

[Flintlock_bob]

I would say to just lube one side of the patch lightly and work it into the patch. I have not used mink oil but I would imagine if you let the material sit for sometime the patches will seem a bit drier.

If you are burning the patches you might want to try a thicker material. Or maybe the change to mink oil rather than spit might make a difference.

Before you hunt you will want to see how it shoots as it might be different than the spit patch, but I would guess not by much but I would want to know for sure.

 

[Thunder14]

I plan to use my flintlock to hunt in this years Pa. flintlock season.
And I have to go "as is" so to speak. This is because I have only had this rifle out a few times to begin the process and was only using spit patch on the range. Sights we're slightly adjusted for 50 yd. range. Off the bench, 75 gr 3F, 490 ball, 4F (tiny bit) in the pan.
Shane Emig Yorktown flintlock, Colrain brl. 39".

Material used is blue pillow ticking, wetted with spit, seated a .50 ball into the muzzle, and cut off the excess material. Material sold as .018. I cut it into 2" strips and rolled it up; stored into the range box. I get that when I am able to find a patch the outer edges are frayed from the patch knife. I did find one that looks "blown" as I've heard discussed here.
Little to no smoke with load, just a sharp crack when fired. Group is not the best. Hoping that will change in time.

1- Just received some TOW mink oil tallow in the tin. My question is that since I've not used a patch lube before, how to apply it to the patch material. Sounds dumb I know. Should I rub it into one side only of the patching material ? Which I think ir correct. Will a light coating be sufficient ? Then I could cut the patching into shorter pieces, place in a tin I have and be ready to go.

2- Regarding the blown patching. I'm hoping the lube will help this. Also, I could switch to a .495 ball for next year. Would it still benefit my rifle to scotch brite the muzzle and barrel ?

3- As it stands I'm shooting a 5 in. group from a good rest. Not a newbie to rifles or the bench. Handloader for 45 years, high power cpometitor. Just FYI.

4- Yup, there is vision difficulties at my age. Likely will put on a wide front sight at some point. Also likely I would love to get a short barrel rifle kit. Like 32". In flint.

Thanks for your input. I appreciate the help I get and put it to good use. Only one change at a time here. Patching and lube first. I'll be able to read my targets and adjust the powder.
But first I must get Brad and Shane's Yorktown to group much tighter.

Thanks again for your help.

Well like you I’m kinda new to flintlocks.You should be able to cloverleaf at 50 yards when you get your powder and patch dialed in its taken me about 7 months of trying different combinations to get me to get a consistent group at 50 yards.My eyes are not worth a dang with open sights but i have learned to compisate for that.I have asked a lot of questions and have gotten great advice on this site.I started with pillow and mattress ticking different thickness and I have tried all types of patch lube,my rifle seems to like bees wax and Cisco I have also tried mink oil,dish soap and just plain old spit.I have good results with 70 grain of powder and a bees way and Cisco pillow tick patch.I hold a 2 inch group not bad for not being able to see the target at 50 yards.I have learned to be consistent with the patch lube a little dryer or weater makes a difference.nice to see another PA shooter in in NE PA.

 

[dlgcrosstimbers]

I don't have the experience some of these crusty old mountain men here do, but I'll lightly toss this out there anyhow...

I use TOW Mink Oil for hunting patch lube also. I like it, or rather my rifles like it. I take a patch, swirl it around a bit on the cake (a little less if its warm out and the cake is soft, or a little more if its cold out and the cake is hard). One side only. Then when I get some smeared on the patch, I fold it and rub it good between my thumb and index finger to work the lube into the patch material, which also pushes excess to the edges of the patch, then rake excess off. It works for me thus far, or I should say my rifles are shooting well with the technique / Mink Oil.

My next venture will be to try the semi-dry patch lube technique with using a 7/1 Water-Ballistol mix, soaking strips of pillow ticking, then letting it air dry (semi-dry). Curious to see if my rifles do well with it or not.

 

[Rat]

Just recently I tried a different lube in my .62", and noticed my patches were "blowing" real bad. So of course I returned to ground zero/my previous lube, but before I did, I put two felt wads under the ball, instead of one, and the patches came out perfect. So, just for fun and extra insurance, might try two wads under the ball. ?? Just a thought. Had the same experience with a .58 I picked up recently, it was blowing patches, added the second wad and no more blown patches. Some would say that if you NEED two wads, something is not right, and they would be right, but it works for a quick fix. The crack is good. Means you are exceeding the speed of sound/1100 fps. Also, if patches are blowing, trying different lubes is where I start to fix it. And of course if you can use a thicker patch that will help. On #2, I'd go with a thicker patch, rather than a larger ball.

 

[Grenadier1758]

You have good information for the short term.

By all means concentrate on getting close to the game and pass up on the longer range shots at distances that you don't feel comfortable.

A note for the future for number 4, putting on a wider front sight. You will have to widen the opening for the rear sight to allow light to show around the front sight. If you don't, then all you have is a black blob obscuring the target.

 

[GriscomRun]

Thanks for your feedback. I like them all. Especially helpful from Flintlock Bob. I plan to retry this when the weather turns in springtime. I do understand about my front sight issue. I, like others, have difficulty seeing the front sight. I learned from a female competitor on the National Match Course ( High-power Rifles ) that she switched from the NM .062 front sight to a battle sight and she noted a marked improvement in scoring. I'm out of that competition now but need to see the front for accurate shooting. As the human eye is the actual sight, the mechanical devices we all uses are merely to help in alignment. The eye and shooting will tell us where and how to deal with elevation and windage. I did this on a very inexpensive kit long ago and the technique works just fine for older eyes. Of course, then there is the idea of a shorter rifle barrel too.
Thanks for your helpful suggestions.
And a Merry dose of Seasons Greetings to all.

