Need new sights — Kensight maybe?

[TGJaeger]

In 1978, my brother built a T/C Hawken rifle. He shot it a bunch at the local range and when he passed about 15 years ago the rifle was passed on to me. I was going to make it a keepsake/safe queen, but his widow wanted it shot as it was intended. I took it to our local clubs monthly shoot and without any sight adjustments or load development I won several flights and overall aggregate….well, I began using it for every thing. Long story short, I’ve shot it a lot.
This summer I started shooting it more and more poorly. The bullets would strike low and right …and lower and further right..and so on and so forth. Eventually I ran out of sight adjustments. Using a brass punch and a little farmer minded re-engineering I re-sighted the rifle so it shot the target below.

At our clubs 3 day fall shoot, last month, i first shot the 25 yard 5 bull target and got five “9 rings”. But, by the time I shot the 100 yard targets I was completely off the target.

I’ve never heard of a sight wearing out but I've lost faith in this one. I have another new one just like it, but I have heard good things about the Kensight XP100 rear sight. Anyone have any experience with these sights? The dimensions indicate that the swap should be relatively easy?

Thanks for any and all help and opinions.

 

[bubba.50]

I would look to the stock for wood shrinkage, warping, looseness in the barrel channel, fit to the tang etc, etc to see why it's changed that much.

 

[TGJaeger]

Hey Bubba,
Thanks for the suggestion, but the wood has all been ‘glass bedded and there aren’t any gaps or changes that I can find with a 2X loupe…sigh…maybe a good time to retire the old girl.

 

[chorizo]

See if you are getting lead (or some kind of) build up. Starts out fine then gets progressively worse the more you shoot, so something is changing, while you shoot.

She just might need a damn good scrubbing to get any build up out.

Of course, I haven't seen the gun or the bore in question, so this advice might only be worth the few trons I burned typing it! LOL

 

[TGJaeger]

chorizo,
A friendly chat is worth the inconveniencing of a handful of electrons anytime. The bore was cleaned down to bare metal and treated with Dyna-Tek ceramic some years ago and it still glows like crystal. If the bore or bedding was the cause, I think that the groups would open up more. They don’t. They just migrate on the target. But then I’ve been guilty of wrong thinking before.

 

[longcruise]

Any chance the present sight is loose?

Have you changed patching?

Lube?

Ball size?

Have your eyes gotten any older?

 

[chorizo]

chorizo,
A friendly chat is worth the inconveniencing of a handful of electrons anytime. The bore was cleaned down to bare metal and treated with Dyna-Tek ceramic some years ago and it still glows like crystal. If the bore or bedding was the cause, I think that the groups would open up more. They don’t. They just migrate on the target. But then I’ve been guilty of wrong thinking before.

Thanks. I suggested this because I had a gun that groups would migrate as close to the muzzle crap would accumulate.. They wouldn't open up... Just move.. So you have eliminated the bedding, eliminated the bore.. I believe you are right in your trouble shooting sequence to suspect something mechanical.... The sights. If she still groups, then she still has life in her... Something is shifting and not randomly

 

[TGJaeger]

longcruise,

Have your eyes gotten any older?

Now that’s just mean ….bring up old age to an old man - shame on you! I’ve been trying to avoid that one because I was afraid of the answer.

Actually, the eyes seem to be holding up pretty well. My other muzzleloaders and iron sighted BPCR rifles all shoot okay for me.

And, yessir I’ve checked everything for tightness…the sight does seem to “give” a bit of movement to the right, every 8-10 shots. Which is why I’m thinking of getting the Kensight.

Thanks

 

[yonderin]

As longcruise asked; have you changed ball size or patching? Can you confirm that your patching hasn't changed in thickness from the nominal, even if still from the same source?

 

[BruceHH]

I have built many rifles with that Kensight sight. I have shot many matches with the same and have sold quite a few builds that had it. I highly recommend it. Now as too wether or not the screw holes line up w/ a TC - I don't know as I always drilled/tapped mine into new barrels. I recommend you get the .032 wide gap and open it up as needed. Also, be prepared to possibly need a taller front sight if yours has been filed down much.