 

[Sparkitoff]

I have previously used SPG lube on the .018 pillow ticking but I rubbed the patch on the lube (while the lube was in the tin) on both sides. It worked very well. The person guiding me at the time thought that by lubing the patch on both sides it further deterred patch burning. I don't know about mink oil tallow. Is it as thick as SPG - almost like a wax? How you get it on the patch is probably less important than how much you put on it and whether or not you lube both sides. I have since found perfection with the dry-lube type treatment (7:1 water to ballistol). I think lubing both sides is easy and can't hurt.

 

[Rifleman1776]

You are on the right track. Ticking with mink oil lube is used successfully by many. It should work for you with, at least, 'minute of deer' results. Don't overthink the situation. Lube one side, load, kill. Enjoy.

 

[Rat]

No matter where you lube the patch, for hunting it's going to saturate the patch before you fire it, so yeah, don't really matter. I usually do both sides. I'll have to try SPG, I have a bunch I use in my unmentionable #10 black powder guns. Sometimes a door, can be a trap, if you know what I mean. I tried a coconut oil, bee's wax mix, and it did not do well. It did smell good. Wonder Lube works good for me, but it's a bit thinner than I'd like. I'd like to find something a bit more waxy that shoots good. Or not. Have never tried mink oil, have a bunch of that too.

 

[hanshi]

Mink oil is great lube for hunting. I rub the patch on the cake and work it in with my thumb. The lube side is against the sides of the bore. Ticking works well although I patch with much thicker material. And yes; putting a wad under the prb normally stops any burning or cutting. At that point the only cutting will be from the crown, unless it's smoothed with sandpaper.

 

[Greenjoytj]

I use a 58 cal wool wad that I’ve dipped in melted TOTW mink oil as an over powder wad in my 54 cal GPR. I cut out round tight weave cotton patches and soak them in a 7:1 water ballistol oil mix the let them dry for a few days. I cast a tight ball .535” and use a tight patch with the lubed wad. This combination is quite hard to start into the muzzle but I get a great cloth weave pattern all around the ball, heavily embossed on the lands and lighter in the grooves. Bench rested the rifle shoots this very accurately.

 

[Rat]

Well....sure love my coned muzzle for hunting. Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[EC121]

I swipe the patches across the mink oil/ non-hardening coconut oil mixture on one side. Then put them in an Altoids tin and let them sit until needed. They saturate through sitting in the tin but don't get sloppy oily. I mix the coconut oil in the mink oil to soften it some. In my Rice barrel I use .487 balls and a .022" or a bit more patch to seal the round bottomed grooves and load easier in the field.

 

[RHensley]

Mink oil tallow is a good lube in cold weather. How ever if it's very warm outside I've found that it gets kind of soft and messy. Like others here I've tried many different lubes. I've settled on Lambs tallow and bees wax mix. I also use deer tallow that I make. I pre-cut the patches and melt the tallow. dip the patches in it and when the tallow sets up I scrap the excess off and store the patch in a tin. I get no blow through . This makes reloading in the field hunting quicker when the second shot is called for. I use a 530 round ball with .018 bed ticking patch. I use 100 grains XX Goex . Off the bench the sights are set at 100 yds. I group about 4 inch group. Off hand I shoot no further than 50 to 60 yds. I prefer to brace against a tree or use sticks when I can. Deer tallow is fairly easy to make yourself and quite effective.

 

[Rifleman1776]

In my Rice barrel I use .487 balls

Curious ball size there. What is the nominal bore size of your rifle supposed to be? I have a .50 cal. Rice barreled rifle coming. Is there a chance I will need to use a ball smaller than .490"?

 

[Rat]

As every barrel is a law unto it's self, unless the first ball and patch combo you try hits the nail on the head, so to speak, you will probably want to, or have to, try two different balls sizes, and the same with the patches.

 

[Rifleman1776]

As every barrel is a law unto it's self, unless the first ball and patch combo you try hits the nail on the head, so to speak, you will probably want to, or have to, try two different balls sizes, and the same with the patches.

Thanks, I well understand that. Half century ml'er here. But, a manufacturer like Rice, I would expect, would put out a barrel of consistent size. We will see. I already have a ton (well, almost ;-) ) of .490" and .495" balls cast up waiting for trials. Plan to test with .015" ticking and thicker denim. Not going to screw around with different lubes though. I'll stick with whale oil/beeswax and peanut oil/beeswax. Both give identical results for me.

 

[Ketchakah]

I use spit.
if long term loading, a extremely light oil can help. But i almost seem to think that because i don't clean all the oils out of the barrel, It sort of self-lubes. But then that is just a thought.

 

[Rifleman1776]

I use spit.
if long term loading, a extremely light oil can help. But i almost seem to think that because i don't clean all the oils out of the barrel, It sort of self-lubes. But then that is just a thought.

Mike that notion is a carry over from some very imaginative, but incorrect, advertising put out by a commercial lube company. They said you could "season" your barrel with their stuff. Pure hooey. Actually, the hooey would probably do a better job. I suggest you clean your rifle very carefully then protect the bore for storage with something like oil. But do clean that out before loading for hunting.