Now that we have that answered. If you can, get a one size smaller (45) caliber jag on your rod and cut some Scotch Brite pads (green or maroon) into about 1" - 1 1/4" or so square size and run them up and down your bore. If there is any type of build up it will take care of that. You are not going to hurt the bore.

 

[Boomerang]

I take it that you are shooting off of a bench and not free-hand when you are sighting it in?

 

[1BadDart]

Have you looked at it with a borescope? Particularly after a shooting session.

 

[tenngun]

Have your eyes gotten any older?

I sure don’t shoot as well now as I did thirty years ago. Still use v and blade and fine bead but it ain’t sharp and some modifications may be in my future

 

[TGJaeger]

yonderin, the patches are from TOW and I just checked with a few left-overs from last year. Seemed to be about all alike. They are a tight fit. Lube has always been Bore Butter.

Boomerang, I really wish I could shoot groups like that offhand! Nope, i sight in off a heavy bench rest with sand bags.

1BadDart, Love your avatar photo. I assume that is a 340 c.i. Had one like it long, long ago. Nope, no borescope available

tenngun, Again with the age thing …!
My Chambers English Sporting Rifle has the “express” shallow “V” and ivory bead arrangement which works very well. I love it for hunting but targets are a bit of a challenge after 50 yards.

Thank you all for your comments and suggestions! I really do appreciate them…the ones about my advancing years and declining physical abilities…meh!…it is what it is!

 

[TGJaeger]

BruceHH,

Thank you for your comments on your experience and preference with this sight. Much appreciated!

I know these sights are not HC but as someone said earlier, we have to do, what we have to do, if we want to stay in the game!

 

[beardedhorse]

Fixed sights don't wear out. Eyes do. The Thompson Center rear sight is adjustable for elevation and windage. There is a spring (coil) that keeps pressure on the hinged leaf whether express or V notch. A good gunsmith might be able to take it apart and see if you need a new spring. Eye relief from the tang to the rear sight might need installing the rear sight closer to the muzzle.

 

[Dutch7]

You say this is a hawken? Is this a flint or percussion ignition, don't think that info is given?
If it is a flint, and this is a long shot, but I had a very accurate target rifle that started tossing rounds all over and one of my shooting partners noticed powder in the snow where I was loading. He thought I was spilling the charge, I wasn't but the reason for the powder was the touchhole was burnt out and when I seated the ball a portion of the charge was being expelled out the touchhole. I put a patch in the pan and closed the frizzen the rest of the match and back on dead center shot placement. The next time I shot it had a new liner and zero problems since!
Its worth a look for a worn out liner (if its a flint).

 

[nhmoose]

Do you wipe? What's your lube? Flint or percussion? Change the nipple?

Not being clairvoyant My cars running bad what's the problem?

So Not enough information to take even a swag

 

[renegadehunter]

I'm by no means trying to start an argument, and I know some absolutely swear by it, but what about bore butter build up against the rifling? There's been many a thread about people saying they've found it to build up in the bore over time and eventually start impacting accuracy.
I won't bore you with a long write up of my own experience and cleaning method when I was using BB, but I will say that some of it chars into a really hard crust and sits against the rifling. It was not all being removed when I cleaned by bucket of water method and then patches wet with BP solvent, multiple nylon brush passes, and then dry patch passes. I could do that for an hour and the patch following the nylon brush strokes would come out dirty every single time. It was multiple, multiple shooting/cleaning sessions after I completely stopped putting BB in the bore before I finally got it all out and no longer had the above problem.

You say the bore is ceramic coated and "glows like a crystal". Is that by just looking with a bore light down the bore? Mine looked the same with just a bore light. A bore scope would definitively determine if there is built up BB crust sitting against the rifling. Perhaps some passes with 0000 steel wool, but I don't know if that is safe with ceramic coating.
Just my shot in the dark from behind a computer screen anyway.

 

[longcruise]

Change the nipple?

Thats a good suggestion. Nipples burn out.